Introductions and Normal Body Language

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I come with updates and videos and a couple questions, if I can impose on your kindness once again!
Yay!!
It's never an imposition, hybriseris hybriseris ....ask away whenever you want.
It's actually a pleasure, to hear about your Shadow and Ghost, and read the updates,...and seeing the videos and photos...are a bonus, too. :)
The boys have reached a big milestone. They're now together 24/7, including when I'm not home. It was VERY hard for me to take the leap, but I tested it when I was going to be at my sister's house very close by for a few hours. Peeked in on them on my security cam every once in a while. Came back and...perfectly fine. I'm sure they have their hairy moments when I'm not around but for the most part it seems like they've reached comfort around each other.
Yay again!! :yess: :woo:
This calls for another happy dance, :jive: and with some dancing bananas...:banana1::banana2::banana1::banana2:
(why the dancing bananas...I have no idea...but they look happy.) :woohoo:

Milestones like this ought to be celebrated.:)
Sure, it may have been a bit 'nerve wracking', a bit stressful, or worrisome...but often times, it's only because in our own minds, ...we build it up...to be bigger than it is. 🤔 :coolcat::sleepycat:

Great that you were able to peek in on them, from time to time,...to alleviate any worries. :thumbsup:

More than likely your two cats were either sleeping, strolling around, eating, or drinking...and Ghost was probably asking Shadow, "So where does our human go, from time to time?"
Shadow:..."Well, you know she does have to go out, buy us food, and do things. Plus our humans seem happier if we behave, so we better just do all the entertaining, when she gets back. Having an audience for us cats, is always good. Our humans seem to enjoy it."

(I don't have a security cam, yet, but I figure all our cats do a lot of sleeping...and wait for the evening times to rumble around.:dunno::blush:)
I guess my question is, could I expect that it might take quite a while longer for them to form a true friendship? Right now they'll sleep in the same room together, play together (Ghost is slowly learning to be the initiator and can get overwhelmed, but mostly seems to have fun), and are comfortable eating treats near each other whereas before they were too nervous to eat in sight of one another. But they don't lay WITH each other, no mutual grooming, etc. I also have the reality in mind that this may be as much as they ever get along which I would be okay with. But I do worry that in seeking to enrich them both, I've not done the right thing? (If my boyfriend could read this he'd scream. He's always telling me they're CLEARLY happy and enjoying each other's company even if they haven't figured it all out yet but... as is established by this thread... I'm a worry wart LOL)
I guess it depends on what your feelings of a 'true cat friendship are'?
For me, hearing about how your two cats progressed,...and quite quickly, actually,...plus seeing the previous and recent videos...both Shadow and Ghost are already true friends.

Sleeping in the same room together, Playing together, having fun, each taking turns initiating the Play,...and also being Comfortable eating treats about four feet apart...tells us loads...about how these two cats have Built Trust in each other, and Respect each other,...and have Basically Accepted each other.

Being alone together, and not coming home to one scared cat, or one hiding cat...also speaks volumes.
That they can both walk Confidently around each other, is another good indicator.

I definitely would call it a true cat friendship.

Even if they have 'spats'...and 'playfights'...it doesn't mean that their friendship is over.
It's like an 'ever evolving', dynamic, and changes all the time...but the 'solid foundation' that you have Built...will always be there.

" But they don't lay WITH each other, no mutual grooming, etc. I also have the reality in mind that this may be as much as they ever get along which I would be okay with. But I do worry that in seeking to enrich them both, I've not done the right thing?"

I don't think you can ever predict the future with cats,...as they change and grow....so with Time,...you actually never know what will happen.

"But I do worry that in seeking to enrich them both, I've not done the right thing?"
I'm not entirely sure, about your above meaning...or worry? :dunno:
Is it that you think that you have not done enough?...or can do more, to get both cats to be 'closer in affection with each other'?
Because you have definitely, 100% enriched both cat's lives,...so not sure where your doubts, or worries are coming from? 🤔

(You did say you were a slight perfectionist, right, so maybe there is a little of that. not sure.
Or maybe you set up a 'timetable in your cat intros'...and figure that you have to hit them all.
I'm not trying to analyze anything, (though it does sound like I am. :doh::blush:...when I read it back.)🧐:paperbag:

Rather trying to understand...why you don't think you've done the right thing?...or not done enough, or not exactly sure what??

Reading about other cats, and how close they are, mutual grooming and laying with each other...is not always the case.
But it can happen.
I just would not know how to 'Encourage'..that,...since I just kind of 'let my cats be, and act as natural as they want'.

There are some threads, where I thought, "no way, are these two cats ever going to lay side by side,...but they did, with the passage of Time.
But really I'm not a great person to ask, since I had no idea ahead of time.
I was always pleasantly surprised, and in awe.

"(If my boyfriend could read this he'd scream. He's always telling me they're CLEARLY happy and enjoying each other's company even if they haven't figured it all out yet but... as is established by this thread... I'm a worry wart LOL)"
Your boyfriend is totally right. (not for the screaming part..:gaah:.lol.:lol: :wink:.Don't let him read this. :spew:
But definitely for the observation part...and telling you that he sees two 'clearly happy cats'...who 'enjoy each other's company'. :cloud9:

Being a worrier comes with a few drawbacks,...but ultimately it also makes you...very in-tune...with your animals...and just wanting the Best for them all.:)
Nothing wrong with that. :hugs::grouphug:

Just have the Belief in Yourself, too, that you have already done so much, for both your cats.
Like you said,...if you can be okay with how both cats act,...and Accept that they are okay...then whatever happens later...will just be a bonus.
(they will still fight, though,...you still have to know and expect that too.
Cats are cats,...some days 'they get into it'.)
Secondly, Shadow occasionally goes up to Ghost while he's laying down and puts his mouth on his throat. It doesn't seem aggressive, especially because in the early days after adopting him, he did it a lot to my arm when I had a sweatshirt on - just bite and kind of squeeze. Is this dominance? Play? I am hoping it's not behavior where he's trying to drive Ghost away from me, but can't tell.
This second question, is a little more difficult to answer.
I think it is Dominance,...depending on where the 'bite and hold' is.

Does Shadow bite below Ghost's mouth, on the jugular vein, and grabs and holds him there.?

(my female Tepaul has done this to her brother Tripp, after licking his head for a few groom licks, and then biting his neck, at the jugular to hold him. I do think it is a show of dominance..and control.)

(With Tripp though, he would bite Tepaul's neck, from the top, much like cats who mate do,...even though both were spayed and neutered at 5.5 months...so I did not know if it was 'instinctual, dominance, or rough play'...as well.
I just would throw a towel on Tripp, and discourage it,...since Tepaul didn't like it, and I figured Tripp was too strong, and bigger, anyhow)

So depending on...how long the hold is...and also when during the day...as in, is it during Playing...or is it just 'suddenly out of the blue'?
All these can be instinct, Play, or Dominance.

I don't think that your Shadow is trying to drive Ghost away,...unless Shadow always does it in a particular location,...and places himself between you and Ghost.

If it's constantly happening,...and it bothers Ghost,...then I probably would gently discourage it.
Use Distraction, clapping hands, throwing a cat toy, or towel onto Shadow...to simmer him down.

Unless it's so fast, and Ghost does not seem to be in distress at all.
Kittens usually do this, since they mimic hunting prey,...but they do outgrow how often it happens.
Maybe Shadow is just a big kitten, at heart, and personality. :blackcat: :bigeyes::catrub:
Here's some videos and pictures of these two goofs!

Hope all is well with you and your kitties!
Thank you so much for the videos and picture of Ghost smiling or laughing . :crackup::spew::lol:
That has to be the cutest and funniest photo of Ghost, ever. :lol::crackup:
Those teeth. hahaha.
How you captured that photo is sheer brilliance. :loveeyes: :cool2:

I'm going to comment on the videos tomorrow, since I had a bit of long and rotten day.
(sometimes people drive me up a wall,...animals never....some people...yes) :frustrated::angryfire: :rolleyes2:
But seeing your Shadow and Ghost videos...just puts me in an altogether different mood.
I should just remember to...go back and watch them...whenever lousy days happen.

My cats are good, and relaxing,...and Hope your Weekend goes well, too. :thumbsup:
 
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hybriseris

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So, personal update as well. As you know, Shadow was originally my Grandmother's cat and I adopted him when she could no longer live at home. She passed away on the 22nd of a massive stroke, quickly and peacefully. It has been one hell of a week but I'm glad I have these two to make me laugh and keep me company. Shadow always protected her, followed her everywhere she went, and now he does the same for me.

Is it that you think that you have not done enough?...or can do more, to get both cats to be 'closer in affection with each other'?
I think my concern is that because they don't exhibit *perfect* co-existence (yes, as you pointed out, I'm a perfectionist haha), I've somehow done more harm than good by injecting unnecessary stress in to their lives. They had a few spats last week that really got me upset, and I got to thinking...maybe Shadow isn't happy with a second cat, and maybe I've brought Ghost in to a home where he'll always be nervous and looking over his shoulder. In my better moments I KNOW that isn't true, but I want the best for both of them.

Does Shadow bite below Ghost's mouth, on the jugular vein, and grabs and holds him there.?
So, sometimes it's out of the blue and sometimes it's mid-play. Sometimes if Ghost is laying on his side, Shadow will randomly bite the side of his neck and hold and sort of...gnaw. He has done the same thing to my arm in the past when I first got him, where it's almost like he's a little alligator grabbing hold and then squeezing his jaw. I've also seen him do it in play, where he gets behind Ghost and grabs the nape of his neck and pulls. (It doesn't look like mounting, more like Shadow's general mouthiness.)

Interestingly, a thing that seems to make a HUGE difference is a Sentry calming collar for Shadow. I took it off for a while and noticed the intense focus and extremely rough play escalated without it. It's back on and Shadow is still VERY much his mouthy, tough guy self who loves to play, but he's also not so focused on Ghost and when they do play, he's much gentler.

I would like to put one on Ghost, but he panics at anything near his neck so, I'm not pushing the issue!

I'm going to comment on the videos tomorrow, since I had a bit of long and rotten day.
I can absolutely, totally sympathize and hope things have cleared up since then. My work brings me in to contact with lots of people every day, some of which are lovely...some of which are big ol' turds. 😉 I totally empathize with how it can ruin the tone of your whole day. If you've never tried it, I like reading the "good news" forums on Reddit. It reminds you that in general, human nature can be beautiful. I very much hope you've had a better Friday than last week's. 😊

And of course...some pics and videos! Please excuse the hairy TV stand in my security cam footage - the boys had taken to going behind our very large TV like they were having some sort of secret meeting, and it was NOT safe, so we put double-sided tape down. It works but...it also attracts all their hair LOL.

More Shadow & Ghost
 
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