Need some help transitioning to Raw Feeding please

vball91

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Hi all, I would love some help transitioning my cat to raw feeding. To give you some background, her name is Aria, and she's about 7 years old. We adopted her when she was about 1 year old from my husband's mother who had taken her in as a stray, but Aria did not like the other 2 cats already in the house. Interestingly enough, when I took her to the vet, she had already been spayed and was pretty healthy so we don't think she was a stray for long. We think she got left behind in a move which happens way too often in our military town. His mother checked all the usual places and posted Found signs/ads, but no one claimed her. When I was visiting one day, I started petting her, and she was so affectionate and cuddly and seemed so interactive, I instantly fell in love with her despite never having had a pet before.

Anyway, for almost 6 years, we have been fortunate that she's been very healthy. She had one upper respiratory infection when she was about 3, but other than that no issues until this past December. Early December, she had a urinary issue of some kind but that went away in a few days. Then right before Christmas, she started eating a lot less and then stopped eating altogether. That same day she had some vomiting and diarrhea so I took her to the vet right away. The vet did X-rays, lab tests and treated her symptoms with pain med, anti-nausea med, antibiotics and fluids. After 36 hours, she started eating and drinking normally and recovered 100% as far as I can tell and is slowly regaining the little bit of weight she lost while she was sick. The X-rays and lab work were all unremarkable except for slightly elevated lipase levels. The vet thinks she might have had pancreatitis but since the fPLI test wasn't done (nor was that suggested), it's not very conclusive. I've since learned that elevated lipase levels can be caused by a lot of things. The vet also suggested switching her to the very expensive kibble that they sold which she said would be better for a cat with pancreatitis. Now that I know better, I've lost faith in this vet (who is new to us because we moved about 6 months ago).

So in my research about cat diseases, I discovered how species inappropriate most commercial pet foods are. I was really quite horrified to learn that I had been feeding her junk food and that that may have contributed to her illnesses. Now that I know better, I want to feed her the best diet that I can. I would love to get her to 100% raw but really would be happy to get at least 50%. I have started feeding her raw tidbits of chicken (less than 10% so I'm not concerned yet with supplements although I have ordered some). I am feeding her approximately 80% canned, 10% raw, 10% kibble right now. All canned and kibble are various grain-free, low starch, high protein, low carb ones with the cans also being BPA and carrageenan free. I am trying out various ones because she doesn't seem to like most of these healthier options. She wants her Fancy Feast/Friskies gravy.

So here are my issues:

1. Before I knew better, I screwed up and fed her a lot of seafood flavored foods because that's what she seemed to prefer. Dr. Pierson is so right about the addictive nature of fish! It's difficult to get her to eat non-seafood flavors now. How do I transition her off? She will eat some raw chicken once in a while. She does seem to like raw egg yolks. She loves raw shrimp of course (and raw squid and cooked shrimp, crab and lobster - all of which are once in a while treats). How bad is non-fish seafood for cats? I couldn't find a lot of info about this. I know that a lot of fish is bad for various reasons, but how much of that applies to non-fish seafood?

2. How do I get her on a 3-4 times a day feeding schedule? Aria is used to having kibble available all day/night and getting fed canned 3-4 times a day. She prefers canned and eats kibble only when there's no canned. She never eats a lot in one feeding. She eats about half an ounce to an ounce tops of canned/raw in one feeding. I could put out 2 ounces of her favorite foods, and she will only eat an ounce tops. 2-3 hours later, she's ready for more food. I tried removing the kibble entirely and have been successful during the day but night is a problem. The first (and only) 2 nights I tried this she woke me up at about 2am both times because she was hungry even though I had fed her right before bed. I started putting out a tiny bit of kibble before bed to tide her over, and that seems to be working. Although I would love to remove kibble entirely, I also need sleep! I have ordered some Wysong Epigen 90 to be her only kibble which I will keep at less than 10% of her food while I transition her to raw. Is there a way to change her eating habits so she will eat more and be able to go 8 hours without a meal? And is that even desirable to do given her clear preference for small but frequent meals? I'm fortunate in that I work part-time and mostly from home, so my schedule does allow for this, but feeding less frequently would be much easier for raw. Also, I do travel occasionally for work, and I need to make feeding easy for my husband when I'm gone.

3. Not an issue you all can really help me with, but I'm also looking for a holistic vet in my area that will support and work with me on raw feeding.

Is there anything else I could be doing to give my cat a better diet? Sorry for the long post, and if you've read this far, thanks for any advice you can give me.
 

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Most of us now feeding raw know exactly what you're going through. :hugs: I free fed my cats prescription kibble for 8 years. :sigh: But we learn, and that's all we can do. :) :rub:

OK. On the transition to timed feedings. I started by pulling the kibble during the day, and leaving out a measured amount at night. That was the first step. I work from home, so had the luxury of feeding them multiple small meals a day. But yes, the hardest part is getting them to eat enough at a "meal." :nod: Basically, you just have to work up to it. The more small meals you can feed on a schedule, the better. Since you're home a lot, this will really help. I think it took me about a month to get them on a schedule, but I pushed it harder than they really wanted to go. And don't worry about the mornings/afternoons or days when you're not there to give the scheduled meals you normally would - on those days, just let hunger work in your favor.

I just remembered: during the transition to timed meals, when I was working to switch them to only canned food, I used to give them little treats on a schedule, and because you're switching to raw, freeze dried meat treats will work wonderfully for this. Then I began dropping the treat times, letting hunger work to help get them to eat a little more at the meals.

My cats preferred being able to nibble all day, and they're doing just fine on three meals a day. :nod: I feed them the equivalent of before work, after work, and before bed. And raw is SO satisfying for them, that our first night on 100% raw was the first night that Flowerbelle didn't tromp all over me, rip at my hair, and push everything off my bedside table to let me know she wanted food. I never got up to give her food, but that never stopped her. I always ended up pulling the covers completely over my head :lol3: but I never got a full night's sleep. :rolleyes:

I slowly reduced the amount of dry food I left out at night, and as they ate more at "meals," I began dropping a meal here and there.

Hopefully Ritz will chime in on how to break the fish addiction. I do know that shrimp are high in magnesium, so not good for a FLUTD kitty. I do remember discussing lobster and crab, and they have the same issue. Squid, I don't know. I do know there's a commercial raw food, Wild Kitty (wildly expensive!) that has clams in every product. They show how high in taurine they are, and I've never looked at the rest of the analysis though.

On the other hand... you can work with that. Freeze dried shrimp, cod, and salmon are sold as pet treats. Things like this make GREAT "toppers" for introducing new foods. I use freeze dried chicken, chicken liver, and beef liver. They crumble into dust quite easily, so you can make the food smell like whatever you're using, but by using very little of it. I've been feeding raw for a year now, and some of the kitties still need toppers to get them going - or to finish. :lol3: The way I figure it, even if I have to use something questionable, like Fortiflora (with animal digest - what they spray on kibble to make it so appetizing), overall, they're eating SO much healthier than they were. :)

OH! She likes kibble... so maybe consider Fortiflora as a topper for non-fish wet food. :nod: Just tear off a corner of the little packet (don't follow the directions for using it as a probiotic), and "fluff" it over the food. We call this "flortification." :lol3:
 
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vball91

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Thanks Laurie! I was hoping you would respond to my thread. The suggestion of dried shrimp is genius! I think I can find some at the Asian market easily, just need to check the sodium content. Yesterday, I minced pieces of a raw shrimp and soaked them in a tbsp of water for a minute then mixed it up with an ounce of chopped chicken thighs, and that worked beautifully. She ate almost all of it. Crumbled dried shrimp would be even easier and better since I wouldn't need as much hopefully.

I have ordered Wysong's Call of the Wild to start balancing her all meat raw meals until I can start adding organs and bone. I've heard some cats love the taste, so I'm hoping that will apply to Aria. I'm going to try a little Cornish game hen today.

The dried shrimp suggestion made me think of another type of topper that I think would work well for Aria. Is there a beef jerky type treat/food that's safe for cats? Without the excessive sodium and nitrates? Whenever I eat beef jerky, she makes it really clear she wants some. I have mostly stopped eating it at home because of it. I have given her a tiny bit of it before, and she loved it. I had to hide the bag.

And also I did check that site for holistic vets, and there's only 1 listed for my city. I have been talking to her via email, and she seems pretty knowledgeable about raw feeding and would work with me on it. It isn't full service though (no dental cleaning for example), but it may work.
 

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Aw, that's a bummer the holistic vet isn't at a full service practice. But she is a DVM?

I'm jealous you've got Asian market access. You'll be able to find all kinds of fun things to experiment with. :lol3:

On the jerky treats... I'd skip them, unless you can find some made for pets, that are made in the U.S. with only ingredients sourced from the U.S. There have just been too many pets dying or getting seriously ill from jerky treats made in China. :( I'd try the freeze dried stuff first. It's not the same as food with "ingredients" you need to worry about, you know?

:vibes: :vibes: :vibes: she'll like the Call of the Wild. Most of mine do. Of my two pickiest cats, one does, one doesn't. :lol3: Let us know how it goes!
 
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As far as vets go, my new vet isn't a holistic vet but he was very impressed by my cats and the fact that I feed raw. I was prepared to defend the raw, and instead he praised me for it and called in the rest of the vet techs to look at my cats' eyes, teeth, coat, and skin. Maybe some phone calls might be helpful?
 
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vball91

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The holistic vet I'm talking to is a DVM. I am pretty impressed with her answers so far, so I am hopeful. I will take Aria there for her next annual exam and hope she doesn't need a dental cleaning.
 

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Oh absolutely go where you and the vet can work as a team! I was only commenting since dentals may be needed. FWIW, the vet was impressed that mine didn't need it. Hope you find the same!
 
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vball91

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Ok, I might have spoken too soon. Aria vomited after eating the raw Cornish hen and shrimp mixture which was fine 2 day ago. She seems fine and actually ate the little bit she had left in her bowl afterwards with no problems. I'm not sure if the raw bothered her or something else. Two other possibilities:

1. She did not eat any of the little bit of kibble I've been leaving out during the night (so we can get some sleep). Plus she did not eat her breakfast canned. She's been very picky about the healthier canned food I've been giving her, but since I'm trying to get her on a feeding schedule, I didn't offer her anything else until lunch. She seemed to love the raw mixture and ate most of it. Not too fast because she's never been a scarf and barf cat. So, it may just have been too long between meals, and the acid build-up caused the vomiting. But I'm not sure why she didn't eat the kibble or breakfast this morning.

2. As I said, she's been picky about canned food lately, so last night I broke down and gave her a tsp of her "crack" Friskies gravy which I'm trying so hard to get her off of. She hasn't had any Friskies or Fancy Feast canned in over 3 weeks so maybe that upset her stomach and caused the lack of appetite during the night and this morning?

Ack, this is so hard. I so wish she could tell me what's wrong.
 

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Was the meal fed on schedule? Especially those first couple of months, as they adjust to the more acidic nature of the diet, if a meal is fed late, they can vomit from the acid build-up.

Of course, it really could be the gravy you fed her. I did that to Tuxedo. For his "gotcha day" I figured I'd give him a treat: Fancy Feast. He had diarrhea from eating it. I felt so bad!
 
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vball91

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Yes, it was on a schedule, but because she didn't eat at breakfast time, it was probably 14 hours since she had eaten. Her poop was a little softer and smellier than usual, so I'm thinking it was the gravy. Bad mommy!

I'm going to get rid of the gravy so I'm not tempted to give it to her again.
 

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It sounds like it was a combination of both then - I missed the part where you said she didn't eat her breakfast. :anon: Even though the meal was on schedule, 14 hours is a long time without food during a raw transition. (And the gravy probably didn't help. ;) ).
 
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vball91

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Yay. No vomiting today.


She seems to be rejecting all her healthier canned options.
  She did eat some more raw Cornish hen with a little FD beef topper this morning with no issues. I'm daring to hope she's liking the raw better than canned right now. I'm still leaving out a little kibble during the night, but as soon as the Call of the Wild gets here, I'm going to feed a lot more raw and remove the kibble entirely. I did order a few more toppers to try and am going to the Asian market tomorrow. Is it too soon to introduce raw beef?
 

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YAY! :clap: That's great news!!!!!

Well, given she just had an upset tummy, I might hold off a couple of days on introducing anything new. Beef didn't go over well here, but many kitties tolerate it well and love it! I think the best idea is to try a small amount of a new protein mixed with one you know they do well with - make the meal 25% or less of the new one to see how it goes.

At least it's easier to clean up raw vomit than food-coloring vomit (though it can be stickier. :rolleyes: ).

FYI, when she's eating enough raw at all her meals to provide her daily nutritional needs, if you time the meals correctly, I expect you'll find she does just fine without that kibble at night. :nod: Our first day on 100% raw was the first day no one woke me up early for breakfast! :clap:
 
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vball91

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FYI, when she's eating enough raw at all her meals to provide her daily nutritional needs, if you time the meals correctly, I expect you'll find she does just fine without that kibble at night.
Our first day on 100% raw was the first day no one woke me up early for breakfast!
I am so looking forward to that day!
 
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vball91

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Laurie, that dried shrimp idea of yours worked like a charm on Aria! Thanks so much for that. It really is genius. Today, she ate some of the diced raw chicken thighs, and when she seemed to lose interest in it halfway through as usual, I sprinkled one crumbled up tiny dried shrimp on the rest of it, and she ate the rest of it!. I was really surprised at how little it took. This bag is going to last me forever. I froze most of it. I think this is really going to help her eat enough to get on a better timed schedule.

On another positive note, although I'm still leaving a little bit of kibble out at night, she seems to be eating less and less of it. As soon as the COTW gets here, I'm going to start all raw and remove the kibble entirely.
 

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:clap: :clap: :clap: Yep, that's the beauty of freeze dried stuff as toppers - takes SO little of it! It seems they just need their food to smell "right." :lol3:
 
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vball91

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Well, Aria loved COTW, so much so that she licked it all off the chicken, leaving most of the chicken behind of course, the stinker. I topped it with bonito flakes and got her to eat most of the rest of the chicken that way. I'm going to try
another meat soon.
 

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:flail: Oh that's a good one! :lol3:

Yep, make sure she eats the meat with the COTW - don't want all that calcium without the meat. So glad the bonito flakes worked their magic!

(Sorry, that was one that hadn't occurred to me - none of mine pulled that trick! :lol3: ).
 
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