New Rawz Canned Foods

Azazel

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Ok, I did more fenugreek info gathering.

Each can of Rawz Turkey and Turkey Liver cat food is 5.5 oz and has roughly 200 cals. (per manufacturer's website) RAWZ | Turkey & Turkey Liver Pâté

They claim each 5.5 oz can has 96% Turkey and Turkey Liver (per the can label) while the entire ingredient list they provide is as follows - Turkey, Turkey Liver, Turkey Broth, Potassium Chloride, Fenugreek Seeds, Natural Flavor, Choline Chloride, Salt, Vegetable Broth, Dandelion Greens, Taurine, Zinc Proteinate, Iron Proteinate, Niacin Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Copper Proteinate, Sodium Selenite, Thiamine Mononitrate, Manganese Proteinate, Vitamin A Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Riboflavin Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Biotin, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Ethylenediamine Dihydroiodide, Folic Acid.

From many websites that calculate cal info of foods, these ingredients:

1 oz of turkey liver is roughly 66 cals

1 oz of turkey is roughly 34 cals

1 oz of fenugreek seeds is roughly 92 cals (wow!)

Someone help me out here, because I really suck at math, but based on the ingredient list, Turkey is the main ingredient followed by Turkey liver, so those two should be the main source of cals, right?

96% of 5.5 oz is 5.28 oz. So, can I conclude there is 5.28 oz of Turkey and Turkey Liver in a 5.5 oz can with the rest of the ingredients totaling .28 oz?
I’m assuming they mean 96% turkey and liver on a dry matter basis. If the food is 70% moisture on a wet matter basis then it is only 1.65 oz on a dry matter basis (yes, you pay mostly for water with canned food). I’m assuming that 96% of this 1.65 oz is turkey and liver and that there is a very small amount of fenugreek in it, much less than 1oz (not sure where you got that number from). The turkey flavor is also almost 0% carbs so the fenugreek amount has to be small.

Edit: I was thinking on it a bit more and now I’m wondering if what they mean is that 96% of the turkey and it’s liver is used? Honestly it could mean anything... there is no regulation around pet food companies using this language.
 
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Hikoh

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I’m assuming they mean 96% turkey and liver on a dry matter basis. If the food is 70% moisture on a wet matter basis then it is only 1.65 oz on a dry matter basis (yes, you pay mostly for water with canned food). I’m assuming that 96% of this 1.65 oz is turkey and liver and that there is a very small amount of fenugreek in it, much less than 1oz (not sure where you got that number from). The turkey flavor is also almost 0% carbs so the fenugreek amount has to be small.

Edit: I was thinking on it a bit more and now I’m wondering if what they mean is that 96% of the turkey and it’s liver is used? Honestly it could mean anything... there is no regulation around pet food companies using this language.
The 1 oz figures was just showing how many cals come from 1 oz, not that they claim there are 1 oz of any of it in the cans. Yeah, I am deducing that just from the 200 cals per can and seeing how calorie dense fenugreek is that fenugreek is where most of those calories are comming from. I really hope I am wrong, but I will check with the company themselves.
 

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Actually the name of the food is strictly controlled, and what it says has a specific definition (source is Dr Hovfe’s book “What Cats should Eat”):

“The 100% or All Rule: This one's pretty simple: the food contains only one ingredient.

The 95% Rule: “Chicken for Cats” must contain at least 95% chicken (excluding water for processing). Similarly, “Chicken and Giblets for Cats” will be 95% chicken and giblets together, and there must be more chicken than giblets, since chicken appears first on the label. It used to be that this rule applied only to animal-derived ingredients, but now it includes non-animal ingredients like rice or sweet potatoes. A 95% food that used to contain 95% meat or by-products may now contain up to 47% plant materials.

The 25% Rule: If the label says “dinner,” “platter,” “entree,” “nuggets,” “formula,” or similar term, there must be 25% of the named ingredients. That is, “Chicken Dinner” must contain 25% chicken. If more than one ingredient is named, such as “Chicken and Giblets Entree,” the two together must comprise 25% of the total, there must be more chicken than giblets, and there must be at least 3% giblets. So “Chicken and Giblets Entrée” could contain anywhere from 22% chicken and 3% giblets to 13% chicken and 12% giblets. It used to be that the 25% rule applied only to animal-source ingredients. That is, "Chicken and Rice Dinner" still had to contain 25% chicken. However, that has changed, so now a food with that label may have anywhere from 13-25% chicken.

The “With” Rule: Ingredients labeled as “with” must be present at 3%, such as “Chicken Dinner with Giblets” must contain 3% giblets. (In the EU, the equivalent minimum is 4%.)

The “Flavor” Rule: An ingredient labeled as a “flavor,” such as “Beef Flavor Dinner,” may not actually contain any beef at all, but more likely will contain a digest or other by-products that (theoretically, at least) give the food a beef flavor.”
 

Hikoh

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A 95% food that used to contain 95% meat or by-products may now contain up to 47% plant materials.
Yep, fenugreek is a plant, a very calorie dense plant at that. Thanks.
 
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LTS3

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Back to the original point of this thread, I was just at the pet store today. They don't have the new Rawz varieties yet. And yes, the brand costs $2.99:eek: I didn't buy any today.

 

Azazel

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The 1 oz figures was just showing how many cals come from 1 oz, not that they claim there are 1 oz of any of it in the cans. Yeah, I am deducing that just from the 200 cals per can and seeing how calorie dense fenugreek is that fenugreek is where most of those calories are comming from. I really hope I am wrong, but I will check with the company themselves.
The calories can’t mostly be from fenugreek because it’s not the first listed ingredient and the food is almost 0% carbs. I also recall Rawz responding to an email of mine once saying that they use a small amount of fenugreek as a binder.
 

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The calories can’t mostly be from fenugreek because it’s not the first listed ingredient and the food is almost 0% carbs. I also recall Rawz responding to an email of mine once saying that they use a small amount of fenugreek as a binder.
Where are you getting the 0% carbs figure? I can't find that info anywhere on their website.
 

Hikoh

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The calories can’t mostly be from fenugreek because it’s not the first listed ingredient and the food is almost 0% carbs. I also recall Rawz responding to an email of mine once saying that they use a small amount of fenugreek as a binder.
The reason I posted how many cals 1 oz of turkey and fenugreeks seeds contain is to show how calorie dense the seeds are compared to the turkey. Even if there is more turkey in each can then fenugreek seeds, it would still be possible for the majority of the calories to come from fenugreek seeds.
 

Hikoh

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Is there a way to edit posts? Also, fenugreek seeds are carbs.
 

Azazel

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Where are you getting the 0% carbs figure? I can't find that info anywhere on their website.
The dmb values were sent to me by rawz and I calculated the percentage of calories from protein-fat-carbs based on the values they provided.
 

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The calories can’t mostly be from fenugreek because it’s not the first listed ingredient and the food is almost 0% carbs. I also recall Rawz responding to an email of mine once saying that they use a small amount of fenugreek as a binder.
The reason I posted how many cals 1 oz of turkey and fenugreeks seeds contain is to show how calorie dense the seeds are compared to the turkey. Even if there is more turkey in each can then fenugreek seeds, it would still be possible for the majority of the calories to come from fenugreek seeds.
Fenugreek may be calorie-dense, but it's so relatively low on the ingredient list -- coming after potassium chloride! -- that there's simply no logical way it could have much of an impact at all on calories or carbs in the food. According to the USDA, even a tablespoon of fenugreek has only 36 calories so you'd really have to stuff the can with it -- it would take around three tablespoons to come up with half the calories for a can of turkey Rawz -- to have more fenugreek calories than turkey calories. That's a lot of fenugreek. It's just not happening. Plus...

On a more anecdotal note, fenugreek has a very distinctive smell so if the food had a significant amount of it, there would be a strong fenugreek odor. I fed a can of turkey Rawz the other night and can state for the record that there was no fenugreek odor to be sensed! It's also a smell that really stays with you: I opened the jar on the spice rack a little while ago just to remember and it won't leave my nose.

Further on the distinctive smell of fenugreek: NPR on a mysterious odor.
 

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Is there a way to edit posts?
You’ll be able to edit after a certain number of posts. I can’t remember how many, but I think you’re almost there.
 

Azazel

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Here is an excerpt from an email they sent me last year when I inquired about nutrient values:

“You will notice that some of the carbohydrate percentages are negative numbers. Whenever you see a negative number, it just means that the percentage is almost negligible. This makes sense for the cans since they are 96% meat – the only real carbohydrate source in RAWZ cans are the fenugreek seeds, which are very low in carbohydrates. And we only use a small amount of them, so their overall carb contribution is quite small.“
 

lisamarie12

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Back to the original point of this thread, I was just at the pet store today. They don't have the new Rawz varieties yet. And yes, the brand costs $2.99:eek: I didn't buy any today.
I'm in NYC and went to one of the few stores that carries this brand, the owner is charging different prices depending on the protein, e.g., the turkey cans were $2.79, the canned duck was a whopping $3.79 per can, yikes!

I noticed also, after having purchased a couple cans of turkey back in March (from another retailer), those cans had a best buy of 6/2018 and the texture of the food was like mushy pudding. The recent cans, exp in 2020 and the texture was much more solid, like a loaf, which the cats preferred.
 

lisahe

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I noticed also, after having purchased a couple cans of turkey back in March (from another retailer), those cans had a best buy of 6/2018 and the texture of the food was like mushy pudding. The recent cans, exp in 2020 and the texture was much more solid, like a loaf, which the cats preferred.
Yes, I noticed a difference in texture, too. Our cats had gotten tired of the mushier food but love the newer cans which, yes, are more solid. (And the food also smells more like Fancy Feast, which makes picky Ireland happy!)
 

lisamarie12

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Yes, I noticed a difference in texture, too. Our cats had gotten tired of the mushier food but love the newer cans which, yes, are more solid. (And the food also smells more like Fancy Feast, which makes picky Ireland happy!)
I was just able to order from my local indy retailer the turkey & liver, the cats really like it. I hope Rawz keeps the newer texture.

FYI, re: pricing from Rawz customer service (which is excellent, btw, all my questions thoroughly answered):

"As for pricing, the new recipes containing duck and rabbit are a bit more expensive than the other recipes. Although retailers are welcome to price their products wherever they choose, our suggested retail price for the duck and rabbit recipes are $2.99. The other 6 recipes have an SRP of $2.39. We assume that retailers will price above the SRP in areas where the cost of living is higher, but we hope that they will keep it reasonable. Unfortunately, we can only request that they don’t go below a certain price. Going above is up to them, but it may have a negative impact on their business."
 

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I didn't know that they came out with a new formula and proteins. Unfortunately, my closest pet store doesn't have it so I'll have to call around lol I did try the turkey one before, and my cat liked it.
 

LadyLondonderry

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I'm in NYC and went to one of the few stores that carries this brand, the owner is charging different prices depending on the protein, e.g., the turkey cans were $2.79, the canned duck was a whopping $3.79 per can, yikes!

I noticed also, after having purchased a couple cans of turkey back in March (from another retailer), those cans had a best buy of 6/2018 and the texture of the food was like mushy pudding. The recent cans, exp in 2020 and the texture was much more solid, like a loaf, which the cats preferred.
L lisamarie12 , would you mind sharing the name of the store where you found Rawz? I asked for it at Spoiled Brats, one of the retailers listed on the Rawz site, and the employee (manager? he seemed to know their stock very well) said they didn't have it. I also didn't see it at the Pet Central branches I checked.

One of my frustrations with store locator engines on websites is that most of them fail to specify whether a store carries the brand's full line or only part of it (e.g., the dog foods but not the cat foods). An exception is the Stella & Chewy's site; its locator was able to tell me that a store very near me carries their freeze-dried cat foods and that one within walking (OK, hiking) distance carries their full line.
 

lisamarie12

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L lisamarie12 , would you mind sharing the name of the store where you found Rawz? I asked for it at Spoiled Brats, one of the retailers listed on the Rawz site, and the employee (manager? he seemed to know their stock very well) said they didn't have it. I also didn't see it at the Pet Central branches I checked.
I will send you a pm. :)
 
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