missy sudden behavior change: no longer eating breakfast, just hides

[louisstools]

I'll try an summarize up my girl missy...12 years old, diabetic, arthritis, zero interest in food. very low to no appetite. gets mirataz daily (for 2+ years) to force her to eat. Just ZERO interest in ANY food. On a good day she's mostly tricked, coaxed, and persuaded to eat. She never eats on her own and when she does eat I'm right there next to her bent over petting her, shaking the bowl, and moving the kibble around with my finger to keep her enticed. This cat's lack of appetite is unlike anything any of our vets have seen or our behaviorist has seen.

For the past 3 years we've had this routine in the mornin where I'd wake up, feed her, go shower, then feed her again, and then we would play and snuggle for a half hour and then do another feeding and then play and snuggle for a half hour and do another feeding. Then she would go to nap and I'd go on with my day. It was exhausting but that's what it took to get 0.8oz of kibble into her by weight/scale. If we didn't do that she'd just not eat anything or if she did eat it would be ~5 kibble. As I've said, she has no interest in food.

Fast forward to earlier this week and Thursday she decided she didn't want to do breakfast and just went to her nap closet after I got out of the shower. Weird. I yanked her out and tried for the next hour to get her to eat. There was fighting and yelling and I eventually gave up. Friday was normal. Saturday she pulled the same stunt, she just wanted to hide after I got out of the shower. I didn't fight her but the rest of the day had to put more energy into getting calories into her. Instead of 1 dose of appetite stimulant she got 6 b/c that is what it took to keep her motivated to eat.

Now this morning...the same thing. She seemed happy and normal but after my shower she just ran into her nap closet. I had to yank her out just to give her the appetite stimulant and insulin. Frankly I'm not sure if she ate enough for me to give her the insulin but if it makes her sick maybe that will teach her to eat her damn breakfast.

The breakfast meals are about 45% of her total calorie intake for the day. So when she does poorly this makes the rest of the day difficult. I like her to get 1.1oz by weight/scale into her as that makes the rest of the day manageable. Much less than that and now she has to "make up" meals. When she's eating only 0.3oz like she has today and the other two bad mornings that puts me into a situation where I have to drug the cat more with appetite stimulant to keep her enticed and then spend my day trying to get her to eat every 90 minutes.

I've paged our vet and behaviorist and I am waiting to hear from them, as it's early and Sunday. This behavior is just devastating. It was likely inevitable that she would get completely turned off to eating considering all the energy, tricks, and fighting I have to do to her to get her to eat. The behaviorist has mentioned a few times she is surprised the cat tolerates everything so well and maybe we've reached a point the cat isn't.

 

[Ylang Ylang]

Could she have a dental issue? Or a stomach issue that flares at times, especially when stressed?
My favorite cat/person in the world (the tux tabby in my profile photo, adopted at 12wo) was like this; it was very frustrating, especially because administering pills was tricky. He had, almost all of his adult life, elevated cholesterol, and only after he died @13yo (he had a massive seizure) did they update his Basepaws account, and it turned out he had a form of porphyria. He received ultrasounds and was reviewed for surgery, but that was never necessary, and those many vet visits made him and me miserable. One vet even insisted he had a kidney neoplasm, which he didn't. We had switched proteins; ultimately, ID food was still best. I got mackerel and sardines for him, and an Aussie friend sent me something similar to Churu when I had not heard about Churu. I have yet to meet a cat that doesn't go bonkers for Churu. One of our current toms has FLUTD and eats tiny portions a million times daily. Her not eating is not a good sign, but you know this. Does she drink water and go to the litter box? I hope the vet has answers that will help her feel better. Please keep us posted!

 

[FeebysOwner]

It was likely inevitable that she would get completely turned off to eating considering all the energy, tricks, and fighting I have to do to her to get her to eat.

Given how you described the current situation, I'd say you are right. You can't fight with a cat to get them to eat without expecting it to backfire eventually. Apparently, the behaviorist thinks so too.

I don't think overdosing her with an appetite stimulant is the answer - or a good thing to do. It may actually be harmful. So, please let your vet know that you've been doing this. There are a couple of other options besides mirtazapine/mirataz, which I think I recall that being what you are using. One is Elura but that has mixed results from members on this site about its usefulness/effectiveness. The other one I know of is Cyproheptadine, which is actually an antihistamine that works as an appetite stimulant.

Is Missy maintaining her weight? Does she vomit at all? Any litter box issues? Is she on any other meds, besides insulin? I am sorry, but I can't recall what, if any, medical tests have been run on her over the past 2-3 years to help try to identify what might be behind her lack of interest in eating. I presume she is regularly checked for her glucose levels given she is on insulin. I know you resorted to a behaviorist but that doesn't seem to have panned out much in terms of results - that is why I am asking about the medical aspect.

 

[louisstools]

FeebysOwner We happen to have a vet appointment this coming week so I'll be sure to let the doctor know I've been having to up her dosage, some days quite a lot. I'm pretty sure I've mentioned this before at one of our other visits this year but I'll be clear about it.

I don't know those other drugs but one problem I have is that I can't pill her. And she doesn't do treats or really care for food so I can't sneak it in something. Are those other drugs ear ointments too? (If you know offhand)

Her weight is a slow decrease. No vomiting. No litter box issues. No other meds. As far as tests go, everything possible blood work wise (all negative/clean) and ultrasound. She's in great health, sadly. Her glucose get regularly checked by the vet every 3 months and it's been fine since we got her insulin dose dialed in.

The behaviorist has been helpful but it's a slow process because the cat is really resistant to change and then every few months something happens and then we have to pause to allow the cat to settle. We've really lost all of 2024 due to the cat really getting impossible back in February and then the diabetes that took the spring and summer.

 

[FeebysOwner]

I take it back about Elura, as I just came across the fact that it should not be used in cats with diabetes as it has a temporary impact on glucose levels. You could still ask the vet about it, but that may be what they say too.

Cyproheptadine comes in tablets, but can be compounded into liquid and powder forms, as well as transdermal pens. So, the latter would likely be what you would prefer. I don't know how many local pharmacies would have it, but Wedgewood Pharmacy, which has locations and shipping US-wide, does. I don't expect it to be 'cheap' though.

I also don't remember what all different foods you have tried, up to and including canned ones (vs. dry food), but did you ever give baby food meat (Gerber Stage 2 or Beechnut Stage 1) a shot? All but the chicken version can be supplemented to make them complete for a cat by adding EZ Complete. They are nothing more than meat and water, but Gerber does have cornstarch, should that be an issue with her diabetes. You can ask the vet.

My cat got to the point of liking very few canned foods, so she probably received half of her calories from these. And, she actually ate them quicker than she would the canned cat food. They range anywhere from 50 - 80 calories in a 2.5 oz jar. Feeby would eat less than 3oz of canned cat food over the course of an entire day compared to nearly 5oz of baby food meat in about 2 hours (2.5oz AM, 2.5oz PM).

 

[louisstools]

Could she have a dental issue? Or a stomach issue that flares at times, especially when stressed?
My favorite cat/person in the world (the tux tabby in my profile photo, adopted at 12wo) was like this; it was very frustrating, especially because administering pills was tricky. He had, almost all of his adult life, elevated cholesterol, and only after he died @13yo (he had a massive seizure) did they update his Basepaws account, and it turned out he had a form of porphyria. He received ultrasounds and was reviewed for surgery, but that was never necessary, and those many vet visits made him and me miserable. One vet even insisted he had a kidney neoplasm, which he didn't. We had switched proteins; ultimately, ID food was still best. I got mackerel and sardines for him, and an Aussie friend sent me something similar to Churu when I had not heard about Churu. I have yet to meet a cat that doesn't go bonkers for Churu. One of our current toms has FLUTD and eats tiny portions a million times daily. Her not eating is not a good sign, but you know this. Does she drink water and go to the litter box? I hope the vet has answers that will help her feel better. Please keep us posted!

She has had dental issues in the past but only has 4 teeth left. The stomach issue when stressed is interesting...I do wonder if something is now triggering stress for her in the morning. She drinks water ok and does her litters fine. She just has a really low appetite.

I've tried giving her Churu and she wouldn't eat it. She sniffed it once and walked away. She's REALLY picky.

 

[louisstools]

FeebysOwner - This is going back to Winter 2021 but I think we tried every wet food out there. Couldn't find one that she liked consistently. We've only tried the one kibble (her current RX for UTI) but that's mostly because she's been on that since 2013. She may like other kibbles but we haven't tried them. We have not tried baby food, I'll ask the vet about that.

I'm hoping we can find some medical reason for this sudden change instead of it being a behavior problem. Those are just so hard to change.

 

[FeebysOwner]

The stomach issue when stressed is interesting...I do wonder if something is now triggering stress for her in the morning.

If I understand your process, she is doing 'OK' with that first round of food. It is when you try round 2 once you are out of the shower that she is hiding and you are getting resistance. Perhaps, the rounds are too close together and she is not interested in eating more in that short of a period of time? That alone could cause stress, especially since she is not food driven.

This is going back to Winter 2021 but I think we tried every wet food out there. Couldn't find one that she liked consistently. We've only tried the one kibble (her current RX for UTI) but that's mostly because she's been on that since 2013. She may like other kibbles but we haven't tried them. We have not tried baby food, I'll ask the vet about that. I'm hoping we can find some medical reason for this sudden change instead of it being a behavior problem. Those are just so hard to change.

If I had tried to feed Feeby the same canned food all the time, I would have not been able to get her to eat it consistently either. She was on a rotation of 7 - 10 different canned foods in order to keep her eating any of them. She never received the same food two days in a row for that 7 - 10 day span. I only bought from local pet stores so I could buy one or two cans of the same thing at one time, as I could not possibly have ordered her food in bulk. I also always bought 3oz cans, because some amount of that was going in the disposal at the end of each day. With all the experimentation, I learned her preferences - for her it was pate only, and mostly beef or chicken or a combination of them. Once that was figured out, that is what I would look for when one of her foods in rotation fell out of favor.

 

[louisstools]

FeebysOwner Yeah, the breakfast routine for the past 3 years has been: wake up and feed the cat...then shower, then feed her and then snuggle, then play/feed/snuggle, then play/feed. She got 4 feedings about a half hour apart each with lots of attention. She also got her medicines.

Did Feeby pass? I haven't been on here as much and may have missed that.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Have you tried switching her dry food to a much higher caloric food? Especially since she has diabetes, a higher protein, less carb dry food might be the ticket here. I know you said she is on a prescription food for a UTI back in 2013, but does she actually have FLUTD or did she have crystals or what? If not, then a switch might be good for both her diabetes AND help with her weight gain. Some dry foods are so high in calories the portions are to be only around 1/8 to 1/4 cup PER DAY!!!!!!!!!

 

[FeebysOwner]

Did Feeby pass? I haven't been on here as much and may have missed that.

Yes, she did - 7/20/2024. I haven't made a thread about it, just have been alluding to it when I use examples of things I did for her in other members' threads, but now in past tense. She had a lot of medical issues (diabetes was NOT one of them, just to clear that up for you) and was 19+ yo, almost 20+ yo. I guess it all just finally caught up with her. She had been in a slow decline for many months, but I actually wasn't expecting it when it happened. Long story short, she apparently started having seizures - very fast and quick recovery from (matter of a minute or two). It was the 4th one that lasted much longer, and she just wasn't able to pull out of it.

I do think mrsgreenjeens comments are something else to consider...

 

[louisstools]

Have you tried switching her dry food to a much higher caloric food? Especially since she has diabetes, a higher protein, less carb dry food might be the ticket here. I know you said she is on a prescription food for a UTI back in 2013, but does she actually have FLUTD or did she have crystals or what? If not, then a switch might be good for both her diabetes AND help with her weight gain. Some dry foods are so high in calories the portions are to be only around 1/8 to 1/4 cup PER DAY!!!!!!!!!

no, we have not. She had the crystals. She also has a very low thirst drive and the particular food she’s on makes her drink more. I can bring this up with the vet and see what she says. The calorie density was an issue with the wet food because that stuff is so poor about it. Like a much higher density dry food would make life a lot easier. She wants to eat five kibble that’s fine because somehow that five kibble has 30 cal.

 

[louisstools]

Yes, she did - 7/20/2024. I haven't made a thread about it, just have been alluding to it when I use examples of things I did for her in other members' threads, but now in past tense. She had a lot of medical issues (diabetes was NOT one of them, just to clear that up for you) and was 19+ yo, almost 20+ yo. I guess it all just finally caught up with her. She had been in a slow decline for many months, but I actually wasn't expecting it when it happened. Long story short, she apparently started having seizures - very fast and quick recovery from (matter of a minute or two). It was the 4th one that lasted much longer, and she just wasn't able to pull out of it.

I do think mrsgreenjeens comments are something else to consider...

I’m sorry to hear that. I know by how you described the care that you gave her what she meant to you.

 

[silent meowlook]

Hi. It sounds like you need a referral to a veterinary specialist. There is allot more going on with her than a regular veterinarian can handle. This is obvious by the lack of improvement in her well being.

Are you testing her glucose at home?

There can be allot going on. Hypoglycemia, DKA, pancreatitis, yo name a few.

Your cat is not doing this to annoy you. There is definitely something really wrong with her.

 

[lisahe]

Just a thought here: Is there any possibility that Missy might be even slightly constipated? Constipation can really cut a cat's willingness to eat. Our Ireland has had this problem on and off, and her main symptom is usually pickiness or not eating enough. She generally poops pretty regularly, though her stool is sometimes in the "1" category of this analysis:
Cat Poop: Health Insights, Cat Poop Chart, Problems, And More
Slippery elm bark helps keep her more regular. So does the fact that she actually enjoys drinking water, particularly from a fountain. And water is why I mention constipation since you said Missy doesn't have a strong thirst drive. And has stress issues, which can also worsen constipation.

On another note, if you're looking for a high-calorie dry food, Dr. Elsey's work well for Ireland, who eats a fair bit of it -- it keeps her eating well and helps me get more wet food into her. Dr. E's foods are very low in carbs (no fillers!). Some people object to the pork plasma but I'm just happy that's an animal product rather than peas or lentils!

All that said, I agree with S silent meowlook about a specialist. We took Ireland to an internal medicine specialist (she has respiratory problems) for a consultation and it was well worth the time, effort, and money since the vet took a full history, did a thorough exam, and ran very specific tests that we discussed in advance, in detail. We still don't know exactly what's wrong but several things were ruled out and getting second opinions, with lots of advice, was helpful. If you can see a specialist that your regular vet specifically recommends, all the better.

 

[louisstools]

Hi. It sounds like you need a referral to a veterinary specialist. There is allot more going on with her than a regular veterinarian can handle. This is obvious by the lack of improvement in her well being.

Are you testing her glucose at home?

There can be allot going on. Hypoglycemia, DKA, pancreatitis, yo name a few.

Your cat is not doing this to annoy you. There is definitely something really wrong with her.

That's the thing, she's been to the specialists. They can't find anything. Blood and all scans show she is in perfect health.

No, I do not test the glucose at home. Since she got diagnosed with diabetes in July we've gone every 2 weeks until she got regulated and now we go every 3 months. We just had a test last week and her numbers were perfect.

I agree, there should be something going on but whatever it is no bloodwork or scan has shown anything.

 

[louisstools]

lisahe - She has had constipation in the past but she seems to be regular. Her poops seem to be mostly 2's with some 1s and 3s using that chart. I have not tried slippery elm bark but we've tried other things in the past to aid her and she's just so picky we dare not risk adding anything to her food for fear of turning her off that food.

We may end up changing the food around. She does have a history of UTI issues when she's not on her prescription UTI food so we likely have to stick with one of those. But the good news is all the others have a higher calorie amount than our current one. The bad news is we'd have to switch her food and that is just so dicey. I'd have to wait until I'm off work for a few weeks to really consider this. It's just so stressful and difficult on me.

We've been to two different specialists and they didn't find anything through blood work and scans.

 

[lisahe]

lisahe - She has had constipation in the past but she seems to be regular. Her poops seem to be mostly 2's with some 1s and 3s using that chart. I have not tried slippery elm bark but we've tried other things in the past to aid her and she's just so picky we dare not risk adding anything to her food for fear of turning her off that food.

We may end up changing the food around. She does have a history of UTI issues when she's not on her prescription UTI food so we likely have to stick with one of those. But the good news is all the others have a higher calorie amount than our current one. The bad news is we'd have to switch her food and that is just so dicey. I'd have to wait until I'm off work for a few weeks to really consider this. It's just so stressful and difficult on me.

We've been to two different specialists and they didn't find anything through blood work and scans.

Yes, sometimes changing the food around can help. But you mention that food changes are "stressful and difficult" -- I agree! And (after looking over your thread again) I have to join the others who've wondered about the effect of stress on Missy. We see the effects of stress and anxieties on our two cats -- they're rescues from a household that had too many cats -- and we've become more aware of the fact that noises, changes, and even weather patterns can affect their behavior and contribute to health issues. It also doesn't help that we get stressed when they get stressed because we want to help.

Getting back to constipation, Ireland also seems to leave 1s, 2s, and 3s in the box... But she still has jags (as a few days in early August) where she's just not hungry and seems like Missy: picky and not interested in food. Her constipation has always been (strange to say) rather stealthy since she poops pretty regularly and normally most of the time. It took us some time to realize that was a big reason why she didn't seem very food-driven. She doesn't like slippery elm syrup added to her food so I syringe it to her, which she accepts without any problem.

In any case, I hope you're able to find a way to resolve Missy's eating issues.

 

[louisstools]

lisahe Yes, external sound -- like a butterfly landing on a flower two miles away -- or rain tomorrow is enough to throw her off. So much radically affects her that is outside of our control. And that's the thing, in 3 years of this she's yet to be consistently good at eating. She gets 4 "owner involved" meals spread over 2 hours in the morning and then another 7 or so through out the day. That's what it takes to keep calories into her. Each meal takes about 10 minutes IF she cooperates. Now with the diabetes, it's even more difficult b/c those shots need to come on "clock time" but the cat won't eat ... it's a mess. We fight a lot.

 

[FeebysOwner]

We fight a lot.

That is ongoing stress for her - and you too. And, as you have said, this fighting has been going on most of the past 3 years. From all that you have posted, this 'fighting' started back when her buddy, Muggs, died and her behavior and demeanor changed to the point you were ready to give up on her because you couldn't tolerate her not returning to how she was before he became ill and died. You've come a long way since then, but I still think you yearn for those days that will likely never be again. I can't tell you how not to fight with her, but if you could, I think it would go a long way in helping her.