Raw Diet. Need suggestions/budget help

[Beholder]

I brought the Amazing Omega Wild Alaskan Salmon Oil 2000mg gels, but one of my cats don't like It. So I gotta figure a way to give it.

Also I ordered some raw from my pet carnivore website and been told it contains the liver. Should I be adding more liver?

Are you mixing it in with the raw food? It doesn't require very much, so 5 pounds of meat would only need two of those gels. I premix the Alnutrin and fish oil into the 5 pound batch and then freeze it in individual portions. 5 pounds of meat is a lot so I would be surprised if they're tasting that small amount. Are you sure it's not something else?

I'm not super familiar with mypetcarnivore. Are you feeding their whole prey options? From their FAQ:

"It has been our experience that by feeding a whole prey diet and a variety of proteins over time, your dog, cat or ferret will get all of the nutrients that a healthy pet needs."

I wasn't able to find a grind on there that was just meat/bone/organ or meat/organ, but to be honest there's a lot on there and I didn't look for very long. Can you link which product you got from them?

 

[HonshuWolf]

Yes, I am mixing it with the raw meat I got from the grocery store. I am waiting to get the mypetcarnivore whole prey meat. Should I still add the fish oil and alnutrin meat and bone mix in the whole prey?

This is the one I'm getting along with Turkey and Pork.

You are being redirected...

Are you mixing it in with the raw food? It doesn't require very much, so 5 pounds of meat would only need two of those gels. I premix the Alnutrin and fish oil into the 5 pound batch and then freeze it in individual portions. 5 pounds of meat is a lot so I would be surprised if they're tasting that small amount. Are you sure it's not something else?

I'm not super familiar with mypetcarnivore. Are you feeding their whole prey options? From their FAQ:

"It has been our experience that by feeding a whole prey diet and a variety of proteins over time, your dog, cat or ferret will get all of the nutrients that a healthy pet needs."

I wasn't able to find a grind on there that was just meat/bone/organ or meat/organ, but to be honest there's a lot on there and I didn't look for very long. Can you link which product you got from them?

 

[Beholder]

Yes, I am mixing it with the raw meat I got from the grocery store. I am waiting to get the mypetcarnivore whole prey meat. Should I still add the fish oil and alnutrin meat and bone mix in the whole prey?

This is the one I'm getting along with Turkey and Pork.

You are being redirected...

That is an extremely tough question that I'm not sure how to answer. Basically, when you feed whole prey you don't need the same supplementation as meat/organ mixes because you're getting things like brains and eyeballs. As I quoted from their FAQ, they also say whole prey shouldn't need supplementation. However, under the link you sent they state "This all natural product has no additives and therefore does not meet AAFCO requirements for a complete diet."

I personally do not feed whole prey, so I feel uncomfortable giving you advice on this specifically. There are many people that do feed whole prey that are probably better suited to answer this. You can also search in past threads. I would suggest contacting the company but I have a feeling that they'll respond with both of the things I've quoted.

 

[Talien]

I brought the Amazing Omega Wild Alaskan Salmon Oil 2000mg gels, but one of my cats don't like It. So I gotta figure a way to give it.

Also I ordered some raw from my pet carnivore website and been told it contains the liver. Should I be adding more liver?

How are you trying to give the fish oil to them, are you mixing it with their food? If not try that. And no, if it already contains liver you don't need to add more.

 

[HonshuWolf]

So I got the whole prey raw food for the days but they don't seem to be interested in it much. How do I get them to eat it?

Also I put in the Alnutrin with meat and bones. But one cat still don't like the fish oil that I mixed in.

 

[Talien]

So I got the whole prey raw food for the days but they don't seem to be interested in it much. How do I get them to eat it?

Also I put in the Alnutrin with meat and bones. But one cat still don't like the fish oil that I mixed in.

If they don't take to it right away you'll have to transition them, which may take anywhere from a few days to a month depending on just how stubborn your Cats are. You mix a little bit in with their current food, start off with 25% and if they won't eat that cut back to around 10% and see. Once you've gotten a ratio they'll accept stick with it for 2-3 days then add a little more of the new food, and keep repeating the process every 2-3 days and eventually you'll get them to where they're eating nothing but the raw food.

 

[Maurey]

So I got the whole prey raw food

When you say whole prey raw food, do you mean actual whole prey (e.g. an entire mouse or day old chick) or a prey model raw aka frankeyprey mix, which includes chunks (or mince) of whole meaty bone, muscle meat, and organ meat. If it's the latter, I agree with Talien 's advice. If it's the former, you may have to cut the whole prey into chunks with kitchen scissors or a heavy knife (best done prior to defrosting, ime) so that your cats realise that it's still food. Indoor kitties who haven't had to hunt to survive might not realise that whole prey is still food, weirdly enough.

 

[HonshuWolf]

Is it okay to mix a little with some canned cat food?

If they don't take to it right away you'll have to transition them, which may take anywhere from a few days to a month depending on just how stubborn your Cats are. You mix a little bit in with their current food, start off with 25% and if they won't eat that cut back to around 10% and see. Once you've gotten a ratio they'll accept stick with it for 2-3 days then add a little more of the new food, and keep repeating the process every 2-3 days and eventually you'll get them to where they're eating nothing but the raw food.

 

[Maurey]

Is it okay to mix a little with some canned cat food?

If both are complete balanced meals, there's no reason not to. Hell, even normal raw meat is sometimes used as a topper (though, in this case, no more than 10% of the meal should be raw meat). Just keep in mind that raw food, unlike wet, can't be kept out for long periods of time. You can try mixing, at first, and if they react well to it, try simply spooning the raw on top of the wet, and see whether they turn up their nose at it.

 

[HonshuWolf]

I mean it's whole prey that contains meat, bones and organs.

When you say whole prey raw food, do you mean actual whole prey (e.g. an entire mouse or day old chick) or a prey model raw aka frankeyprey mix, which includes chunks (or mince) of whole meaty bone, muscle meat, and organ meat. If it's the latter, I agree with Talien 's advice. If it's the former, you may have to cut the whole prey into chunks with kitchen scissors or a heavy knife (best done prior to defrosting, ime) so that your cats realise that it's still food. Indoor kitties who haven't had to hunt to survive might not realise that whole prey is still food, weirdly enough.

 

[Talien]

Is it okay to mix a little with some canned cat food?

Yes, you just have to do it a little at a time or they might start having diarrhea or vomiting.

If you notice any of your Cats having constipation issues after partly or fully transitioning to the raw food then you might have to find a meat source without bone and add eggshell powder for a calcium source, as too much bone can cause constipation.

 

[lisahe]

So I got the whole prey raw food for the days but they don't seem to be interested in it much. How do I get them to eat it?

Also I put in the Alnutrin with meat and bones. But one cat still don't like the fish oil that I mixed in.

If you're using Alnutrin with eggshell calcium (that's what an earlier post said), then you should not be using meat with bones. Alnutrin's instructions with the supplements with calcium are here: A Guide To A Balanced, Homemade Cat Food - Alnutrin Supplements

Beyond not wanting to mess with a cat's mineral balance, as Talien mentions, too much bone can cause constipation, which is why Alnutrin makes two supplements with non-bone calcium sources. "Too much bone" can vary depending on the cat but I make sure that more than half our cats' food is boneless since one of our cats tends to get a little constipated.

 

[HonshuWolf]

I'm using the Alnutrin for Meat & Bone, not the eggshell calcium one.

If you're using Alnutrin with eggshell calcium (that's what an earlier post said), then you should not be using meat with bones. Alnutrin's instructions with the supplements with calcium are here: A Guide To A Balanced, Homemade Cat Food - Alnutrin Supplements

Beyond not wanting to mess with a cat's mineral balance, as Talien mentions, too much bone can cause constipation, which is why Alnutrin makes two supplements with non-bone calcium sources. "Too much bone" can vary depending on the cat but I make sure that more than half our cats' food is boneless since one of our cats tends to get a little constipated.

 

[sophie1]

If anyone is up for a grinder: I called the One Stop Jerky Shop and they will have the Tasin TS-108 in stock starting sometime in April. Cat food makers rejoice!

I found one on ebay and I'm glad I went with it. It's lightweight enough to be practical in a small residential kitchen, and it was easy to figure out how to use it. I made a 5 lb batch for my inaugural run, using the partial baking technique on Lisa Pierson's website. IT WAS SO EASY!!!!!!! I wish I did this right from the start. It's certainly easier than running around buying or ordering commercial raw, not to mention a lot cheaper, AND I know exactly what my cats are getting. Bonus, they really liked the food.

I'm sick and tired of random recipe changes by commercial raw vendors causing health issues in my cats, or causing them to suddenly reject the food. I've got a freezerful of Balanced Blends food that my cats - after loving previous batches - still refuse to eat. I'm going to have to pitch the whole shipment. Since my cats won't eat it, I have no reason to trust its nutritional value or ingredients anyway.

Some details on the recipe I used. I have some chicken organ chubs from Hare Today, so I used 1 lb of the organ mix, 2 lbs of bone-in chicken thighs, and 2 lbs of boneless chicken thighs. This works out to ~6% bone content. The catinfo.org recipe is probably fine for most cats but it's too bone-heavy for my struvite stone-making cat. I baked these for about 15 minutes in a 350 oven, then put them in the fridge to cool for a while. The actual grinding took about 30 seconds, and the result is looser than chubs and easier/quicker to mix. I used Alnutrin powder instead of the individual supplements for convenience - but also because the price is actually about what it would cost me if you include the eggs in the recipe. Added in a lot of salmon oil and egg yolk lecithin, since it's shedding/hairball season. The most time consuming part of this is putting the food into jars and then cleaning the grinder parts. I put my pull-down kitchen faucet spray attachment to good use.

 

[HonshuWolf]

I’m definitely going to buy a grinder so I can start making the food. I think it’s a better option than buying raw meals online and having to wait a few days.

Is there a cheaper grinder that can grind down small bones like chicken legs,etc?

If anyone is up for a grinder: I called the One Stop Jerky Shop and they will have the in stock starting sometime in April. Cat food makers rejoice!

I found one on ebay and I'm glad I went with it. It's lightweight enough to be practical in a small residential kitchen, and it was easy to figure out how to use it. I made a 5 lb batch for my inaugural run, using the partial baking technique on Lisa Pierson's website. IT WAS SO EASY!!!!!!! I wish I did this right from the start. It's certainly easier than running around buying or ordering commercial raw, not to mention a lot cheaper, AND I know exactly what my cats are getting. Bonus, they really liked the food.

I'm sick and tired of random recipe changes by commercial raw vendors causing health issues in my cats, or causing them to suddenly reject the food. I've got a freezerful of Balanced Blends food that my cats - after loving previous batches - still refuse to eat. I'm going to have to pitch the whole shipment. Since my cats won't eat it, I have no reason to trust its nutritional value or ingredients anyway.

Some details on the recipe I used. I have some chicken organ chubs from Hare Today, so I used 1 lb of the organ mix, 2 lbs of bone-in chicken thighs, and 2 lbs of boneless chicken thighs. This works out to ~6% bone content. The catinfo.org recipe is probably fine for most cats but it's too bone-heavy for my struvite stone-making cat. I baked these for about 15 minutes in a 350 oven, then put them in the fridge to cool for a while. The actual grinding took about 30 seconds, and the result is looser than chubs and easier/quicker to mix. I used Alnutrin powder instead of the individual supplements for convenience - but also because the price is actually about what it would cost me if you include the eggs in the recipe. Added in a lot of salmon oil and egg yolk lecithin, since it's shedding/hairball season. The most time consuming part of this is putting the food into jars and then cleaning the grinder parts. I put my pull-down kitchen faucet spray attachment to good use.

 

[HonshuWolf]

Thanks everyone for the replies. I very much appreciate it.

 

[Talien]

I’m definitely going to buy a grinder so I can start making the food. I think it’s a better option than buying raw meals online and having to wait a few days.

Is there a cheaper grinder that can grind down small bones like chicken legs,etc?

The problem with that is any grinder that's being used for grinding bones is going to wear out quicker than normal, so yes you'd want to use a smaller grinder for that. But then you've got twice as many parts to clean every time you make a batch of food, and another grinder to store.

You'd probably be better off buying powdered eggshell to add for a calcium source and saving yourself a lot of extra work, unless you just want to do it all yourself then yeah pick up a smaller grinder just for bones. When I was researching making my own raw food I had a Butcher suggest using a blender to chop the bones so you could maybe look into that too.

 

[lisahe]

The problem with that is any grinder that's being used for grinding bones is going to wear out quicker than normal, so yes you'd want to use a smaller grinder for that. But then you've got twice as many parts to clean every time you make a batch of food, and another grinder to store.

You'd probably be better off buying powdered eggshell to add for a calcium source and saving yourself a lot of extra work, unless you just want to do it all yourself then yeah pick up a smaller grinder just for bones. When I was researching making my own raw food I had a Butcher suggest using a blender to chop the bones so you could maybe look into that too.

There are other advantages to eggshell calcium, too: it can help avoid constipation (one of our cats has a problem with that if she gets too much bone) and not getting too much phosphorus in the diet. I use a supplement with eggshell to make homemade food but we also feed commercial raw food with bone. I like feeding both types of food!

 

[Maurey]

Cats don’t need carbs, that’s more of a dog BARF formulation, than a PMR for cats. With that much carb load, you’d be better off feeding wet, imo.