Introduction Between Two Cats Got A Little Awkward.

AnaRupp

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Hi everyone!
I have a 2 year old big cat named Khajiit (hello Skyrim fellas), who I adopted when he was about 8 months old. He lived in a shelter until I brought him home, and was used to another cats.
He is just the sweetest, mellowest cat ever, very energetic and loves company. So, me and my boyfriend (we live toghether) wanted to get him a playmate to keep him company while we're at work.

2 weeks ago we adopted a beautiful cat, a girl called Pidgeon. She was found in my cousin's basement and had just delivered 4 kittens. She was then spayed and the kittens were adopted and we decided to get her.
The vet says she is not even 1 year old yet. The girl is very sweet with the humans and loves being petted, but is still a bit skittish. For the first 2 days we kept her in a bedroom, doing place swaps, scent swaps and everything. As she seemed to be adapting well, in the third day we opened the door just a crack for them to see each other. No bad reactions, and we let her roam a little.
Khajiit got really defensive, growling and hissing at her, but never attacking.
We kept that meeting short and put her back in the room. The next day we tried again, and suddenly Khajiit seemed to decide that she was not a threat and went from defensive to REALLY curious.
He would follow her around and tried to get close to her, but she went nuts, growling, and hissing.
In the past week we had great advances, and she is roaming the house freely, playing with us, playing alone and only get scared if he gets too close too fast.

THE PROBLEM HERE:
He decided that he wants to play with her. About twice a day he goes in his hyper mode, and runs like crazy, jumping around her and startling her. He already got 4 long scratches (superficial though) in the nose but didn't learned his lesson.
He tries SO HARD just touch her with his paw or smell her, but she doesn't want close contact and swat him. They never had a full blown up fight, just occasional swats.
We try to play with him to tire him up, but he is not responding to toys or the games we used to play before, and seems obsessed with her, even when she is locked in the room.

And, adding up, lately she is showing some signs of dominance, smacking him to steal his food (we feed them in separated rooms but open doors) and not covering her poop in the box. He doesn't look distressed about it, and just back down to watch her eat.

We are still keeping her in the room at night and when we are not there (with a little crack open, where they play paws often), but we don't know what to do about his constant advances (lock him up when he gets hyper? let them figure out themselves?) and we don't know if we should start treating her as the dominant cat.

Can anyone help us? :D
 
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AnaRupp

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A few pics: Pidgeon is the tiny white/gray and Khajiit is the giant ginger.
 

rubysmama

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JT'w/3

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I agree with rubysmama rubysmama Khajiit and Pidgeon are beautiful! I'm sure you will catch them snuggling in no time :) Maybe give her places to "hide" in when he gets hype...empty cardboard boxes seem to be a favorite around here. I know you are in an apartment but do you have "vertical" places for them like a cat tree/scratcher they can climb up?
 

jen

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They look and sound like they are doing ok really. They communicate by growling, hissing, swatting even if needed and light nips. They HAVE to do this to learn each others boundaries. You won't have much say in who is the dominent cat and you shouldn't treat them any differently because of it. They need to work that out amongst themselves. Sounds like that is exactly what is happening. I will recommend 2 things. First is 2-3 litterboxes. They say the rule is 1 per cat plus one more. I have found I can usually get away just one per cat but just keep that in mind. Also give not only some time apart if one needs a break or cant relax due to the other cat, or just have plenty of places for them to each hide in and escape to. Ideally a few places up high that they can jump up to.
 
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AnaRupp

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Thank you so much for the reply!

Yes, they have 3 litter boxes and many shelves and high places to go. He uses them a lot, but she doesn't seem comfortable being "that high". If she jumps up to a shelf, she immediately gets kinda nervous and goes down. Even in her safe room shelfs, when he is not around. Maybe she'll see the wonders of the high places later, when she's more settled. :)

I'll put more places so she can hide, and another person gave me the tip of installing a screen door in her safe room, so they can see each other and get used to one another even when they are not together. Do you think that can help? Have you had any experiences with this kind of measure?

We are wishing so hard for them to work that issues out and become good buddies... it's a little tiring to be anxious about them all the time, and worried that one of them my get hurt, but it's totally worth it. They are awesome. <3
 

JT'w/3

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Screen Doors work great but I think only for short term because I could see Khajiit "waiting" for her and she'd never come out
 

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AnaRupp

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I see your point... I'll do the screen door this weekend and hope that we won't have to use it for a long time. :)

Can you guys rubysmama rubysmama , JT'w/3 JT'w/3 and jen jen help me identify a weird behavior? I made a video of their interactions last night:


Khajiit is not showing signs of actual aggression, is this dominance or control behavior? Was he just trying to play?
We put her in the safe room for a while and let her loose again later, and then I caught them both chilling on the floor next to each other, and Pidgeon was playing with her toy:


This kind of behavior showed on the first video happens about 3 times a day, and we only let them be together for about 2-3 hours/day. Every time it happens we stop them and put one of them in the safe room. Should I stop it every time or not interfere directly since nobody gets hurt?

Thanks again for your help!
 

rubysmama

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I've never had 2 cats at the same time, so I'm not familiar with "play" fighting, so can't give an opinion on the first video. But in the 2nd one, they look fine. :catrub:

About their "scraps" here is the last paragraph in the How To Safely Break Up A Cat Fight article:
Most battles between cats are mock battles. You can tell the mock battles from the real conflicts by learning about the body language of cats. Your key points to watch are the tail, the ears and the eyes and where the body is in relation to the ground. Understanding the true body language of cats goes a long way toward knowing when cats are playing and when they are fighting.
 

Tobermory

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These interactions look like the ones between my 13-year-old, Iris, and my recently adopted 3-year-old, Mocha. Same reactions, same body language, same hissing and slapping spats, same chillin’ fairly close to one another. This all looks pretty typical of cats that are negotiating their shared space. I don’t see the real anger of cats ready to have a serious fight, and I don’t hear shrieks of rage. I usually let mine chase around with the minor hissing and slapping but will intervene with a “hey, hey, you guys, knock it off” if it goes on too long or the body language starts to verge on the truly angry. Mine do listen when I speak up and make a movement toward them. Mocha is so much younger that she can sometimes overwhelm Iris, so I tend to step in before Iris gets too stressed. The photos, too, seem to show cats that are going to be okay together. They’re real cuties! I love Pidgeon’s markings!
 
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AnaRupp

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The article was very helpful, thanks! I'm digging through the site right now to find more useful things like that :)

I hope you are right, Tobermory Tobermory ... Khajiit also listen to me when I talk, but sometimes the tension is too high and he just ignores me. haha
Pidgeon is indeed a sweetie pie, with a meow that sounds like a chirp all the time. And my big boy is my baby, who loves to sleep on my lap and to give me kisses.

All the luck for Mocha and Iris introduction process, btw! I would love to hear more about and the updates, if possible. :)
 

JT'w/3

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I agree with @tobermoney I really think just a little more time and Khajiit and Pidgeon will be great together! The first video was a bit scary but actually my boys are much meaner to each other than the first video :( Isn't it hard to know "when" to intervene? I like in the second video after he jumps down he doesn't attack her he's just watching her, getting to know her.

You might also want to take turns putting him in the safe room as well just to mix things up so she doesn't get to possessive of that area. Just keep building the "positive" interactions between them. I bet very soon you'll find them snuggling together :)
 
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AnaRupp

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Hi! Earlier this month I opened a thread about the introduction process of my 2 cats: Khajiit (resident cat, male, neutered, 2yo and very energetic who loves to play and bite) and Pidgeon (new cat, female, spayed, not even 1yo, who loves to play and is not really a scaredy cat, but just a little skittish).
I adopted Pidgeon about 1 month ago, and we were sorting things out and having some advances in the introduction process, until last week.
Last Saturday, my boyfriend got up and opened the door from Pidgeon's safe room, so she and Khajiit could be together, as we used to do every morning. He was always following her around and sometimes trying to block her way and jump in front of her, but she would hiss and he usually would back off.
That day, though, he kinda chase her and instead of hiss as always, she run. When she run from him, that seemed to light up his prey drive and he run after her.
They leaped around the house (my boyfriend thought they were playing and did not interfered yet) and when Pidgeon stopped, in the living room (Khajiit's territory), a fight erupted.
My bf quickly throw a pillow to distract them and by this time I heard him yelling and came to find Pidgeon up in the window sill and Khajiit being held by my bf. The balance of the fight:
- We had some fur pulled (hers and his) but no wounds. Nobody seemed really affected by the fight, cause when I put Pidgeon back in her room she immediately returned back to normal and is not scared of him at all and always wants to come out of her room.
- He was still hyper after the fight, but didn't seemed angry.
- During the chasing there was no noise coming from neither of them, no hiss, growls or yells.
- During the fight there was some yells.

Now we are keeping them separated most of the time, cause Khajiit can't seem to be in the same room as hers for more than five minutes before start to chase her (then we interfere and lock him in the room, 'cause we don't want a second fight).
She is not scared of him at all, and walks around the house with her tail up and relative confidence. When the chase starts, she doesn't hiss anymore, and just run.

Could it be just a play chase that she misunderstood or is he trying to shoo her away from his territory (since the chase always starts in the living room)? And, most important, is there a way to make him stop doing that?
 

Mamanyt1953

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If you are not doing this already, be sure to site-swap. Your goal is to have the entire house saturated with the smell of BOTH cats. I'll give this some more thought, but most of my "go to" answers have already been given. Have another look at How To Fix An Unsuccessful Cat Introduction to see if you might have missed something there!
 

jen

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I don't know, none of this seems all that alarming to me ESPECIALLY since you say she isn't scared, walking around confidently... You say a fight erupted, sounds like one just annoyed the other and they "spoke up" and told the other to back off. Again, they NEED to do this so they understand boundaries. Maybe it escalated more then you expected but they went back to their normal selves right? That is good. I have 15 year old cats who have been together their whole lives but if they are both sitting in the window and a stray cat walks by one of them is going to swat the other and hiss. They sometimes get feisty and will spat with each other, hiss, growl, you name it. Then they run off and get over it.

You were alerted, you saw them "fighting", it isn't wrong to interrupt and help them out, but they are fine. Botton line.

Just remember picking one of them up when this happens is how you get bit. They can redirect their aggression/annoyance sometimes.
 

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I would try getting a piece of cardboard or post board to put between them when things escalate to much. I agree with Jen about being careful picking the cats up to break-up fights. Cats can re-direct their aggression towards humans if they are startled when they are wound up. It is safer to use a site blocker to break up that type of behavior than to put your body directly in the line of fire.

I watched you video's. Was there any injury to either cat during the interaction in the first video in post #8? I am asking because I need more information to know how to interpret their behavior. I adopted a 6 week old kitten who was under-socialized. She tried to communicate wanting to play by chomping on the head of one of my adult cats. She never actually hurt him. He got sick of her biting him and pinned her to floor with is paw. She screamed her head off like she was being murdered. I separated them the first time this happened. When it happened again I sat down on the floor and watch what was happening. I realized that in spite of her very loud protesting he was trying to teach her manners. I would use site blockers to stop attacks but if they are just being noisy without any attacks then let them work it out.
 

jen

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When it happened again I sat down on the floor and watch what was happening. I realized that in spite of her very loud protesting he was trying to teach her manners. I would use site blockers to stop attacks but if they are just being noisy without any attacks then let them work it out.
This basically sums it up. Its like a kid throwing a temper tantrum and the adult trying to quiet them, and the kid continues.... They need to work this out and it sounds like that is exactly what is happening.
 
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