Is this adorable little boy a Bengal?

Kosta

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Hello everyone, this is my first post and I've registered to this forum for asking some specific questions.

I've always had dogs (actually, especially one dog which was my best friend from age 4 to 24, we grown together and since then I've never had the emotional energy/need to have an other pet with me :) )

Now, my girlfriend is instead a cat person and since we live together since more than 1 year we're going to take a pet with us, we live in an apartment and so I've also agreed to a cat :)

One week ago I was at one of my friend's house and he has a 6 months Bengal (Pedigree certified), the little cat was just adorable and very affectionate for being a cat! So I've just fell in love with this breed and started looking for one. I've discovered that they are also very affectionate to their families indeed, and so decided to adopt one.

It happened that in my very home town there is a Savannah breeding (Pedigree and everything), and the same couple also has 3 bengals (1 Linx spotted male and 2 brown marble females). One of the female just had 3 kittens and they are selling them (which is actually a misbehaviour since they do not came with a Pedigree certification..)

This little boy is the most adorable thing I've ever saw, I'd like to ask you if you believe this is actually a Bengal cat?

This is him at just 2 weeks:


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We visited the little boy yesterday and took some pictures, he is at 3 weeks:

https://ibb.co/4mTrtmN]
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Said that we just fell in love with him and we'd really love to adopt him, I'm afraid that, since he does not have a pedigree, we can not be sure that he is a Bengal? Can he be just an adorable "normal" cat with spotted coat? Maybe after mixing Bengals with house cats N times? And if such, I'm afraid he would not have the social behaviour described for a Bengal? Is there anything we can spot on him to be sure he is a Bengal?

Please let me know your opinion :)
 
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di and bob

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Without certification, there is really no way to confirm the ancestry. He will forever be listed as a black and silver tabby Domestic Short Hair with brown. I would ask to see the certification of at least the mother, or whoever they are claiming is the certified parent. It is VERY suspicious that they would not certify these kittens and get a lot more money for them. I hate to say it but I think it is a scam like so many are. you could maybe discreetly check on them with the certification agency in your country. or having the papers on at least one parent would satisfy that the kitten is at least half of what they say it is. If they can't produce papers (which most can't) it is a scam. There are MILLIONS of scammers out there, but the kitten is really worth what you are willing to pay for it. you might also research what purebred kittens are going for so you don't pay too much. that being said, his coat really looks like a normal marble tabby, though I can see some 'rosettes starting to form, which are the spots with a lighter spot in the center, so he might have some Bengal background. There are many on here with much more experience than me, lutece lutece being one, I hope they come on to help.....That kitten is ABSOLUTELY adorable by the way, I hope everything works out!
 

goingpostal

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That looks like a Bengal kitten, but without papers it could just as likely be a mix. I would 100% recommend not buying an unregistered one from what seems to be a backyard breeder. Bengals, like most purebreds can have serious health issues and I wouldn't buy one without health testing and papers. I wouldn't look to a Bengal if your goal is a super social with people type kitty either, most seem to be very attached to one person and standoffish to shy with anyone else.
 
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Kosta

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Thanks for your quick replies!

Since this couple lives in an apartment, the alleged dad of the kitten (white lynx) lives with the husband's mother as she has a garden (in this town it is almost impossible to have a garden!). So we saw the alleged mother in person, I'm not an expert at all but she had the exact colours you expect from a brown marble Bengal. They had pictures and videos of the white lynx, and I can ask them to see the father in person also.

They also had 2 Savannahs there, which one of them was an adult female and one of them was a 3 months kitten ready for adoption, they were huge. The kitten was at least as big as an adult domestic cat, the adult female was big as a big-size dog (but very slim of course).

They said they bought the female bengals for trying a mix with the Savannahs. That was hard to work out because of size difference and so the white lynx was purchased. For such purposes, neither the parents of the kitten have the pedigree certification.

We've taken a Savannah adoption contract and made it for the alleged bengal kitten (as I've blocked the kitten with a 100$ deposit). For example the contract protects you from genetic health issue in the first year of life, and gives you many additional warranties. I've also the FEV/FELV tests of the (alleged) parents.

By the way, the kitten is at around 50-70% the price of a Pedigree one (depending from which certified breeder you want to adopt one as they have different prices). Bengal Breeding here in Italy is not so common and the nearest certified ones are located at 300-400 km from my home town. So having this little one here is very lucky..

In any case, we'll receive other pictures during the growth of the kitten (I'll ask every 10 days/ 2 weeks), up to the 12th week, will it be easier to understand if he is actually a Bengal?

For all the other people on this forum, please give me your feedback as well! thanks!
 

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The kitten looks like he could be a Bengal, but it will likely become more apparent as he gets older. If you are able to get pictures of the parents, that would also give a better idea. But, like others said, I would be really wary about buying an alleged purebred kitten from breeders who don't register them. Even if he is purebred, that doesn't necessarily mean he's bred well; a lot of poorly bred purebreds can unfortunately end up with health problems if breeding isn't done carefully and deliberately. I would also be concerned about where the owners got unregistered Bengals in the first place; I admittedly don't know anything about cat breeding in Italy, but most breeders that I know of would always register kittens before selling them. Even if these people have good intentions, it's possible they got the kitten's parents from backyard breeders or scammers.

Another thing to keep in mind is that kittens always do better in pairs. Kittens are high energy, and especially with an often high energy breed like the Bengal, having a playmate is really important for getting their energy out and keeping them happy and out of trouble. They also tend to grow up better adjusted and with fewer behavioral issues when they have a friend. I would highly recommend either getting two kittens or choosing an adult instead if you only want one cat.

One last point: while many breeds have a certain personality associated with them, not every cat of that breed will have those personality traits. They're all individuals, and this kitten may grow up to have a different personality than you're expecting. The only way to know a cat's personality before getting them would be to adopt an adult, whose personality has already formed. There are many domestic shorthairs, for example, who are social and affectionate.

This is not at all to discourage you from getting this kitten if you have your heart set on him. I just wouldn't put too too much stock in knowing his personality ahead of time or expecting him to be exactly like your friend's cat, if that makes sense.
 

lutece

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All of the advice above is good.

We can tell from the pictures that the kitten will be an attractive cat with the general appearance of the Bengal breed. However, no one can tell you from looking at any of these pictures if the kitten is a purebred Bengal or a mix. That question can only be answered by pedigree papers from a reputable registry. We also can't tell you if this kitten's temperament will be anything like your friend's cat. Bengals can vary in temperament, some are very friendly and outgoing, others more suspicious or unpredictable.

If you want to be sure you are getting a purebred Bengal, you will want to look for a breeder with registered cats. If you want to get a kitten with a specific temperament and some assurance that it will be healthy throughout its life, you additionally will want to look for a serious breeder with some experience, who knows their bloodlines well. Have you asked your friend about the breeder where they got their cat?

With hybrid breeds such as the Bengal, pedigree papers are particularly important because they show how far removed your cat is from the wild species cross. You have probably heard the terms "F1, F2, F3..." which indicate cats that are close to the wild species cross ("early generation"). It's helpful to know this information when buying a kitten. All Bengals can vary in temperament, but early generation Bengals can be more challenging to own, although they can be wonderful cats for the right owner who is prepared to handle potential behavior issues.

Additionally, buying an unregistered Bengal can potentially lead to legal issues in the future, because this is a hybrid breed. Many parts of the world have restrictions on ownership of wild species and early generation hybrid cats. A registered Bengal has a pedigree that shows that it is a sufficient number of generations removed from the wild species, so that it is legally a domestic cat. If you have an unregistered cat without a certified pedigree, you can't prove that you have the required number of generations.

If you do end up buying this unregistered kitten, make sure not to refer to the kitten as a "Bengal" on any official paperwork. Do not identify the kitten as a "Bengal" at your vet's office, or on feline health insurance, or on social media. Instead, you would want to refer to the kitten as a tabby domestic shorthair. See this article for more information:

Finally, you mentioned this:
They said they bought the female bengals for trying a mix with the Savannahs. That was hard to work out because of size difference and so the white lynx was purchased. For such purposes, neither the parents of the kitten have the pedigree certification.
This strikes me as suspicious. A legitimate breeder would have pedigree papers for all of their cats, even if they were using Bengals in an outcrossing program with Savannahs. Why would they use unregistered Bengals as an outcross, rather than pedigreed Bengals? Were these cats purchased without breeding rights?
 
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Kosta

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The kitten looks like he could be a Bengal, but it will likely become more apparent as he gets older. If you are able to get pictures of the parents, that would also give a better idea. But, like others said, I would be really wary about buying an alleged purebred kitten from breeders who don't register them. Even if he is purebred, that doesn't necessarily mean he's bred well; a lot of poorly bred purebreds can unfortunately end up with health problems if breeding isn't done carefully and deliberately. I would also be concerned about where the owners got unregistered Bengals in the first place; I admittedly don't know anything about cat breeding in Italy, but most breeders that I know of would always register kittens before selling them. Even if these people have good intentions, it's possible they got the kitten's parents from backyard breeders or scammers.

Another thing to keep in mind is that kittens always do better in pairs. Kittens are high energy, and especially with an often high energy breed like the Bengal, having a playmate is really important for getting their energy out and keeping them happy and out of trouble. They also tend to grow up better adjusted and with fewer behavioral issues when they have a friend. I would highly recommend either getting two kittens or choosing an adult instead if you only want one cat.

One last point: while many breeds have a certain personality associated with them, not every cat of that breed will have those personality traits. They're all individuals, and this kitten may grow up to have a different personality than you're expecting. The only way to know a cat's personality before getting them would be to adopt an adult, whose personality has already formed. There are many domestic shorthairs, for example, who are social and affectionate.

This is not at all to discourage you from getting this kitten if you have your heart set on him. I just wouldn't put too too much stock in knowing his personality ahead of time or expecting him to be exactly like your friend's cat, if that makes sense.
Thanks for your message :) My gf is is repeating me over and over that you can not know a cat personality until he is adult, so I "wish" to have a Bengal-like behaviour.. if not, we'll love him anyway :D

Regarding trusty breeders, I would pay more to have a certified Bengal, if this little guy was not here at 10 car minutes from my apartment. I would have to travel half Italy to see in person certified bengal breedings :(. In addition, I'm not sure I'll find a gorgeous kitten like this one!

Regarding the parents..here in Italy, unfortunately, it is not uncommon for private workers to find ways to avoid regulations and stuff, so I would not be surprised if they got their Bengals from some breeder friends they may know (because of their savannahs) in order for the seller to not pay taxes or so..

I know it would be better to have 2 kittens together, but I really need to evaluate it :help:

All of the advice above is good.

We can tell from the pictures that the kitten will be an attractive cat with the general appearance of the Bengal breed. However, no one can tell you from looking at any of these pictures if the kitten is a purebred Bengal or a mix. That question can only be answered by pedigree papers from a reputable registry. We also can't tell you if this kitten's temperament will be anything like your friend's cat. Bengals can vary in temperament, some are very friendly and outgoing, others more suspicious or unpredictable.

If you want to be sure you are getting a purebred Bengal, you will want to look for a breeder with registered cats. If you want to get a kitten with a specific temperament and some assurance that it will be healthy throughout its life, you additionally will want to look for a serious breeder with some experience, who knows their bloodlines well. Have you asked your friend about the breeder where they got their cat?

With hybrid breeds such as the Bengal, pedigree papers are particularly important because they show how far removed your cat is from the wild species cross. You have probably heard the terms "F1, F2, F3..." which indicate cats that are close to the wild species cross ("early generation"). It's helpful to know this information when buying a kitten. All Bengals can vary in temperament, but early generation Bengals can be more challenging to own, although they can be wonderful cats for the right owner who is prepared to handle potential behavior issues.

Additionally, buying an unregistered Bengal can potentially lead to legal issues in the future, because this is a hybrid breed. Many parts of the world have restrictions on ownership of wild species and early generation hybrid cats. A registered Bengal has a pedigree that shows that it is a sufficient number of generations removed from the wild species, so that it is legally a domestic cat. If you have an unregistered cat without a certified pedigree, you can't prove that you have the required number of generations.

If you do end up buying this unregistered kitten, make sure not to refer to the kitten as a "Bengal" on any official paperwork. Do not identify the kitten as a "Bengal" at your vet's office, or on feline health insurance, or on social media. Instead, you would want to refer to the kitten as a tabby domestic shorthair. See this article for more information:
[/URL]

Finally, you mentioned this:

This strikes me as suspicious. A legitimate breeder would have pedigree papers for all of their cats, even if they were using Bengals in an outcrossing program with Savannahs. Why would they use unregistered Bengals as an outcross, rather than pedigreed Bengals? Were these cats purchased without breeding rights?
Thanks a lot for all your advices. I will post other pictures during the kitten growth and we'll see if it is possible to understand everything better. I've also already asked (before seeing this little boy) to my friend about the breeder, which is pretty far from me, around 400 km (I believe they deliver the kittens, but in this way I could not see them in person..).
If we'll see that this little boy does not seem a Bengal during growth, we'll see if contacting this breeder :(

Regarding the outcrossing.. same as below, if it is possible to skip regulations someone in Italy will do it for sure :(
 

lutece

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I will post other pictures during the kitten growth and we'll see if it is possible to understand everything better.
I'm sure everyone will enjoy looking at the pictures, so do feel free to keep posting them... but the pictures can only tell us that he looks similar to a Bengal. You keep wanting to know "whether he is a Bengal" ... but the pictures won't tell us any more than we already know, and in any case, people here are trying to tell you that this really isn't the most important factor about whether you should buy a kitten.
Regarding the parents..here in Italy, unfortunately, it is not uncommon for private workers to find ways to avoid regulations and stuff, so I would not be surprised if they got their Bengals from some breeder friends they may know (because of their savannahs) in order for the seller to not pay taxes or so..
There is no good reason for the cats and kittens to be unregistered, if the parents are really Bengals acquired from other breeders. "Avoiding taxes" or "skipping regulations" isn't a good reason... this is typically the sort of thing that a shady breeder says to cover up other problems, such as breeding stock having been purchased from another breeder as pets without breeding permissions, or something else in the background of the cats that the breeder doesn't wish to disclose to you.

Anyway, it sounds like you already decided to buy the kitten. You may be lucky and he may turn out to be a great kitten for you. If you end up with problems, hopefully you will love the kitten anyway and work through whatever problems may arise. I would not personally buy an unregistered Bengal from a breeder like this, for all the reasons that people have listed above, but I do wish the best of luck for both you and the kitten!
 

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We've taken a Savannah adoption contract and made it for the alleged bengal kitten (as I've blocked the kitten with a 100$ deposit). For example the contract protects you from genetic health issue in the first year of life, and gives you many additional warranties. I've also the FEV/FELV tests of the (alleged) parents.
With a Bengal, the health condition I would be most concerned about is HCM, if your new kitten was to drop dead at one year old, you wouldn't be likely to want another kitten from this breeder or those lines, often breeder guarantees only offer to replace with a new kitten so you could easily end up with huge vet bills and no cat in this type of situation. Do you know if the parents have been health tested or have you seen a pedigree for them? There's a whole lot of red flags and shady breeding that seems to be happening here and quite often a price that's too good to true comes at a cost.
 

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I would be real cautious too buying without papers and no history of health and temperament.
Bengals are a high energy and highly intelligent cat and require a lot of time spent with them so make sure you yourself are willing to spent at least 2-3 hours a day with the cat in play and exercise and a lot of patience with a cat that is always in your face asking for games and attention.
 

jefferd18

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I think he is a Bengal. If not, he sure is a very strong lookalike. When I was little my parents bought a purebred collie that didn't have papers.
People who are not really experienced or serious breeders quite often don't get litters registered.

And even if he wasn't 100% the real deal, you have already fallen in love with him and that is the main thing.
 
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Kosta

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At first, thanks to everyone for replying on this thread! Replying to everyone in random order:

First, as some of you already pointed out, we've already our heart on this little creature. This thread is intended to understand more about him.

You are telling me that there is no way to tell if he is a Bengal. I finally understand your point, the Pedigree certification is the only sure way to know it and he does not have one. However, there may be a way to tell if he is NOT a Bengal, perhaps of some physical trait not compatible with the Bengal breed, for example. If it was so, I could discuss with the breeder that the little kitten is not a Bengal because of this or that reason, and we still want to adopt him, but not paying the 60% price of a purebred Bengal. No one likes to be scammed and me neither! For these reasons also I’d upload new pictures until the 12th week and ask for your feedback.


Regarding high energy Bengals, we’d love to have a high energy boy in house. We have a spacious apartment and already bought some toys and stuff (in the beginning we were going to adopt a normal domestic cat for free, until the owner said the kitten just ran away the day I was going to take her home – around 10 days ago - .. as they were keeping the cats in a garden near the hills..).
We also live in a city which is nestled between the sea on one side and hills and mountains on the others, and we’d love to be able to go walking/hiking with him (an other reasons for Bengals was that apparently they can be trained on a leash?). So if he is high energy, it's even better. If it happens to be a quiet cat instead, we’ll love him anyway :D


Regarding the really delicate point of health conditions.. If he would suffer from any health condition it would just destroy our hearts and we would never want a kitten from this breeder of course. I lost my dog 7 years ago and this little boy would be my new “open your heart to some animal” pet so, you may understand!
 

Silver Crazy

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Regarding high energy Bengals, we’d love to have a high energy boy in house. We have a spacious apartment and already bought some toys and stuff (in the beginning we were going to adopt a normal domestic cat for free, until the owner said the kitten just ran away the day I was going to take her home – around 10 days ago - .. as they were keeping the cats in a garden near the hills..).
We also live in a city which is nestled between the sea on one side and hills and mountains on the others, and we’d love to be able to go walking/hiking with him (an other reasons for Bengals was that apparently they can be trained on a leash?). So if he is high energy, it's even better. If it happens to be a quiet cat instead, we’ll love him anyway
Sounds like you done a bit of research, good on you because some people walk into buying a Bengal then wonder later about the bomb that went of in their house..lol They are a fun cat and yes they can be very easily leash trained and love going for walks.
140660603_455010548858443_2635721148621966313_n.jpg
 

di and bob

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I am excited for you! Remember, ALL kittens are whirlwinds of activity, into everything and everywhere. You will love him no matter what. We can help you with any problems that arise, just enjoy his babyhood and be ready for the teenage years!.
 

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Sounds like you done a bit of research, good on you because some people walk into buying a Bengal then wonder later about the bomb that went of in their house..lol They are a fun cat and yes they can be very easily leash trained and love going for walks.
View attachment 378433

Well, he's a Ninja. :) Is he yours?
 

jefferd18

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No not mine..friend of mine on FB Bengal Club..she is a wonderful photographer and her cat is living the life on a farm just north of me.
My one is silver.
View attachment 378574
Well, he's a Ninja. :) Is he yours?
Sounds like you done a bit of research, good on you because some people walk into buying a Bengal then wonder later about the bomb that went of in their house..lol They are a fun cat and yes they can be very easily leash trained and love going for walks.
View attachment 378433
I said Ninja, but now I am thinking if he just had a catcher's mitt. :)
 

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I said Ninja, but now I am thinking if he just had a catcher's mitt. :)
Gryphon is a classic cat..his best friends are a horse, cattle dog and some goats, he goes fishing for tadpoles, rides in a canoe, climbs 100 foot trees and full of energy and adventure..ultimate picture of a cat living life to the max.
Bengals will snap from full asleep to play in an instant, they are pure fun but can be holy terrors as well..lol
 
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As always thanks for your posts and encouragement :) me and my girlfriend can't wait to have a cat at home! You Silver are very lucky to have such a gorgeous bengal!

Said that, today the little boy is at 4 weeks :) he was indeed born on the 04/04, here are some pictures of him, he's growing soo fast!

https://ibb.co/7vMxxj8][/url]

Here he was explaining he wanted to go back to his mommy, enough with humans:

https://ibb.co/LRBKkS0]
]
[/URL][/url]

Here he had enough, time to go back to mommy:

https://ibb.co/DfgwhrY][/url]

Again, me and my gf can't wait to take him home (other 8 weeks! :( ), and my questions about he being a Bengal or not is just to understand if the breeder is asking me the "correct" price (which would not be the case if he was a tabby).

So can you spot anything not compatible with a Bengal? I'm not experienced at all and all I know was read on the internet.. so your feedback is very precious to me! :)
 
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