Semi - Feral Momma I'm conflicted

[Whenallhellbreakslose]

I never held a cat I was going to release more than 3 weeks. Some cats fall to pieces in captivity. I had a just tnred male cat who would not eat or drink, but was otherwise healthy. My rule was I release the kitty after they ate, so if they decide to lay low for awhile that got a meal into them first. I held this cat a day past his release date because he wouldn't eat. I was concerned. I was told by a more experience tnr Person at the time, that it us not uncommon for ferals to stop eating in captivity and if he looked healthy otherwise, than to release him. I did just that and he got back to his old self in no time. Some cats just do so poorly when trapped or crated, it just the way it is.

 

[CatladyJan]

I never held a cat I was going to release more than 3 weeks. Some cats fall to pieces in captivity. I had a just tnred male cat who would not eat or drink, but was otherwise healthy. My rule was I release the kitty after they ate, so if they decide to lay low for awhile that got a meal into them first. I held this cat a day past his release date because he wouldn't eat. I was concerned. I was told by a more experience tnr Person at the time, that it us not uncommon for ferals to stop eating in captivity and if he looked healthy otherwise, than to release him. I did just that a mb d he got back to his old self in no time. Some cats just do so poorly when trapped or crated, it just the way it is.

if she doesn’t do well in the building i’ll Have to hope she goes into the trap. Sometimes we do what we think is best for them, but it’s not.

I know they usually hide but do they ever attack when let out of a crate into a room?

 

[fionasmom]

I agree that you should take precautions. When I release a feral from a trap after having them TNRed I always wear a padded type jacket, gloves, and some eye covering. Nothing has ever happened but it does concern me that one could flip back at me. Position yourself, even awkwardly, so you are not in the line of fire. I always release traps from the back and not with the cat exiting toward me.

This could be one of those cases where you have done all that you can do. We all have those cats in our pasts who were much more wildlife than cats, or cats as we expect them to be.

 

[Whenallhellbreakslose]

if she doesn’t do well in the building i’ll Have to hope she goes into the trap. Sometimes we do what we think is best for them, but it’s not.

I know they usually hide but do they ever attack when let out of a crate into a room?

I wouldn't advise you to release her in the room to trap her, that could backfire big time. Here is a video to help you with that issue.

 

[CatladyJan]

I wouldn't advise you to release her in the room to trap her, that could backfire big time. Here is a video to help you with that issue.

Great video. So how else can I give her a chance outside the crate? I figured if she doesn’t do well I would just set up a trap in the outbuilding?

 

[Whenallhellbreakslose]

Great video. So how else can I give her a chance outside the crate? I figured if she doesn’t do well I would just set up a trap in the outbuilding?

It is a huge risk letting her out in the outbuilding, you may not be able to trap her. She may have become trap wise and you are now stuck with a cat you can't trap. Also, she may act up and scratch and bite you.

I have transferred cats to and from trap to crate. It is much easier from trap to crate than the other way around. You will definitely need someone to help you with this. I had a medium crate I used and what I did was put a covered trap(with the back opened & facing the crate's enterance.) Then I had to put stuff in the back and top of trap for stability (it is best to put it right up against a wall.) The gap around and above the crate enterance had to be blocked off (we used whatever material we had available, also had a towel available to partial cover the crate enterance. ) Before we did all that, we used multiple trap dividers to confine the cat to the back part of the crate until we were ready for the transfer. I had to gently prod the cat to get into the trap. In the worse cases it took over 5 minutes of hisses and posturing, but the cats ran in the trap and it closed. Be quick with sliding the the trap door down and hook it right away.

Please be careful when you do all this. I hope it works out okay for you. Take another look at that video I sent earlier, it may present a better way of doing this than what I mentioned here. Best of luck.

 

[CatladyJan]

It is a huge risk letting her out in the outbuilding, you may not be able to trap her. She may have become trap wise and you are now stuck with a cat you can't trap. Also, she may act up and scratch and bite you.

I have transferred cats to and from trap to crate. It is much easier from trap to crate than the other way around. You will definitely need someone to help you with this. I had a medium crate I used and what I did was put a covered trap(with the back opened & facing the crate's enterance.) Then I had to put stuff in the back and top of trap for stability (it is best to put it right up against a wall.) The gap around and above the crate enterance had to be blocked off (we used whatever material we had available, also had a towel available to partial cover the crate enterance. ) Before we did all that, we used multiple trap dividers to confine the cat to the back part of the crate until we were ready for the transfer. I had to gently prod the cat to get into the trap. In the worse cases it took over 5 minutes of hisses and posturing, but the cats ran in the trap and it closed. Be quick with sliding the the trap door down and hook it right away.

Please be careful when you do all this. I hope it works out okay for you. Take another look at that video I sent earlier, it may present a better way of doing this than what I mentioned here. Best of luck.

I thought the plan was to see if she did ok in the outbuilding before releasing her for good.

 

[Whenallhellbreakslose]

I thought the plan was to see if she did ok in the outbuilding before releasing her for good.

If you are talking post spay surgery, than yes. You must keep an eye on her and see she is not bleeding or have any infection or anything else going on. You can't let this cat out in the out building because as mentioned you don't know how she would behave. Also, she may escape from there.

If you completely given up on the idea of socializing her, than when she has recovered it is time to let her go. She needs to be transferred back into the trap and released.

If you still want to socialize her. Then you must begin while she is in the crate for your safety. Try working on her not seeing you as a threat. Make yourself small to her by sitting or squatting down. Talk to her in a soft voice. Try this to start with.

Remember, some cats are too feral and would become very depressed in captivity. Also, there is a condition known as Cage Rage. Some cats are just better off outside.

 

[CatladyJan]

If you are talking post spay surgery, than yes. You must keep an eye on her and see she is not bleeding or have any infection or anything else going on. You can't let this cat out in the out building because as mentioned you don't know how she would behave. Also, she may escape from there.

If you completely given up on the idea of socializing her, than when she has recovered it is time to let her go. She needs to be transferred back into the trap and released.

If you still want to socialize her. Then you must begin while she is in the crate for your safety. Try working on her not seeing you as a threat. Make yourself small to her by sitting or squatting down. Talk to her in a soft voice. Try this to start with.

Remember, some cats are too feral and would become very depressed in captivity. Also, there is a condition known as Cage Rage. Some cats are just better off outside.

Originally I was going to keep her in the outbuilding until Spring which meant I was going to let her out of the crate then reread her then.

She has been doing well with me blinking at me but this morning she was not so.

I cannot socialize her because I still have 7 kittens needing homes.

 

[moxiewild]

I would give her a few more days in the crate. Work with her if you can - and by that, I mean just simply spending time in the room on your phone, laptop, reading, TV, whatever, and just ignoring her otherwise. Maybe exchange some blinks now and then.

I would not freak out too much over a one time reaction. If anything, if she does it again, then it actually concerns me that perhaps something is wrong health-wise or with the incision for her to suddenly lash out like that.

But give her a few days.

In the meantime, measure the opening of the crate, and make a cardboard "shield" (I make a handle out of 2-3 zip ties... kind of hard to explain, but I can make an example real quick if you need it!). I've had to do this with a few cats, but especially small to small-medium dogs. I wouldn't use it right away so that you can see whether she even tries to do it again or not, but have it ready just in case.

Then after a few days, reassess.

The risk of keeping her in the outbuilding is that you will not ever be able to return her to where you trapped her. You will have to release her at your place, as she will have forgotten her old territory and you will be highly unlikely to find someone else to take her. So whether she does good in the outbuilding or not, you have to decide whether you are prepared for that.

I have released hundreds of ferals, and I've never had one attack me. And if Momma had wanted to attack you when she lunged, she would have, and could have. So it is promising that she didn't. It seems very scary to us, and we should certainly pay closer attention when they do that, but it is ultimately a very stern warning to keep your distance.

I just recently TNR'd a cat that was relentless about hissing, lunging/charging, spitting, etc, any time I tended to the trap. We had to keep him for four days due to crappy weather, and it was just constant. I hate sudden noises due to sensory issues so I struggle when they act like this. My boyfriend is the definition of laid back and will take on the feeding/cleaning duties when they're like that and just laugh it off - but even he ended up a little shook up coming out of the room after feeding and cleaning, which has only happened with a small handful of cats before. Hell, even when we picked kitty up after surgery the tech made a comment about him being "umm... very, very unhappy right now" lol.

But when it came time to release, he did as most ferals do. He stayed near the back of the trap, and we had to tap on it a bit to get him out, and then he took off. Just like all the "aggressive" ferals before him.

I really wouldn't worry about it, and honestly, if a cat did attack after release, I would assume they are either not feral, or something is wrong with them (injury, illness). Wearing protective gear never hurts, but it's not something you should be overly preoccupied with!

You are doing a really great job!

And I will also echo what others have said - sometimes, doing all we can, is all we can do. You've done your part to help this individual cat, and to contribute to ending cat overpopulation in your area. And that's more than 99% of other people. So if you have to return her back to where you found her, please do not think you've let her down. You've given her a better life and a better chance of survival no matter what you ultimately do.

 

[CatladyJan]

I would give her a few more days in the crate. Work with her if you can - and by that, I mean just simply spending time in the room on your phone, laptop, reading, TV, whatever, and just ignoring her otherwise. Maybe exchange some blinks now and then.

I would not freak out too much over a one time reaction. If anything, if she does it again, then it actually concerns me that perhaps something is wrong health-wise or with the incision for her to suddenly lash out like that.

But give her a few days.

She seemed much better this evening than this morning.

The risk of keeping her in the outbuilding is that you will not ever be able to return her to where you trapped her. You will have to release her at your place, as she will have forgotten her old territory and you will be highly unlikely to find someone else to take her. So whether she does good in the outbuilding or not, you have to decide whether you are prepared for that.

That's what I was trying to initially ask and apparently there was some miscommunication in this thread, but that happens.
I did want to wait a couple of weeks until she was fully healed but wondered if it would be okay to keep her safe and dry over winter and my understanding was that would be a good idea. I started this thread because I had read what you just said that she will forget her territory

I really wouldn't worry about it, and honestly, if a cat did attack after release, I would assume they are either not feral, or something is wrong with them (injury, illness). Wearing protective gear never hurts, but it's not something you should be overly preoccupied with!

My concern was if I let her free in my outbuilding that she might attack me when I go out.

You are doing a really great job!

Thanks you!

 

[moxiewild]

She seemed much better this evening than this morning.



That's what I was trying to initially ask and apparently there was some miscommunication in this thread, but that happens.
I did want to wait a couple of weeks until she was fully healed but wondered if it would be okay to keep her safe and dry over winter and my understanding was that would be a good idea. I started this thread because I had read what you just said that she will forget her territory




My concern was if I let her free in my outbuilding that she might attack me when I go out.

Thanks you!

That’s great that she was better!

I apologize that I didn’t see your tag earlier! Yes, I actually wondered if I was reading your question wrong because of some of the responses, lol.

It’s between the 3-6 week mark that they begin to forget their territory and associate wherever they currently are as “theirs”. So anything beyond that time frame is a big risk, although it works if it’s at the same location their caretaker lives, because even from outside they can detect things that smell like you and other now-familiar scents.

Keeping her for a whole season would be way too much to just expect her to remember the place she was trapped.

I have socialized a lot of ferals and held them for medical recoveries that were too long to be held in a trap or crate, including aggressive ones, so had to release them into a room.

Give them enough places to hide (including some elevated spots), and it won’t be a problem.

Animals (particularly those smaller than you) do not want to fight. They’re afraid of you, their instinct is to flee. They typically only fight when cornered (where they have no other options) or if they are ill.

I work with wildlife (and they are a lot more “aggressive” for the most part!), and this is pretty consistent across species. Give them a hide and leave them alone, and they leave you alone.

In a crate, it can be difficult for an animal to feel like they’re being left alone or like they’re not corned just because of the lack of space. It puts you much closer to them than you would need to be in a room or out building.

You’re highly unlikely to experience the same thing when she has more area to flee to and you aren’t being forced to push her spacial boundary just to take care of essentials.

 

[CatladyJan]

That’s great that she was better!

I apologize that I didn’t see your tag earlier! Yes, I actually wondered if I was reading your question wrong because of some of the responses, lol.

It’s between the 3-6 week mark that they begin to forget their territory and associate wherever they currently are as “theirs”. So anything beyond that time frame is a big risk, although it works if it’s at the same location their caretaker lives, because even from outside they can detect things that smell like you and other now-familiar scents.

Keeping her for a whole season would be way too much to just expect her to remember the place she was trapped.

I have socialized a lot of ferals and held them for medical recoveries that were too long to be held in a trap or crate, including aggressive ones, so had to release them into a room.

Give them enough places to hide (including some elevated spots), and it won’t be a problem.

Animals (particularly those smaller than you) do not want to fight. They’re afraid of you, their instinct is to flee. They typically only fight when cornered (where they have no other options) or if they are ill.

I work with wildlife (and they are a lot more “aggressive” for the most part!), and this is pretty consistent across species. Give them a hide and leave them alone, and they leave you alone.

In a crate, it can be difficult for an animal to feel like they’re being left alone or like they’re not corned just because of the lack of space. It puts you much closer to them than you would need to be in a room or out building.

You’re highly unlikely to experience the same thing when she has more area to flee to and you aren’t being forced to push her spacial boundary just to take care of essentials.

Yes, I wasn't sure at first everyone knew what I was asking I started feeling confused at some of the responses (of which I'm very grateful for).

I'm feeling sorry for her being cooped up in a crate, she was free and now she is confined to a small space which I put a stool in for her to look out the window.

You said you have had to release some in a room, so where you able to trap them again?

She has been in the crate for 15 days.

Also, I just wanted to clarify that I don't think she has a 'caregiver' I think she is a neighborhood cat that for whatever reason came to my place of work to have her kittens.

My understanding of protocol is she needs to be outside of the building for 3 weeks to adapt to the area around my home, is that correct?

Thanks.

 

[fionasmom]

One point about retrapping....let's say that she lives in the outbuilding for a while. I have retrapped cats into humane traps, but some really do seem to remember the trap and be very hesitant. Most recent is a TNRed female (not by me) who was retrapped by me and taken to my vet to be fixed where we found out that she was already fixed. She was very hungry and I baited the trap with KFC.

If you could condition this cat to eat in a carrier it might be possible to shut the door behind her when you finally want to move her. She will have had plenty of time to get used to eating there and you would not have to retrap exactly.

My side door garage is always open as the ferals have beds in there and I don't monitor who goes and comes and nothing destructive has ever happened.

 

[CatladyJan]

moxiewild Whenallhellbreakslose fionasmom Jcatbird Furballsmom

Today is day 17 in captivity and I'm very sick with at least a sinus infection. I finally moved the kittens indoors
and they have plenty of other cats here to help me finish socialization.

I was able to give Momma Mia (her new name) room today and clean up safely.

I just happened to have the purrfect side piece of plywood to do the magic trick of moving the covers and I walk out of the building and she moves to the other crate and then in goes the plywood. She has a clean warm bed, her stool too look out the window and her food and litter box are in the other crate.

 

[fionasmom]

You have done a lot of work to make her comfortable! I hope that you feel better and recover from your sinus infection.

 

[CatladyJan]

UPDATE: I've talked with some locals and although I made her a shelter from a storage bin I'm trying to get an insulated pet house or an Igloo for cheap from FB Marketplace. I think she is more likely to go into one of those with a wider opening and put the straw in there.

The temps will be in the upper 40's during the day and 20-30's at night so it's not terribly cold.

I'm going to try putting the small carrier in her cage and hopefully and safely get her in there and release her when I return to work.

 

[CatladyJan]

Momma Mia is going to be released in about a half and hour!

 

[CatladyJan]

She ran like a bat out of ...