New high energy cat is exhausting me

[Anne2021]

If you can I would highly suggest a catio with bird feeders outside. It would be the easiest solution. Hang the feeders so your hyper cat can see them from the catio. Maybe even get a squirrel feeder. Provided Jackie gets at least an hour a day outside to hang out and a short walk, he is a well behaved kitty.

7.5 years is highly unusual. I will say this though, I still miss Dante the great. He took a chunk of my heart when he died. Yes he was crazy hyper but he was my shadow & my best friend. So try to love on your problem child & marvel at how clever they are. (Like how clever my twerp Jackie is to have figured out how to open the screen & glass sliding doors if they are not locked.)

Routine helps, outside time is a godsend & like I said interactive toys. I like to give my twerp a giant gift bag or a box or a tub with toys and tissue paper in it, to play with.

Here was Dante’s favorite spot. He would go in the backyard and hunt every afternoon.

I'm so sorry for your loss of Dante. It's hard to think about. I miss our 12-year-old dilute torti so much now that she has gone to live with my daughter. I really did realize how much I would miss her and I hate to think of her ever being gone. I'm glad, though, that my daughter is getting that time with the cat that was her baby and the subject of so many of her childhood school papers.

Is Jackie an only cat? Was Dante an only cat? When Dante hunted out in the back yard, was he able to be off harness or was he restrained somehow?

Thank you for trying so hard to help. I really do appreciate it.

 

[danteshuman]

Thank you for your kind words.

Dante wasn’t an only cat. Jackie is but he visits his brother (& 3 other cats, plus 2 puppies & 2 kids) every weekend. Mainly so his brother and him can wrestle and love on each other.

Dante I trained to stay in the yard but it was very difficult. From kitten hood (4 months) if he went over the fence, I would catch him and bring him in for the day. It is easier to build a catio or a fence topper that keeps cats from jumping the fence (you can see how to on YouTube.) Jackie is harness trained but can escape any harness. So I need to be close by and luckily he lets me catch him (just stay calm and walk calmly behind them until they let you approach.... then put their harness on & continue walking them. You have to reward them letting you catch them.) Jackie doesn’t escape mid walks he escapes when he is on the long lead by wrapping it around a bush then wiggling backwards out of his harness before I can get him untangled. So just keep a close eye on them on them when they are out hunting things.

I think your girls can love on each other and be friends. Hyper cats are great if they have an outlet for their energy. Hyper cats turn naughty & destructive when bored.

That tissue paper or newspaper in a large box with toys in it is a life saver for bored cats. I like to put in a few noisy toys (Kringle balls or jingle balls), a catnip toy and one or two of his favorite rabbit fur mice. Then he can hunt for his toys.

Here are Jackie (lynx... you can see the hyper siamese in him) and his brother Nick (black) as you can see they are bff. Plus they love to wrestle/play fight. I got Jackie this problem child sweatshirt 2 years ago. It made me laugh because it is true. Yes he wears it when it is cold.

Now it is an annoying destructive problem but 10 or 20 years from now you will laugh over your hyper cat stories.

 

[Anne2021]

So a possibility has presented itself... my adult daughter (20 years old, in her own house, and a cat lover) has offered to take new kitty to her house and see how it goes. I'm not sure whether to take her up on the offer. I am curious if my first kitty would relax and stop with the scratching and so on or if she would put off signals of being lonely. My daughter has a 13-year-old female she rescued earlier this year who still has a playful spirit, as well as the 12-year-old female and 11-year-old male that were part of our family when she grew up, who she took to live with her six and half weeks ago. Those three are getting along pretty well. We've talked about whether a more experienced and confident crew might be able to better keep new kitty in line than my "first kitty", who is on her own and a little smaller than new kitty. The 13-year-old is about the same size as new kitty, who is 9.5 lbs. The other two are 16 lbs. each and not likely to allow themselves to be pushed around. (I know, I tried and tried with the weight loss and we never conquered the issue). They are good-natured cats, but have fairly strong personalities themselves and have kept each other in line over the years. I am considering it. I know a lot of life changes can be stressful for cats, but I am trying to find the best long-term solution for everybody. Does anyone have any experience that comes to mind that might apply to the scenario we are considering? Any helpful thoughts? (The most cats at one time indoors that I have had is three and four sounds overwhelming, especially when it comes to the litter box).

 

[Maria Bayote]

Among my cats, my Graham (2+ years old) is the most hyper. The only time the house is at peace is when she is sleeping. That cat of mine has knocked off decors, destroyed at least 3 TV sets so far, furnitures, expensive shoes, almost murdered my budgies (a number of times) etc etc. However, I notice that each time I take in a foster kitty she becomes behaved, only observing the kitty's antics from a distance. So, a distraction like a kitty may do the trick.

 

[Anne2021]

Among my cats, my Graham (2+ years old) is the most hyper. The only time the house is at peace is when she is sleeping. That cat of mine has knocked off decors, destroyed at least 3 TV sets so far, furnitures, expensive shoes, almost murdered my budgies (a number of times) etc etc. However, I notice that each time I take in a foster kitty she becomes behaved, only observing the kitty's antics from a distance. So, a distraction like a kitty may do the trick.

Oh, my! That's a lot of destruction! That is interesting about how she changes when there is a foster kitty. I know the cats at my daughter's house are seniors, but with it being three of them and one of her, I thought that might help.

 

[Maria Bayote]

That's a lot of destruction! That is interesting about how she changes when there is a foster kitty.

I am quite perplexed too, on why she suddenly behaves when there are are kittens in the house. Yup, I call her my "receipt" cat because she has accumulated a lot of receipts for repairs and purchases for all her damaged items in the house. And yet, I love her to bits. Despite her naughtiness, she is one of the sweetest cats I have come across in my lifetime. Actually, she is also a velcro cat.

 

[danteshuman]

Senior cats tend to not like kittens. So they are probably not going to love your hyper cat unless one of them is hyper to. Also female cats are more likely not to get along. So if you have 2 female cats that get along, I would not mess with it!

Lastly older cats take a way longer introductions, seniors espcially. Senior cats tend to hate change.

I would not rehome your hyper cat to your daughter’s house. If you rehome your hyper cat, it is best to rehome her to people with experience with hyper cats.

Dante was 13.5 years old and he a hyper terror. He gravitated to & liked my hyper kitten Jackie. Dante died shortly after this photo was taken. This is what I mean about hyper liking hyper. The 2 seniors in my mom’s house tolerate but still do not like the 3 year old “kittens”; my hyper cat included. My cat visits Nana’s house every weekend & the longest time between visits is 2 weeks (until covid.) That way everyone remember’s everyone else’s smell. I’m not show if your cst coming home for the weekend will help or hurt because you have a resident cat at home, adding another cat’s scent to the mix.

 

[Anne2021]

danteshuman, thank you so much for sharing your thoughts. What you have said makes sense. I feel like I was already suspecting what you've shared. I just feel so desperate. I wish there had been more information available on Bailey (that's new hyper kitty's name by the way) when I first adopted her. I would read through the shelter's descriptions; some would have more and some less. The cats that had spent time in foster homes had longer descriptions. With the longer descriptions, it was so easy to tell the ones that I knew would not be a fit for our home. If I were to write a description of her and what she needs, I would know it's not me. Part of me wanted to just have Bailey go to my daughter's for a week and just stay separate from the other cats there so I could think more clearly without Bailey here and also to see if my first kitty seemed relieved and relaxed at the quiet or if she put off signs of missing Bailey.

I am just desperate at this point. I am getting more and more tired by the day. I am currently looking for a job as well with the need to work from home, transitioning from stay-at-home mom (recently divorced) to working full-time now that my last child has graduated high school. I share that because I am not yet employed and I am already overstimulated mentally from the play sessions and because she follows me most of the time I move from one room to another looking at me and meowing at me for something to do. Once I am working 40 hours a week, I don't see how it will work. I feel so guilty and wrong for just wanting her to stay in another room, for wanting to be alone like I used to be. She is almost always there. If she falls asleep, she can tell as soon as I move. If I try to move to another room to do something else, just like that, she is wide awake, following and expectant again. She waits outside the bathroom door. And this is not because she wants to be held or snuggled - she wants action! She has changed the dynamic between first kitty and me, which was close and sweet but low-key. First kitty would spend some time alone and also liked to spend time with me. If I moved from doing housework to working at my desk, she might notice after 10 or 15 minutes and call out with a cute non-meow vocalization looking for me until I called out to tell her where I was. Then she would jump up on the desk and give me a nose bump or two and want to play for a few minutes and then rest across the room. Other times she could hang out in another room napping apart for well over an hour or more. Our play naturally occurred throughout the day or she would bring me a favorite toy and I'd throw it. Sessions were short and she would stop when satisfied and I could continue working - just happy to be sharing a room together - and also okay with not always being in the same room. Now, Bailey is almost always there. Those natural pleasant times with my first kitty are all but gone or stolen, stilted moments when I put Bailey in another room for a little bit, where she is not happy. I miss what first kitty and I had and if I know her at all, she does, too. The senior cats were not like this either. They could do their own thing or sometimes hang in the same room looking out the window, maybe curl up on the bed or couch or spend hours completely disinterested in what I was doing or where I was (except when it was time for food). There was some play with them, too, but not a lot. They liked time on the patio, but life was calm and laid-back for the most part and everybody seemed happy.

The thought of re-homing her is terrible. The thought of her ending up in a situation where she wouldn't be well-cared-for or where she would be declawed or any number of horrible scenarios scares me. She's easy to love and get attached to and care about. If I knew a loving, cat-loving family with energy and the stimulation she deeply needs, it would be a no-brainer - multiple people to meet her needs instead of just me, multiple people for her to check on to see what they're doing when the first one is boring or working, maybe even a dog. I don't doubt she would be happier and have her needs met better in such a home, but I have no idea how to find it. I keep trying to make this work.

 

[Anne2021]

Senior cats tend to not like kittens. So they are probably not going to love your hyper cat unless one of them is hyper to. Also female cats are more likely not to get along. So if you have 2 female cats that get along, I would not mess with it!

Lastly older cats take a way longer introductions, seniors espcially. Senior cats tend to hate change.

I would not rehome your hyper cat to your daughter’s house. If you rehome your hyper cat, it is best to rehome her to people with experience with hyper cats.

Dante was 13.5 years old and he a hyper terror. He gravitated to & liked my hyper kitten Jackie. Dante died shortly after this photo was taken. This is what I mean about hyper liking hyper. The 2 seniors in my mom’s house tolerate but still do not like the 3 year old “kittens”; my hyper cat included. My cat visits Nana’s house every weekend & the longest time between visits is 2 weeks (until covid.) That way everyone remember’s everyone else’s smell. I’m not show if your cst coming home for the weekend will help or hurt because you have a resident cat at home, adding another cat’s scent to the mix.

Also, I meant to tell you, thank you, for sharing the picture of Dante and Jackie. They are so beautiful. Your pictures are wonderful.

 

[danteshuman]

Wow your life is going through 2 major transitions right now and you do not need more stress!

The least stressful situation if you are handy is building Bailey a catio or letting her have a screened in porch. Bird feeders outside a screened window can help entertain your cats.

Normally I would say getting a playful male kitten would be the solution but that is $$$ and stress. Plus the kittens have proven to me that boy & girl cats play differently. Cami wants to play hide & seek. Nick & Jackie want to play wrestlemania!!! So if Bailey likes to wrestle/play fight a neutered male kitten who is playful would help.

Rehoming her to a house that has a playful young resident cat may be the best solution. If so, no judgement. I had to rehome a cat once.

Maybe start looking for a new home for Bailey now? Meanwhile take her on a short harness walk once or twice a day? It sounds weird but a hyper cat often will get more from a 15 minute walk then a 15 minute play session. Especially if they already have a play partner.

 

[Anne2021]

Wow your life is going through 2 major transitions right now and you do not need more stress!

The least stressful situation if you are handy is building Bailey a catio or letting her have a screened in porch. Bird feeders outside a screened window can help entertain your cats.

Normally I would say getting a playful male kitten would be the solution but that is $$$ and stress. Plus the kittens have proven to me that boy & girl cats play differently. Cami wants to play hide & seek. Nick & Jackie want to play wrestlemania!!! So if Bailey likes to wrestle/play fight a neutered male kitten who is playful would help.

Rehoming her to a house that has a playful young resident cat may be the best solution. If so, no judgement. I had to rehome a cat once.

Maybe start looking for a new home for Bailey now? Meanwhile take her on a short harness walk once or twice a day? It sounds weird but a hyper cat often will get more from a 15 minute walk then a 15 minute play session. Especially if they already have a play partner.

Thank you so much for your reply. I am not trying to be obstructionist, but I am not handy when it comes to building things like a catio. I can do a lot of my own repairs around the house, but I am not a builder. Part of the lack of incentive here is that I live in the Midwest. We are now heading into the kind of weather where our highs will be in the 40s a lot. Then there will be ice and snow, and it's only downhill from there temperature-wise until at least March.

Thank you so much for saying no judgment as to rehoming. I don't even know where to begin to look for a home for her. The humane society where I got her says in the contract that I have to contact them if I can't keep her. It doesn't say I have to take her back there, though. I'm scared to take a step in that direction. I want to choose the people if I can't work this out. I know that is asking a lot.

My adult son has been taking her outside for me for 10 minutes or so at a time to help her get used to the harness. They haven't walked around much, but it is outdoor time.

 

[danteshuman]

I lived in Denmark. During the winter their was a single line of paw prints from my in-laws house to a bit in the backyard & back. The cats had zero interest in freezing their tails off, besides going to the bathroom. So a walk may be your best bet.

A terriam with crickets (or some guppies) might help. I would still hang bird feeders in front of a window. That way the cats can sit or lay comfortably while hunting birds outside. Squirrels really love unsalted peanuts and whole walnuts. I buy “my” squirrels bags of unsalted peanuts from the $ store. I also buy compressed bird seed columns that have chili oil in it (mammals taste the and the birds don’t. That way squirrels don’t eat all your bird food.)

 

[danteshuman]

& I’m quite happy to live back in Southern California! Though becuase I live in the hills it gets quite chilly at night during the cold months, with highs as low as 50F. Becuase my guy is used to temperature controlled kitty heaven (for my health reasons) he gets cold easily. Believe it or not but putting this snow blanket on him warms him up so he goes out and plays instead of huddling on my lap or my chest. I got it off chewy for like 20$ ...... given where you live, you might need one for Bailey. I put on top of his harness and it has a hole near the collar, for the leash to go through.

 

[Anne2021]

I am so frustrated with Bailey - the hyper cat. To be honest, I'm not sure it isn't more than hyper. I have poured so much time, energy, and money into making this work. I'm starting to be upset with the humane society for not flagging her as special needs or needing to be in a one-cat household or something. They had her for over two months. As I think back, I do feel that they seemed to look at each other in a knowing way when I said I wanted to see her, and the young woman really pushed her on me instead of the other two cats I met. Maybe it's just wearing on me... I have been talking to my brother about my frustrations and he laughed and said she sounds "just like mom". Our mom almost certainly has borderline personality disorder. I didn't laugh. He's right.

I was at my wit's end after 12 weeks with the way she treats Josie. Then at Christmas my daughter brought her cats over for me to cat-sit while she was out-of-town for a few days. She had three, including the two seniors that used to live with all of us - Stormy and Leo - who left at the same time I got Bailey. Her other cat was a senior she rescued almost a year ago - the sweetest doll ever - next to Josie, of course. I played "musical cats" in different rooms behind closed doors to keep them away from each other since it was only for a few days. My daughter ended up admitting that she doesn't have time for Stormy and Leo and that her rescue kitty would be happier alone with her. I was open to this. I hoped that it might help with Bailey. She wouldn't always have to be where Josie or I am. Well, it's been almost four weeks since integrating everybody. Josie and the seniors started to recognize each other after a few days and re-integrated well. Bailey hissed a bit and took about 10 days to where she could tolerate being out and about with all the cats. Now she seems to be getting worse instead of better about the seniors. She is just picking fights randomly. They aren't like the wrestling matches she forced on Josie. It's not play, even rough and pushy play. She can bring so much tension into a room that Josie turns around and rejects Leo and wants him off my bed just because Bailey is in the room stirring up trouble. If Bailey is not there, Josie is fine with the other two. I don't even want Bailey in my room anymore. It's not like things were good before the seniors came back either.

I have never met a more self-centered cat. The current others (and others I remember having in the past) seem to compromise and do what it takes to live cooperatively together, even if they aren't always bosom buddies. Bailey truly does act in such a way that if I were looking for a human metaphor, I would say she has a personality disorder. I met virtually with a cat behaviorist last week and got more ideas to help. I have ordered some toys and training stuff and I will try - I really will - but I don't hold out much hope and the resentment is growing that if you live with Bailey, everything has to be about Bailey.

 

[danteshuman]

Ummmmm you were in the middle of integrating a new cat and then in the process you brought in 2 news strangers/invaders into her home! I would have told you not to even let other cats into your home to babysit during this process! Ack the poor dear must be even more insecure!

Since the humane society had her for 2 months they may have pushed her for that reason.

I would strongly suggest you seperate her and not allow any physical contact for a few weeks. She may be a cat that needs months to integrate. During that time take her to the vet & get her started on kitty prozac. Prozac takes a couple of weeks to start working completely. If you are lucky you can get it in the cream form that you apply on her ears. If not we can help you give her her medicine (thekittenlady on YouTube just posted a video on 5 ways to give a cat a pill. I suggest you watch it.) After you get her on prozac and integrate her, you may be able to slowly wean her off the prozac in 6 months.

Like I said if I had known about prozac when Dante was young; he would have been on it! (He crossed the bridge 3 years ago.) I will also add that Dante was a terror when he was young but he is my soul kitty! I can not say how much that cat helped me. He got me through the worst year of my life and was the reason I didn’t kill myself to stop the physical pain I was in. So yeah when he was a kitten/teenager I called him my wee terrorist of doom.... but he truly was my cat from heaven! So knowing how precious these hyper cats can be (I willingly adopted hyper cat #2) is why I am urging you to not give up on her. However if you really feel she just is not the right fit then I would still start her on prozac while looking for a new home for her. A home that knows & loves hyper cats.

In the meantime have you tried giving her an hour a day in your backyard on a long leash every day? Outside time was what made my punk kitty Dante into a manageable & daily outside time keeps my twerp Jackie from misbehaving. I just read and untangle his leash during his outside time. Jackie has a 22 foot lead leash that I use.

Jackie outside on his leash. He climbs tress sometimes, rolls around in the dirt, watches birds, gets short walks but mainly likes to hide and watch the squirrels & birds. I included one picture of Dante outside (he was trained to stay in the backyard.) That was Dante’s favorite spot in the yard/bird blind.

 

[Anne2021]

Ummmmm you were in the middle of integrating a new cat and then in the process you brought in 2 news strangers/invaders into her home! I would have told you not to even let other cats into your home to babysit during this process! Ack the poor dear must be even more insecure!

Since the humane society had her for 2 months they may have pushed her for that reason.

I would strongly suggest you seperate her and not allow any physical contact for a few weeks. She may be a cat that needs months to integrate. During that time take her to the vet & get her started on kitty prozac. Prozac takes a couple of weeks to start working completely. If you are lucky you can get it in the cream form that you apply on her ears. If not we can help you give her her medicine (thekittenlady on YouTube just posted a video on 5 ways to give a cat a pill. I suggest you watch it.) After you get her on prozac and integrate her, you may be able to slowly wean her off the prozac in 6 months.

Like I said if I had known about prozac when Dante was young; he would have been on it! (He crossed the bridge 3 years ago.) I will also add that Dante was a terror when he was young but he is my soul kitty! I can not say how much that cat helped me. He got me through the worst year of my life and was the reason I didn’t kill myself to stop the physical pain I was in. So yeah when he was a kitten/teenager I called him my wee terrorist of doom.... but he truly was my cat from heaven! So knowing how precious these hyper cats can be (I willingly adopted hyper cat #2) is why I am urging you to not give up on her. However if you really feel she just is not the right fit then I would still start her on prozac while looking for a new home for her. A home that knows & loves hyper cats.

In the meantime have you tried giving her an hour a day in your backyard on a long leash every day? Outside time was what made my punk kitty Dante into a manageable & daily outside time keeps my twerp Jackie from misbehaving. I just read and untangle his leash during his outside time. Jackie has a 22 foot lead leash that I use.

Jackie outside on his leash. He climbs tress sometimes, rolls around in the dirt, watches birds, gets short walks but mainly likes to hide and watch the squirrels & birds. I included one picture of Dante outside (he was trained to stay in the backyard.) That was Dante’s favorite spot in the yard/bird blind.

I know. I brought the other two back because it was definitely in their best interest (and I have a long history with them so have to do what is best for them as well). I did not hesitate though because I actually thought it might help our situation eventually. My daughter didn't have time for them or to deal with integrating them with her rescue cat. There were issues with Stormy not accepting the rescue and Leo was putting on weight and so on. He is already slowly taking it off here. The reason that I went ahead and did it was because I was already thinking that the situation with Bailey and Josie was not going to work and the pressure on Josie to deal with Bailey was heavy. I was already desperate and contemplating giving up (we were at 12 weeks) with no improvement in the ambushing and forcible wrestling and no solution in sight - including a re-homing opportunity. I didn't think we had anything to lose really.

The odd dynamic is that Bailey thinks she was here first (before Stormy and Leo), which, of course, she was. Stormy and Leo have totally re-adjusted to being back here and seem to think they were here first, which they were, sort of. Oddly enough, except for when Bailey starts something and Josie gets confused for a little bit, Josie seems much more relaxed and more like she was before Bailey came since the seniors returned. It's an odd phenomenon. She is playing games she had stopped playing and it's nice to see her almost back to her old self again. The ambushing and forced wrestling etc. continue, and things aren't completely back to normal, but she is better than she was. She was not thriving during Bailey's first 12 weeks here, so this at least is a good thing.

I think you are right about separating Bailey, but she is relentless about clawing at doors and meowing to get in or get out when she knows she is separated (except at night, which has been the routine since she got here and she accepts it so I don't touch that!). I really don't know how to manage separating her with success for any length of time that would be helpful. I want to - I believe you are giving me good advice - I just don't see her going along with it without ripping up carpet or clawing door frames (and I rent). I am - at the behaviorist's advice - trying to hone in on what situations, times, and locations are worse. I'm starting to come up with some patterns - like when I hang out in my bedroom on my computer, eventually all the cats gradually end up in there most of the time (not every time). All four cats in my bedroom is bad. Bailey gets really worked up in that situation. Also, late evening before bedtime gets bad. I'm trying to figure out logistics for avoiding those for sure. I actually looked up Prozac for the first time earlier today. I hate to drug anybody, but this doesn't seem kind either. I keep wondering, is this the kind of situation that the shelters are referring to when they say a cat has to be in a one-cat household/an only cat? Sometimes, I wonder why they didn't make her a "working cat" and how they make that decision. She was picked up as a stray and I think she may have been happier as a working cat.

Putting a cat outside in January weather where I am would vary most days from unkind to downright abusive. We did have a beautiful day in December and my son took her out on the harness and leash, but that was just one day. Also, I live in a townhome that backs up to a commons with grass and trees. I have a patio with a flowerbed (no flowers in the winter), but a long leash would be a problem if she ends up on the neighbors patios. I think we have a "nice" day coming up in a few days so I could take her out. Winter can't last forever.

Beautiful pictures. Thank you for sharing and for replying.

 

[danteshuman]

Hang in there! I would still give prozac a try.... Because it will help her accept the other cats. I know about drugging cats up but it seems kinder than making her a barn cat or rehoming her! plus in 8-12 months you may be able to take her off it.

I rent to, so I hear you on that one. I would try to give your cats extra cat shelves & trees in your bedroom. Try to eliminate no exit areas..... so she can’t trap a cat in a corner.

Dante was a little terror. He would bully his brother and my mom’s senior declawed cat!!! He treated them like living toys. Like he was thinking “hey I’m bored I will wrestle my brother..... whether he wants to play or not!” The senior kitty was more about territory.

If you can install a catio in a window I would. If you can’t bird feeders by a window will entertain the cats through the winter (the birds love my cranberry & nut compressed bird food.... and the grub & nut one.) My cat Jackie is a wuss about the cold in the hills of Southern California. I bought him a snow jacket blanket thing and it keeps him warm (he thinks 50F is freezing! ) in his defense I have medical reasons that I keep my place in the 70’s and that I take him out in the most temperate time of day. It does make me laugh though. When I lived in a cold snowy place the cats went out, went pee & came back in. Just one short line of paw prints in the snow!

 

[Anne2021]

Hang in there! I would still give prozac a try.... Because it will help her accept the other cats. I know about drugging cats up but it seems kinder than making her a barn cat or rehoming her! plus in 8-12 months you may be able to take her off it.

I rent to, so I hear you on that one. I would try to give your cats extra cat shelves & trees in your bedroom. Try to eliminate no exit areas..... so she can’t trap a cat in a corner.

Dante was a little terror. He would bully his brother and my mom’s senior declawed cat!!! He treated them like living toys. Like he was thinking “hey I’m bored I will wrestle my brother..... whether he wants to play or not!” The senior kitty was more about territory.

If you can install a catio in a window I would. If you can’t bird feeders by a window will entertain the cats through the winter (the birds love my cranberry & nut compressed bird food.... and the grub & nut one.) My cat Jackie is a wuss about the cold in the hills of Southern California. I bought him a snow jacket blanket thing and it keeps him warm (he thinks 50F is freezing! ) in his defense I have medical reasons that I keep my place in the 70’s and that I take him out in the most temperate time of day. It does make me laugh though. When I lived in a cold snowy place the cats went out, went pee & came back in. Just one short line of paw prints in the snow!

"He treated them like living toys. Like he was thinking 'hey I’m bored I will wrestle my brother..... whether he wants to play or not!'" - EXACTLY! That's a perfect description of how Bailey treats Josie. Even the look she gets in her eye and the swagger to her approach change. I see her as thinking, "We'll be rough-housing now because I need to. Your consent is not required."

I think with Stormy and Leo some of it is about territory for Bailey. It's worse with Stormy. I'm not surprised. Stormy has an air about her that may be a bit intimidating. She's a gray dilute torti with long hair - she is 14.5 pounds and looks like a woolly mammoth when she hasn't been groomed, like right now. Leo is an orange and white tabby and is 16.6 pounds and is a big softie. (I am more determined than ever to bring their weight down and am making progress since they got back). Leo and Stormy can get into it if she gets to go outside and he doesn't, so he gets grouchy at her, and they have a long history together, but he does not feel that freedom with anyone else. So when Bailey (or Josie if she gets amped up by Bailey) reject Leo, he just submits and runs away. Stormy is a little spitfire. She has always been territorial, but in a guard dog sort of way. Like she would growl at delivery men she could see through the window or when the doorbell rang. Never actually aggressive with people. She would leave the room when company came while Leo was all over company - even strangers - practically molesting them . Stormy accepted Josie easily when I got her as a kitten. She would not accept my daughters rescue (Peaches) who was about the same age as Stormy.

So now that they are back, Stormy and Leo were totally fine with Bailey. They were good with her approaching and sniffing and everything - Stormy really surprised me in that. They pretty much ignored her. Even at first when she would hiss and run, they didn't seem to care. Now, however, Bailey has pushed it a little further and will hiss and stand her ground and sometimes give a quiet growl. Leo will take off. Stormy is nobody's pushover so she is standing her ground and will growl back. There has been some swiping at Stormy on Bailey's part, though I haven't seen any evidence of scratching or injury, but I usually intervene quickly. Most of it happens when I am nearby, which is interesting, but that is also when everyone is gathering closer together instead of doing their own thing.

Stormy just has an aura about her - a strong presence - she talks a lot! Leo is mostly silent. Stormy purrs loudly and easily. If she is in the room, you just know it (usually). (Bailey talks a lot, too). Stormy gets weird after she or Leo go outside and forgets for a few minutes that they're friends. It has never been a real problem because they have a history and they would work it out quickly. We laugh at this because it's just a few minutes and then she is back to normal, but Leo will get that look like uh-oh, Stormy's mad. When I took her and Leo out on a nice day (come to think of it I think we've had two nice days since they came back) and Josie and Bailey were inside the sliding door, she got all territorial looking in at them and I knew she was getting growl-y. I had to call for my son to come down and lock them up so she could come back in. She gets inside and in a few minutes it's over. So even if she's a lovable furball who would totally accept Bailey, I can see why she could be a source of insecurity for Bailey. If they could get some one on one positive experience and energy going, that would help a lot, but not right now, I know.

 

[danteshuman]

Dante picked on his calm and submissive brother Salem. Now they got along fine90% of the time. What worked for me was I gave Salem a safety zone. Basically if Salem was by me, Dante couldn’t pick on him. Also I built up Salem’s confidence by locking Dante out & giving my victim cat’s some one on one play every day for a few weeks. Now Salem quickly learned that I came running to rescue him if he growled. So one day I see Salem in Dante’s spot, growling. The little booger was using me as muscle! I stopped rescuing him when he growled that day. Now I strongly sight blockers to stop a state down.... before the attack. I have used couch pillows. Jackson Galaxy says to use a 4 foot by 4 foot square of cardboard. Sight blockers work great to defuse the situation!

Between all your cats I would put a clean sock over your hand and pet them around their chins and ears. The goal is to get everyone to smell the same & it will help them get along.

I vote let them outside but first lock up your growly miss in a room where she can’t see them out there.

Now Dante did get a scar on his nose when a small scuffle got out of hand with the reformed feral. After that the other cats was the top cat, no more scuffles.So provided it isn’t a true fight, maybe let them scuffle a bit?

Salem & Dante (in picture) liked each other. Honestly I was surprised that Salem grieved for his annoying little brother for a year. In the second picture if you look closely you can see the tiny scar

 

[danteshuman]

Oh & let me tell you the first time I knew Dante would be trouble. So I got Dante at 6 weeks old. Salem (who was a year old) one time gently put his teeth around Dante’s neck & I freaked out! I went super protective & Salem being the sensitive guy he was picked up on it & knew attacking the kitten was forbidden! Then at 8 weeks I hear a meow and I go to find out why Salem is distressed. Imagine my suprise to find this tiny kitten on Salem’s back ...... biting him on his scruff with his little legs dangling over Salem’s sides..... like he is trying to ride him!!! Salem is meowing for help and slowly walking in a circle. At 5 months we had to teach Salem it was ok to fight back.

The point of the story is sometimes it is just a personality mismatch. Salem was to calm & passive. Dante was to insecure, aggressive & hyper. Weirdly enough Dante loved Chester the reformed feral who beat him up years ago It was like his hyper aggressive clicked with the other cat’s brave but I will kick your butt if I have to personality. Before he died Dante was super friendly to one kitten..... the hyper insecure one. It was like they could sense they had the same personality type. (I wound up adopting the hyper trouble maker.)

Now my new hyper trouble maker loves his calm brave brother. However both cats will pick on their passive more skittish sister when they get bored (you will play whether you want to or not.) All three are from the same litter. When the boys have to much energy (usually because if cabin fever) I play with them. Then they leave their sister alone. Now all 3 will cuddle each other, so they like each other. They just annoy/bug their little sister sometimes. We don’t let them bully her/hunt her; so we keep them from picking on her. Which is why I’m not recommending you adopt a kitten who matches your trouble maker’s personality. I would worry that the two cats might bully your senior kitty.

Dante passing the punk torch to Jackie :