Questions On Declawing And Why It's Inhumane

PushPurrCatPaws

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I know this is a hot topic so let me first start out with saying: I have a 4.5 month old Scottish Fold kitten who I LOVE and adore and I do not want to hurt her by any means! ...
First of all, I am very glad to read your above statement ^^ ... it's a good thing when humans don't want to intentionally hurt kittens and cats, and definitely something to be applauded :clap:


Of the three Arguments you note in your post, two of them deal with the pain issue, which you do seem to understand after your own research and after reading what others have invaluably contributed here in this thread:


...
From my research, I've found 2 main arguments why declawing is inhumane:

Argument 1: Declawing is similar to cutting off the tips of your fingers

My thoughts: I understand how this can be understood as inhumane ...

I find it interesting because Phantom (the EXTREMELY loving cat who I spoke about prior) had very sensitive paws and I've been very surprised because the kitten I have now doesn't have sensitive paws at all. I feel that it's very possible that declawing could have caused this heightened her sensitivity to her paws being touched. I will continue to do research on this because this can show longterm pain caused pain of declawing ...

Bottom line: if you don't want to cause your kitten pain, do not declaw her.
It's as simple as that, in my view.



I don't myself use claw caps or that type of product for our cat, but I might add that if you are observing frustration and annoyance in your Scottish Fold kitten regarding claw caps, and you think that "constant annoyance" of claw caps is more inhumane than declawing, what about the frustration the cat likely feels at not being able to scratch and mark territory? That surely is a more innate urge deeply seated within a cat (the loss of which I assume would be highly frustrating) than the small annoyance of having something stuck on its claws. And this is not even talking about the "annoyance" a cat or kitten would express or act out at feeling the PAIN from the declawing surgery, whether it's the immediate pain after the declawing or long term pain, as other have described here which have often occurred. There are many things done to cats that can seem, or indeed are, inhumane. One can even find people on the planet who think that breeding genetic defects into cats, like the mutations with cartilage in Scottish Folds which they feel can lead to painful arthritis at the least, are something to speak out against as well.


You have a very young kitten on your hands, barely 5 mos old. Get ready for at least a year of kittenhood behaviors!

Have you considered putting your two scratch posts in the locations that she is actually scratching and maybe not where they currently exist (that is, if she is scratching elsewhere)? I have three scratch posts in an apartment 50 sq. ft. smaller than yours. My cat just turned two on Monday; we've had her since 11 wks old. As we got used to her, and she to us, we observed and learned her favorite pathways, her habits after eating and waking and play, and we put the posts at locations in the apartment where we saw her wanting to stretch and scratch (one thing about scratch posts, it is not ALL about the scratching and the marking up of territory -- it is also about the stretching and elongating of the cat's muscles, which one would be aware of if observing cats scratching at furniture and/ or scratch posts -- they put a lot of stretching into it!).

Cat scratch posts do need to be stable (while a cat scratches on it), but that does not have to mean that their placement in the home has to remain static. One of our three scratch posts, the tallest one, stays in the same place all of the time... but two of the three posts are occasionally mobile, meaning we've moved them around according to both the wake-up and playtime behaviors we've seen develop in our kitten over the last year and a half (e.g. if we see her stretching or wanting to mark in another area of the apartment, we move her shorter scratch posts to those areas).

The point has also been made in the thread about horizontal scratch "posts" (like cardboard scratchers). Maybe you could look into that, if your cat is scratching flat surfaces too, and not always stretching up to scratch an actual post.




I also wish to add that I'm not trying to be argumentative or trying to encourage declawing, I'm simply trying to understand.

I have a good argument: it will cause your kitten a lot less pain long term, and your pocketbook a lot less pain over the years in trying to deal with potential health, physical or behavioral issues, to purchase for your cat --along with scratch posts, etc.-- a sofa or small ottoman or a chair of her very own to scratch on. Train her to scratch the posts, the scratchers, her own piece of furniture instead of declawing her. She will be in less pain.

Besides three scratch posts, our cat also has an inexpensive chaise lounge to scratch on, something all her own which we don't care about. She doesn't scratch any other furniture.

But even if we did care about that chaise lounge, we care about her more. We could care less about the chaise lounge.


By the way, I fully agree with Willowy and AbbysMom about reputable breeders and shelters/rescues requiring that the cat or kitten not be declawed as part of their contract. I signed one of those contracts myself for our kitten, and it was actually one of the main reasons I chose that rescue/shelter, versus some others.
 
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golgotha

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1. Spaying and Neutering really, really bothers me (I'm a man).

But… The positives far outweigh the negatives, I view it as a necessary evil.

Having an unneutered male cat, pissing all over your house, getting agitated to the point of attacking you (depending on the cat) scratching the doors/windows/curtains because it smelled a female outside the house, howling through the night. Not to mention the actual stress the animal is in, looking for a mate and no being able to find one. Females are a bit better, but they also have a higher chance of getting ovarian cancer when they get older compared to male ones getting prostrate.

Declawing does not benefit the cat it self, and its well being in no way whatsoever, it just benefits the owner, and there are far less intrusive alternatives.

Is really comparing apples to oranges, a cat's claws is part of their everyday life, reproductive organs are just that, useful for mating and nothing else (and they only lose part of them).

2. As you said that's not much of an argument for indoor cats, but it will still affect them psychologically, but to declaw an outdoor cat is simply just cruel.

3. I have no idea how true that is, first time I hear about it. I can see how it would be true though if their paws become more sensitive without claws.

1b. I wouldn't recommend it, foreign objects on a cat's paw is going to feel horrible, I can understand using it temporarily if a cat is a guest in a place where there's a leather couch, or something like that, but is not really a permanent solution.

2b. I don't like scratching posts, because my crazy cats destroy them pretty quick. An old school alternative is a leather pillow, they used to make some specifically for cats back in the day, I have no idea if that’s the case anymore, they a bit expensive but if you got one cat, and she/he is not too crazy they can last a long time. Needless to say do not use them if you got leather furniture, the cat will get used to scratching leather and won't be able to tell the difference, which leather is ok to scratch and which isn't.

I use cardboard boxes, the positive is that they cheap (can't get cheaper than free) and the cats love to make a mess out of them and play inside. The negative is that it indeed makes a mess, and you'll have to sweep up pretty much every day (good to place in a kitchen or somewhere easy to sweep), also cats will get used to it so if you have anything in cardboard boxes for storage readily available to them, they gonna start scratching on that too.

The other alternative I'm working in on, is custom scratching posts using the base and pole of an old fan, and coiling rope around it. The fan pole is rather sturdy unlike the cardboard tube of most scratching posts, and you can replace the rope whenever they mess it up with new one. Only problem with this is that you have to make it yourself and if you're not handy is not a good option.

I think people underestimate how important claws are to cats.

Sometimes vets cut off my cats claws (without telling me) probably so they wont rip them to shreds while they examine them after they've been put to sleep for some operation or another. When I get them home, they can't balance themselves and slip all over the place when they jump onto things. And that's just the result of a clipper, they're not fully gone and they'll grow back eventually, and the cats do get used to their lack of sharp instruments of death by the time they do grow and don't stumble around as much, but is so fundamental to them that it throws their whole balance off when they're only half missing.

You do what your conscience tells you. But I'm not going to mince words, you're making a choice between the wellbeing of a living thing and some stuff which are ultimately replaceable.

Personally I don't even like the conundrum, if I truly care for some stuff I just limit them in rooms where the cats don't get access to or in cupboards, cats don't need the entire house to roam in, they usually have favorite spaces they like to nest to, and everything I keep around where the cats are, is fair game. Even the leather chair I'm sitting on as I type this, which one of my crazy munchkins managed to mess up the armrest of, the ONE time the cover got off and he had a go at it.
 

abyeb

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Did you get your cat from a breeder? If so, who are they? Most breeders make pet buyers sign a contract saying that you won't declaw, because they are aware of the pain that this surgery causes as well as the behavioral side effects.

Also, please read this through:
http://www.littlebigcat.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/ADH2017.pdf

This link was originally provided by TCS user @otto, it is written by a veterinarian and is an excellent resource!
 

kittens mom

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Removing an animals need to reproduce is much different than mutilating their feet. It also is the most humane way to reduce the unwanted pet population. Declawing only serves as an advantage for humans who don't have to endure the pain of having their fingers cut off at the first joint. although I'm fine with anyone wanting to prove their point and having their fingertips amputated for no reason. Good luck because no HUMAN doctor would agree to that kind of mutilation. Neither should an decent veterinarian.
 

PushPurrCatPaws

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Did you get your cat from a breeder? If so, who are they? Most breeders make pet buyers sign a contract saying that you won't declaw, because they are aware of the pain that this surgery causes as well as the behavioral side effects.

Also, please read this through:
http://www.littlebigcat.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/ADH2017.pdf

This link was originally provided by TCS user @otto, it is written by a veterinarian and is an excellent resource!

One could hope the OP did not get the cat from a breeder, but saved it from a rescue or shelter and is very aware of, and willing to help ease, potential physical pain and discomforts for the kitty during her life.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=osteochondrodysplasia+++Scottish+Folds&ia=web
 
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maddies momma

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The difference between declawing and spay/neuter is that a declaw is bone amputation. Spay and neuter is not chopping off genitals. It removes the parts of the reproductive system that causes cats to experience hormones that make them crazy and feel the need to reproduce. This way a cat is not constantly feeling the need to reproduce without being able to do so. They are much more comfortable as pets when they don't have these non stop urges. It also prevents them from fighting and being wounded and from experiencing painful pregnancies. Spay and neuter are soft tissue surgeries, as soon as they heal up there is no long term pain involved. Declawing is amputating the last bone in every toe and then they have to walk on that the rest of their lives. They are walking on a bone that is not meant to be walked on. Humans are plantigrade meaning we walk flat on our feet. Cats are digigrade meaning they walk on their tipi toes. Declawing removes those tipi toes. Then the way their body supports their way is completely and unnaturally shifted and this causes arthritis and long term pain. People always say it's like cutting of the tips of your fingers, yes this is true but we don't walk on our fingers. Imagine having the tips of your toes cut off and then walking around. Now imagine having the tips of your toes cut off and then having to walk on your tip toes.
 
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banbury

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It looks like everyone has touched on the major points already! 

I'd just like to add that while I was at a vet clinic for an interview a few years ago, I saw a cat that just undergone a declawing surgery. I can't remember if the cat had just had the front paws or all four done, but what I do remember is seeing blood seeping through the cat's bandaged paws and watching the cat try and fail to walk normally. I was horrified by what I saw and needless to say I didn't pursue working for that clinic any further. Around where I live, it's difficult to even find a vet to perform the surgery because so many consider it to be inhumane. I remember the vet at this particular clinic justified the surgery because it would keep the cat in the home (the owner had expensive rugs and furniture that they didn't want ruined). I've heard this many times where people say if the options are to either declaw  the cat to keep it in the home or have the owner surrender the cat to a shelter, some people would go with the option to declaw. But if the biggest concern is property destruction, what about if the cat begins to have litterbox avoidance issues related to pain it has felt when digging in the box? If someone was going to surrender because the cat was scratching furniture, you can almost guarantee they would surrender if the cat starts urinating or defecating in their bedding and clothes. 

When I worked in an animal shelter, we would get people in that liked what they considered to be the bbenefits of declawing, but would not personally declaw a cat so they would wait until one became available for adoption. I know this doesn't exactly fit your situation, but for anyone else reading that wants a declawed cat, I'd HIGHLY recommend checking your nearby shelters. You can't undo the surgery someone else has already performed and if you can avoid declawing another cat, I consider that as much of a win-win as possible. 

All of this being said, if you do decide to go the route of declawing, it will be less  traumatic if it's done at a young age; adult cats have an even more difficult time recovering from the surgery.
 
 
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talkingpeanut

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It looks like everyone has touched on the major points already! 

I'd just like to add that while I was at a vet clinic for an interview a few years ago, I saw a cat that just undergone a declawing surgery. I can't remember if the cat had just had the front paws or all four done, but what I do remember is seeing blood seeping through the cat's bandaged paws and watching the cat try and fail to walk normally. I was horrified by what I saw and needless to say I didn't pursue working for that clinic any further. Around where I live, it's difficult to even find a vet to perform the surgery because so many consider it to be inhumane. I remember the vet at this particular clinic justified the surgery because it would keep the cat in the home (the owner had expensive rugs and furniture that they didn't want ruined). I've heard this many times where people say if the options are to either declaw  the cat to keep it in the home or have the owner surrender the cat to a shelter, some people would go with the option to declaw. But if the biggest concern is property destruction, what about if the cat begins to have litterbox avoidance issues related to pain it has felt when digging in the box? If someone was going to surrender because the cat was scratching furniture, you can almost guarantee they would surrender if the cat starts urinating or defecating in their bedding and clothes. 

When I worked in an animal shelter, we would get people in that liked what they considered to be the bbenefits of declawing, but would not personally declaw a cat so they would wait until one became available for adoption. I know this doesn't exactly fit your situation, but for anyone else reading that wants a declawed cat, I'd HIGHLY recommend checking your nearby shelters. You can't undo the surgery someone else has already performed and if you can avoid declawing another cat, I consider that as much of a win-win as possible. 

All of this being said, if you do decide to go the route of declawing, it will be less  traumatic if it's done at a young age; adult cats have an even more difficult time recovering from the surgery.
 
Less traumatic in the short term, maybe.
 

banbury

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Less traumatic in the short term, maybe.
I'm in no way promoting declawing, but studies do support that doing it at a young age is the lesser of two evils.. not that a cat benefits from either scenario. It's never done in the best interest of the physical/mental state of the cat.
 

talkingpeanut

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I'm in no way promoting declawing, but studies do support that doing it at a young age is the lesser of two evils.. not that a cat benefits from either scenario. It's never done in the best interest of the physical/mental state of the cat.
Right, they may recover more quickly in the short term. The long term consequences are the same regardless of when the procedure is done. I just think that's important to note.
 

Kieka

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Those who value their carpets or chairs should not keep cats if they value their possessions over their cats!
With kind regards,
Geoffrey
Agreed whole heartedly.

I have a coworker who rehomed his dog because it no longer matched his couch. Priorities misaligned.
 

livelovepurr

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There is a really good documentary on declawing as well: http://www.pawprojectmovie.com/

It used to be available on Netflix. I don't know if it's there anymore though.

Edit: I just checked Netflix and it is not available. You can rent it on YouTube or Google. It really is a great documentary.
 
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abyeb

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There is a really good documentary on declawing as well: http://www.pawprojectmovie.com/


It used to be available on Netflix. I don't know if it's there anymore though.

Edit: I just checked Netflix and it is not available. You can rent it on YouTube or Google. It really is a great documentary.
This documentary is indeed excellent and is something every new cat owner should watch.
 

Ntrope

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You might try double sided tape on places you don't want them scratching. Cats hate sticky stuff on their paws. I don't think there is anything else I could say to discourage you that hasn't already been said. Please don't do it.
 

astrael

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I just want to add that mating in cats is not the same as humans. They don't bond like we do from it, they experience a lot more negatives than positives. It increases their stress, and strains their body (unlike humans who relieve stress). Don't forget the whole barbed male genital part. And who wants to be in a hormonal frenzy driving you to fight until you're bloody every single day?

In all my life, I've never seen a happy, calm unfixed tom outside. Ever. I've been around strays and ferals since I was a baby. (I was half raised by cats :lol:) Mating does not make them happy. Mating urges do not make them happy. Food, toys, and a warm place to sleep make cats happy.

Right now, there's a tiny cat that had joined my colony heavily pregnant. While still a kitten herself. She'll never reach full size (she's so tiny). I've been nursing her to health for months now. Her kittens were safely adopted once weaned, btw. She's prone to colds and injuries. But she's such a sweetheart. Her brother (fixed young, joined the colony with her) takes great care of her. She was about the same age as your little one when she became a momma. She's not even a full year old yet.

She nearly died from not being fixed because she was stuck outside as a kitten. It's honestly a miracle she could feed her two kittens. Mating and reproducing, especially in ferals, is not a happy fun experience. Nor does it seem like any of them miss it.

Even inside cats suffer from their hormones. I've honestly never seen a cat upset about being fixed before. Most are happier very quickly. So just in this case, don't think about how you would feel, but about how they feel. I assure you, being fixed will make her life far, far better. It has for every cat I've helped in a long life of cat rescue. :-)
 
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