Raw Meat -Why you should not feed them raw stuff

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bianco maple

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Till the day before I fed my cat raw veal minced double with all fat removed- Fed it Raw chopped chicken liver-He loved it-Then when we took him to the vet as he was not pooping ( fur ball problem) I mentioned it to the vet He said 'NO do  not feed it anything raw' and below were his comments

He said-- Yes in the wild animals do eat things raw, but then the big cats they kill and eat it immediately- 

The ones who scavange on this raw meat their life spans are limited

bacteria and toxology or somethiing to that effect he said, is very likely to happen and his blood can get contaminated

Cook it even for 5 minutes No more raw feeding for a indoor domestic cat with pedigree

Guys

I am just passing this info down to you all- thanks for reading
 

mschauer

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Thank you for your concern but this kind of information from a vet is nothing new to most raw feeders. A little research shows there is another side to the story, one that supports raw feeding, that we find more convincing.
 
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arlyn

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Raw is actually the best diet, but, it does take research and dedication.

It isn't for everyone, and it isn't simply a matter of giving them a bowl of meat.

Not surprising your vet would tell you these things though, as your average vet really doesn't get much training in nutrition beyond basics, generally sponsored by a pet food company.

For the record, I do not feed raw except as a once a week treat.
 
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bianco maple

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Thanks for the feed back- Presently I am in a foreign country! and as my Bianco was having this problem, I just thought maybe I was not doing what was right by him as he's a healthy young cat! and if it was the raw chicken liver that also clogged him up etc I was not sure! Personally I also think the way you guys do, but therecould be a  lot of contamination in the stuff U get here! that I felt its best to avoid it if I can, till I am back home where I can be SURE of the quality of meat etc we get here

Thanks anyways I sure appreciate your input.
 

ducman69

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Raw feeding is controversial, and yes the American Veterinary Association also does not support raw feeding at this time.   The statement is correct, cats in the wild are eating meat that has been dead for a matter of minutes to hours.    Raw feeding is eating meat from animals typically in poor health conditions (see chicken/turkey farm videos) that has been dead for days and more importantly may have touched surfaces during industrial raw meat processing that are constantly reused and thus may be contaminated if not properly cleaned.   The FDA warns for example that up to 25% of commercial chicken should be expected to be contaminated with salmonella, and thus recommends minimum internal cooking temps before consumption. Proponents argue that a healthy cat has a strong enough immune system to deal with quite a lot of bacteria, and since many cats on this forum are fed raw and not ill that would seem to be proof.    Some vets will tell you though that they have seen how raw can go wrong, whether fed an incomplete or inappropriate diet or when perhaps immune compromised and becomes ill.   Then again, there are also cats that have become ill from contaminated cooked commercial food, and there is a reason that there are commercial recalls.  Personally, I prefer commercial food for my own convenience and safety and peace of mind that a regulating body is monitoring the micro and macro nutrients in the diet and at least attempting to ensure it is not contaminated.

BTW, I'm sure you know, but you don't want to feed a cat cooked meat either without supplementation.  Cooking the meat destroys not just bacteria but some nutrients in the meat, such as taurine, that cats need.  Commercial food cooks the meat, but then adds in taurine and other ingredients to ensure a complete and balanced healthy meal. 
 
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mschauer

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Thanks for the feed back- Presently I am in a foreign country! and as my Bianco was having this problem, I just thought maybe I was not doing what was right by him as he's a healthy young cat! and if it was the raw chicken liver that also clogged him up etc I was not sure! Personally I also think the way you guys do, but therecould be a  lot of contamination in the stuff U get here! that I felt its best to avoid it if I can, till I am back home where I can be SURE of the quality of meat etc we get here

Thanks anyways I sure appreciate your input.
Actually too much liver can cause diarrhea not constipation. The hairballs you mention are more likely to have caused constipation.

When you get back home do some research and make up your own mind. There is plenty of online information about feeding raw diets to pets. Learn about both sides of the issue and decide for yourself.

I hope Bianco is feeling better. A friend of mine recently had a cat clogged with hairballs. One day on a laxative and he was much better!
 

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Since my older dog, Wilbur, a Jack Russel Terrier has become very finicky, I have started to offer raw food. Stella and Chewey's to be specific. Both the raw meats and the freeze-dried raw. My cat's have gone crazy for the raw too. So I started offering my cat's the same brand. They now get one meal a day raw and are doing quite well with it. So far I am really happy with the Stella/Chewey's raw diets :bigthumb:
 

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It only makes sense that the diet an animal is biologically designed to thrive on is going to be the most nutritionally sound and healthy diet for that animal. A raw animal-based diet is, obviously then, the healthiest one we can provide our obligatorily carnivorous cats. That such a diet needs to be "balanced" is, of course, as much a given in a raw diet as it is in any other one - commercial or otherwise.

There is now so much information available on raw feeding that even a little research will yield reputable information on the benefits and methods, pros and cons.

Those who home-prepare their cats' foods generally do so because of the superb control over both the quality and make-up of the ingredients, not to mention the reduced costs, but raw feeding isn't limited to do-it-yourself models; you can feed commercial or home-prepared or any mix of the two. Commercial foods are usually ground and frozen within a very short period of time, and some varieties now come with pathogen-free guarantees to ease consumer minds.

There are so many ways to feed raw today that anyone interested in it should be able to find one that fits their lifestyle and resources.

AC
 
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bianco maple

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My Heartfelt thanks to each one of you , for taking the time to respond to my post and my concerns-

Surprisingly I am totally on the same page, I do believe that when meat or fish is cooked it looses its nutrients and if the meat or raw foods one buys and its from a source that is fresh, its more beneficial to the animal that commercial foods-

I think I will avoid the chicken liver over here as it comes frozen but the veal is really fresh and not packaged meat- The butcher gives it to me by carving it from the huge carcass! but I will give this just once a week, he so enjoys it!!!!

Now as for Bianco, I give him on a daily basis the vet approved Lax that helps with the fur balls, and after doing some research , a cod liver oil capsule every 4 days, and now my husband has bought wild Alaskan salmon oil cap!( he gets it when he does his trips to the US-He tried to get the mycrolax the enema that the vet had used, the Lactulose but they said YOU need to bring the animal here as its on prescription!Here the  vet charged me a whopping amount for the stuff!

Where in the US can one buy these ,from a pharmacy? Any info will be greatly appreciated-he flies often to the US and Europe.If there is some online site that sells it , that info also will be welcomed-Thanks.

Bianco has been a little better in going to the litter tray, in the past few days but his eating habits are still not that normal-Because he is a bit overweight , and eats his indoor cat kibbles( bought from the Vet) Royal Canin Brand I am not that perturbed as hes quite playful . alert and normal in ever other sense-We plan to now get the one for Persian cats , this has some stuff that helps to get the fur ball situation undet control, the vet said it should work fine for him.

MY dear friends of catsite THANKS once again and love to all your furry loves from Bianco and me
 

ducman69

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Quote:
It only makes sense that the diet an animal is biologically designed to thrive on is going to be the most nutritionally sound and healthy diet for that animal.
Modern athletes and body builders have found that scientific advancements in nutrition can provide superior results (artificially concentrating protein for shakes for example can help build muscle mass w/o high fat/cholesterol of most natural sources), and processed long-dead chicken, lamb, and beef isn't really a "natural" diet for a cat regardless.   Feeding live rodents and birds and the like would be, but that would be quite expensive and messy, and not necessarily superior to a diet w/ vitamins and antioxidants and the like considering ferals have quite short life spans compared to pampered indoor cats on commercial diets which have been recorded living longer than 20 years (vs around 3yrs on average for ferals).
 
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sugarcatmom

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Quote:

Feeding live rodents and birds and the like would be, but that would be quite expensive and messy, and not necessarily superior to a diet w/ vitamins and antioxidants and the like considering ferals have quite short life spans compared to pampered indoor cats on commercial diets which have been recorded living longer than 20 years (vs around 3yrs on average for ferals).
The supposedly longer life-span of indoor cats has nothing to do with commercial food and everything to do with safety from predators and cars, as well as advancements in veterinary care. In fact, I would say that highly processed dry food actually kills more cats than anything else. Your statement that ferals have shorter lives because of their live-prey diet is pretty far-fetched. 
 
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bianco maple

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Being an animals lover I would hate to feed a rodent  or a bird to my cat! No  way- raw available beef , finely monced  fish whatever but to go out of my way to get a bird a BIG NO NO however good it may be for the cat No such encouragement from my side! Let the feral cats enjoy that pursuit as they need to get food for themselves and I have no objections to that- 
 

auntie crazy

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Modern athletes and body builders have found that scientific advancements in nutrition can provide superior results (artificially concentrating protein for shakes for example can help build muscle mass w/o high fat/cholesterol of most natural sources), and processed long-dead chicken, lamb, and beef isn't really a "natural" diet for a cat regardless. Feeding live rodents and birds and the like would be, but that would be quite expensive and messy, and not necessarily superior to a diet w/ vitamins and antioxidants and the like considering ferals have quite short life spans compared to pampered indoor cats on commercial diets which have been recorded living longer than 20 years (vs around 3yrs on average for ferals).
You're absolutely correct, "...processed long-dead chicken, lamb, and beef isn't really a "natural" diet for a cat regardless." This is precisely why I do not feed commercial canned or kibble products to my cats; those products are so heavily processed they come off the production line pretty much nutritionally inert, and must have synthetic vitamins and minerals added to address their deficiencies.

Raw feeders, even whole prey feeders, generally feed meat that is processed only to the point it's killed and packaged, a much more nutritionally sound practice. Feeding live prey is cruel and puts a cat at risk for injury - both activities any responsible cat owner would naturally seek to avoid.

As for the feral cat / indoor cat life span = what they eat argument, that has been so thoroughly debunked, I'm surprised you brought it up. The life span of indoor cats has, in fact, been contracting steadily over the last decade and even the AVMA has had meetings to discuss the problem. Diabetes (an entirely man-made, food-related disease), has increased 16% in cats, and it's only one of many diseases and health problems that have done so.

To return to the OP's discussion:
 
My Heartfelt thanks to each one of you , for taking the time to respond to my post and my concerns-

Surprisingly I am totally on the same page, I do believe that when meat or fish is cooked it looses its nutrients and if the meat or raw foods one buys and its from a source that is fresh, its more beneficial to the animal that commercial foods-

I think I will avoid the chicken liver over here as it comes frozen but the veal is really fresh and not packaged meat- The butcher gives it to me by carving it from the huge carcass! but I will give this just once a week, he so enjoys it!!!!

Now as for Bianco, I give him on a daily basis the vet approved Lax that helps with the fur balls, and after doing some research , a cod liver oil capsule every 4 days, and now my husband has bought wild Alaskan salmon oil cap!( he gets it when he does his trips to the US-He tried to get the mycrolax the enema that the vet had used, the Lactulose but they said YOU need to bring the animal here as its on prescription!Here the  vet charged me a whopping amount for the stuff!

Where in the US can one buy these ,from a pharmacy? Any info will be greatly appreciated-he flies often to the US and Europe.If there is some online site that sells it , that info also will be welcomed-Thanks.

Bianco has been a little better in going to the litter tray, in the past few days but his eating habits are still not that normal-Because he is a bit overweight , and eats his indoor cat kibbles( bought from the Vet) Royal Canin Brand I am not that perturbed as hes quite playful . alert and normal in ever other sense-We plan to now get the one for Persian cats , this has some stuff that helps to get the fur ball situation undet control, the vet said it should work fine for him.

MY dear friends of catsite THANKS once again and love to all your furry loves from Bianco and me
Hi, Bianco Maple!

There is a possibility that the kibble could be exacerbating or even causing Bianco's digestive issues. The Feline Nutrition Education Society's website, feline-nutrition.org, contains information related to this, as does Dr. Hofve's site, LittleBigCat.com. You can search these sites for kibble, constipation, hairballs and obesity and learn how diet impacts coat loss and stool consistency (and how kibble affects a cat's entire physiology).

Dr. Pierson has a site, catinfo.org, that goes into great depth on the diet topic and includes discussion of hairballs and obesity. Instead of a "search" feature, this site has a clickable index you can find by scrolling down just a bit.

Best regards!

AC
 
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bianco maple

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Thanks AC I will surely read up on it- Its just that when we are out of town,canned food and the Royal Canin Indoor cat dry food( which now I will replace with the Indoor Persian cat ) is convenient for him to give Bianco-the dry food is just kept in his dish and he nibbles at it now and then   not as a full meal-Its only when I am back Home that I will be able to give him the fresh foods 

Tanks once more-
 

ducman69

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Raw food is generally processed long dead chicken, beef, and lamb, which are unnatural protein sources a cat would never hunt in the wild.   This is perfectly fine, but to sell it as "more natural" is quite false.   The difference between the meat in commercial raw food (unless anyone here actually lives on a farm and raises and slaughters their own meat) and commercial cat food is that one is cooked first to destroy harmful pathogens, and the other is not.    The chicken you buy at the grocery store is not intended for raw consumption per the government and industry leaders.   A youtube search of "poultry processing plant" will demonstrate why the meat is cooked first, and how it is nothing like a fresh kill a cat would make and eat on its own.
The supposedly longer life-span of indoor cats has nothing to do with commercial food and everything to do with safety from predators and cars, as well as advancements in veterinary care. In fact, I would say that highly processed dry food actually kills more cats than anything else. Your statement that ferals have shorter lives because of their live-prey diet is pretty far-fetched. 
You are claiming I made a statement that I did not, please read more carefully.  And you could in fact say that highly processed dry food actually kills more cats than anything else, and I could say the same about raw food, and we'd both win creative writing awards since we'd have no facts to back up our statements.  
 
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sugarcatmom

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You are claiming I made a statement that I did not, please read more carefully.  
Not sure how else to interpret the below statement. Perhaps you should word your comments more carefully.
Feeding live rodents and birds and the like would be, but that would be quite expensive and messy, and not necessarily superior to a diet w/ vitamins and antioxidants and the like considering ferals have quite short life spans compared to pampered indoor cats on commercial diets
And you could in fact say that highly processed dry food actually kills more cats than anything else, and I could say the same about raw food, and we'd both win creative writing awards since we'd have no facts to back up our statements.  
Except that cats in North America are fed kibble more than anything else, and that kibble is largely responsible for an increase in diabetes, obesity, dental disease, bladder/urinary tract disorders, inflammatory bowel disease, allergies, and kidney disease (some would even add cancer to the melange). A balanced raw diet doesn't even come close to doing that kind of harm.
 
 
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carmina piranha

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Hi, Bianco: I give my cats Laxatone to prevent hairballs. It's tuna-flavored, comes in a tube, is thick and easy to use, and it's a treat they love so much that they once bit open a tube. (But the kittens only loved it after I smeared it on their lips several times. The other cat always loved it, though). I order it from Amazon, $8 a tube including shipping. Maybe your husband can have it waiting for him when he goes to the US. Otherwise you can only buy it from your own personal vet (in the US). Also, cooked pumpkin--no spices added--help keep things moving in the intestines. It is added to some of the "hairball prevention" foods. A small amount does a lot, and too much creates diarrhea--to play it safe, I would start with 1/4 teaspoon/a few grams at a time.
 

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Welcome to TCS Carmina! :wavey:

I'm not sure if you noticed, but Bianco Maple started this thread in November. She had 14 posts on TCS, so I'm not sure he/she's still around to see your note. :dk: But thanks for sharing how you manage hairballs. Pumpkin is a great way to help kitties keep moving things comfortably along. :lol3:
 
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bianco maple

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HI:

Thanks for the post- For the past 3 months Bianco is free of hairballs! Middle of Dec we had to take him to the groomers and get all that gorgeous fr trimmed real down! He looked so cute and forlorn! but it was best for him and us  as we just could not wear black and sit on the couches or wear black.dark colors without his long hair all over , as for the floors too- We had to feed him Hartz, and other fur ball removal stuff each note _ the vet gave us the liquid Lactsomething-- Hes doing well now-but again in June/ July we plan to get his fur down to size! 

I was away from the site , as have been real busy guys

when I get a notification in my email I come to the site!Thanks once again and welcome to the forums!
 
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bianco maple

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Hello!



I sure was away form the site, what with the holidays and kids over for the festivities one hardly gets time! Anyways Belated happy New year to you and all on the forum

Bianco is doing well as you will read from the post I just submitted to another newbie

As for Veggies and Pumpkin pulp Boy what did I not do when he had the furball problem He was orange all over as had to force feed the guy! but what works best is the Hartz Furball paste that too , most cats like it but this fuss pot Had to pry his mouth open then stick the stuff in sideways and keep his mouth close and blow on his nose and face , and then he would swallow it!

Besides his dry food , ( now I use Royal Canin Persian, and a Royal canin Fibre , mixing a small amount of it and once a day or as needed feed him Fancy feast that my husband buys from Houston when on flights_ He is TOO SPOILT I am told! yes he is but hes such a sweety

He will not like other cats come to you if you have bacon, or tidbits, like sausage, or cheese or anything we humans like and cats go nuts about! He wont even  bother to come and sit by the table when  we eat -My husband calls hum silly cat! but hes my silly cat

he now loves to sit on the TV counter and watch the movements when a program's running and also when I am on the Ipad and playing games he loves to slide his paws to catch stuff that's going on! I have  taken some real cool pics with my cell phone but cant seem to downloads them

Anyways guys, I better say bye before I turn this into a novel!
 
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