Introduction Anxiety

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Lindanyc

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Trudie and Charmin continue to have peaceful meal/snack/play times of 30-40 minutes 3 times a day. Trudie has been in the living room alone more to get more comfortable in the house. She definitely wants out of her home base more.

Yesterday we let them chill a little after eating. Charmin watches intently and has started slowly walking around Trudie. She walked behind Trudie twice fir a butt sniff. Trudie was occupied sniffing the floor but turned around the first time and looked at Charmin with no concern. She looked a second time and Charmin gave a little hiss. No response from Trudie.

Trudie is a bit more wiry at dinner time and harder to get back in her room when it is time. We separate when the staring starts. She hissed yesterday after a prolonged stare with Charmin. I think it was more that we were trying to shoo her in her room.

This morning after eating, Trudie did some rolling around on her scratcher while Charmin watched. Charmin tends to get under something while watching. I wish she would go high. Trudie approached and Charmin gave a little yowl. I ushered Trudie back in her room.

I am trying to balance ending on a positive with giving a little freedom to see if Trudie will respect Charmin’s comfort level or push it.

Fingers crossed that we are getting close. Stay safe everybody!
 

calicosrspecial

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"Trudie and Charmin continue to have peaceful meal/snack/play times of 30-40 minutes 3 times a day." - FANTASTIC!!!

"Trudie has been in the living room alone more to get more comfortable in the house." - Great. Is that because you have Charmin elsewhere or is Chrmin just choosing to be elsewhere?

"She definitely wants out of her home base more." - This is Trudie telling us she is feeling more comfortable and confident with Charmin. Another great indication. I always love to see what the cats are telling us about how they are feeling.

"Yesterday we let them chill a little after eating. Charmin watches intently and has started slowly walking around Trudie. She walked behind Trudie twice fir a butt sniff. Trudie was occupied sniffing the floor but turned around the first time and looked at Charmin with no concern. She looked a second time and Charmin gave a little hiss. No response from Trudie." - Terrific. The resident/existing cat most always has the longest time to adjust as it is their territory being "invaded". The fact she is walking around more and sniffing and no negative reaction follows from Trudie is very positive. Totally normal for communication to happen (Charmin hissing) AND the great thing is Trudie understood and respected it which builds Charmin's trust and confidence. Another step in building what is needed.

"Trudie is a bit more wiry at dinner time and harder to get back in her room when it is time. We separate when the staring starts. She hissed yesterday after a prolonged stare with Charmin. I think it was more that we were trying to shoo her in her room." - Totally normal. Distracting when the staring starts is important. If they look away and get distracted it is really positive. Again, hissing is just communication. If nothing negative happens after it is communicated, respected and is a positive.

"This morning after eating, Trudie did some rolling around on her scratcher while Charmin watched." - Did Trudie actually expose her belly? If not, it is still really positive she felt so comfortable.

"Charmin tends to get under something while watching. I wish she would go high." - Well, I wouldn't worry too much if she is not going high. Getting under something is ok especially if nothing negative happens. Some cats just like to be lower so it could just be her. But overall, I am not worried about it. She will get better as nothing negative happens.

"Trudie approached and Charmin gave a little yowl. I ushered Trudie back in her room." - Again a yowl is communication. As long as it did not escalate and was respected it is actually a positive. And it sounds like you ended it on a good note. Good job. Then when the cat goes back in their room make it positive.

"I am trying to balance ending on a positive with giving a little freedom to see if Trudie will respect Charmin’s comfort level or push it." - I think that is a good plan since Trudie seems to be acting really well in general and towards Charmin. Watch Charmin and try to balance Charmin's body language, comfort level, etc with their interactions. The resident cat typically has the most challenging transition.

You are getting close. No doubt about it. It is just a process. It is like education, it takes time to get through the class material. Some people get through it quicker than others but if you keep doing what is necessary you pass the class and move on. Trudie and Charmin are acing the tests and are in good shape for the upcoming final exam. You all will get there. No doubt in my mind. Just keep doing what you are doing, you are doing great.

Most urgently stay safe too.
 
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Lindanyc

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“Is that because you have Charmin elsewhere or is Chrmin just choosing to be elsewhere?” We put Charmin in a bedroom to give Trudie time to explore. Ive attached a few photos from this morning and will try to upload video.
 

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calicosrspecial

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Thank you. That is fine. Basically site swapping.

Pictures look fine to me. That to me is not really under or "hiding" to me. (If that was the point you were trying to make with the pics).

I see a content cat in the pics. Which I am not surprised with given what you are writing.

Great job!!
 
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No, that wasn’t an “under” picture. Charmin tends to go under a table. This was her just watching Trudie today. Thanks so much for the encouragement. Stay safe!
 

calicosrspecial

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Ahhhh, ok

Body language was great watching Trudie. I like what I see.

You are welcome but THANK YOU for making it really easy to be encouraging!! Easy to be this way with such great updates!!

Thanks. We are under Stay At Home orders so that will help. You too stay safe!!

Keep up the great work!!
 
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Ahhhh, ok

Body language was great watching Trudie. I like what I see.

You are welcome but THANK YOU for making it really easy to be encouraging!! Easy to be this way with such great updates!!

Thanks. We are under Stay At Home orders so that will help. You too stay safe!!

Keep up the great work!!
We had our first “fight” this morning and are very upset. The cats ate breakfast pracefully and had a few snacks. Charmin hissed a littje when Trudie got to close and Trudie backed up. Trudie hissed when Charmin got too close and Charmin backed up. They continued to snack peacefully and both walked away to groom. Charmin went in a corner ti groom which always worries me. Trudie went under the dining room table. Everything happened fast so i am fuzzy on the details, but Trudie approached and they both wound up behind the couch. There was hissing and spitting from both. Trudie swatted at Charmin. Not sure if she swatted back. We put up some sight blockers and eventually Trudie ran back into her room. She is in here now looking scared. We comforted her even though i feel she instigated it. Neither is physically hurt.

This really concerns me because i was just starting to get passed that feeling that Trudie wants to go after Charmin. Charmin was feeling so comfortable around Trudie. I am so concerned that Trudie will do this again.
 

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Hi!
This doesn't actually sound that bad.

Can you try some cat music? It can help quite a bit to calm cats :)
 

calicosrspecial

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In intros this does happen. It is always 2 steps forward and 1,2 or 3 steps back. So generally I am not surprised but this has taken me by surprise a bit. BUT I am not really worried and here is why.

"The cats ate breakfast pracefully and had a few snacks. Charmin hissed a littje when Trudie got to close and Trudie backed up. Trudie hissed when Charmin got too close and Charmin backed up. They continued to snack peacefully and both walked away to groom. " - This sounds like it went well. Yes, we would like the hissing to subside but we are not yet at that point (but will get there). SO both of them respected the others wishes (hissing communication). That is good. AND that they went back to eating peacefully AND then groomed. So so far so good. What I like to do is to reassure them and say "it's ok" in a very calm and confident voice when they are hissing. Anything to diffuse and distract. BUT watching that I don't escalate it.

"Charmin went in a corner ti groom which always worries me." - Why is this worrying?

"Trudie went under the dining room table. Everything happened fast so i am fuzzy on the details, but Trudie approached and they both wound up behind the couch." - So if I sense that tension might be a little bit higher this is where I tend to reassure. Saying "it's ok" in a calm and confident voice. That is a good distraction technique. And anytime we distract and diffuse and get them to look away from each other and avoid a negative it is a positive.

"they both wound up behind the couch. There was hissing and spitting from both. Trudie swatted at Charmin. Not sure if she swatted back. We put up some sight blockers and eventually Trudie ran back into her room. " - Very good job blocking and breaking it up safely.

"eventually Trudie ran back into her room."- This is actually positive. She chose to escape rather than fight. So her inner self is not wanting to hurt. I suspect both were more on defense rather than offense. Which is REALLY positive and does not change my view that they will be intro's and be fine.

"She is in here now looking scared." - Supports my feeling from above. She doesn't want to "fight".

"We comforted her even though i feel she instigated it." - I always believe in de-escalating and turning a negative into a positive. Instigation can be negative (meaning wanting to eliminate the other cat) or it can be neutral (just "feeling out" the other cat") or it can be positive (wanting to play). I am guessing Trudie was in the neutral camp in this. I tend to call these unfortunate encounters where it was just the wrong place at the wrong time and it escalated. I don't get a sense this is worrying. It just happens sometimes.

"Neither is physically hurt." - This is the most important point. Either one of them could have easy hurt the other one BUT they showed restraint and respect and did not hurt each other. That is a conscious decision and is really positive and tells me their intent was not to hurt/kill/eliminate but more defensive ("get away from me - don't mess with me").

"This really concerns me because i was just starting to get passed that feeling that Trudie wants to go after Charmin. Charmin was feeling so comfortable around Trudie. I am so concerned that Trudie will do this again." - I am not concerned. IF Trudie wanted to hurt Charmin she would not have been that scared after. Charmin may have a little setback in trust but that can be rebuilt through all the actions you have been doing. We need to work on positive associations and positive encounters distracting as needed. Trudie probably will do it again so distract as needed. IF it does happen watch how they act after. If they rebound quickly then they are telling us it was a brief dust-up.

How did Charmin act after this? Any hiding? Avoiding? Same for Trudie? How long did she stay scared and how fast did she rebound to "normal"?

I am honestly not deterred due to this encounter. This happens all the time. We'll see how meaningful it was in the next few days. So watch how they act separately and together. If they go back to "normal" quickly then they are telling us it was just a misunderstanding.

We can deal with this. I am not at all worried. Keep doing what you are doing and distract as needed to avoid negative encounters and make positive encounters. Please let me know if you need any clarification. They are going to be fine.
 
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Lindanyc

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"Charmin went in a corner ti groom which always worries me." - Why is this worrying?
It’s the fact that she puts herself in locations that can lead to her being cornered rather than walking away. I am glad that she grooms and acts confident. It’s the location that worries me.

They both slept for a while in separate rooms. Trudie seems back to normal. I let them together for a snack. Trudie ate happily but Charmin hissed and walked away into a corner. I kept it brief.

I guess I am taking this so badly because it is the first time there has been swatting and spitting. I will try to focus on the positives, but this health scare has me more on edge every day. How often are there cats that don’t seem to be able to at least coexist safely? I am trying not to think that way.

Thanks for putting things in perspective sharing your insight.
.
 

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"It’s the fact that she puts herself in locations that can lead to her being cornered rather than walking away. I am glad that she grooms and acts confident. It’s the location that worries me." - Ok, makes sense. Yes, I know what you mean. But she is aware and she will figure it out. The cats do a lot in intros. It is not only us doing the work. Did she go in the corner to groom before Trudie was in the house? Or before Trudie was in Charmin's territory?

"They both slept for a while in separate rooms. Trudie seems back to normal. I let them together for a snack. Trudie ate happily but Charmin hissed and walked away into a corner. I kept it brief." - Ok. Good that Trudie is back to normal. Sounds like she didn't get affected by it. I think she was probably surprised by Charmin's reaction which hopefully will cause her to think twice before trying whatever she may have tried again. Charmin sounds like she has a little more of an impact. Which is not surprising since the resident/existing cat tends to have the bigger hurdle to get over. But the fact that Trudie did not pay attention to Charmin and did not pursue Charmin then it gives Charmin a boost of a positive encounter (or at least not a negative one). When Charmin acts like that just 'reassure her. Tell her it is ok. Maybe give the snack where she is. We just have a little work to do with Charmin. The fact they didn't go right after each other again is VERY positive. We and they will get over this. This is a very minor blip. I am happy with how they reacted after. Charmin could have been better but it is fine.

"I guess I am taking this so badly because it is the first time there has been swatting and spitting." - Totally understandable. The fact this is the first time is amazing honestly. If there were true issues this would have been much much worse and much much more often. I am honestly not at all worried. It was just an unfortunate encounter. Trudie is over it which tells me she does not have an issue. Charmin is getting over it so it shock her a little but that is common. We just need to make those positive associations and positive encounters and distract as needed. Every time a negative is avoided it is a positive.

"I will try to focus on the positives, but this health scare has me more on edge every day." - Totally understandable. And the elevated levels of stress could be impacting the cats (thought they have been much less affected than I would have thought). You are definitely doing a lot of great work.

"How often are there cats that don’t seem to be able to at least coexist safely?" - It is incredibly rare. Maybe 1 in 1000. In person I have never had that experience and have had only 1 online and that was due to the person in my opinion. With the right knowledge and the right effort it is like 99.9% success rate in my experience. And given your circumstances I would say it is 99.9999999999% chance of success. Basically, I have almost total confidence Charmin and Trudie will be successfully intro'd for all of the above reasons and the history of their interactions so far. I guess I have done so many of these I just know. It is hard to explain but experience just gives a person perspective. You just know. Just imagine something you have a lot of experience in and think about how you just know certain things. Like walking, we just do it. We don't think about it. We don't think about falling we just do it. It is instinct. In intro's after a person does so many it becomes instinct. You just know. Trudie and Charmin are going to be fine. And we'll make sure of it. When you get through this you will see what we mean. It will become clearer to you.

If I was worried I would tell you. I am not one to deny reality etc. It doesn't help to act like things are better than they are. I believe the best way to solve a problem is identify it, admit it and address it. You will only get the straight story from me. Just in case you have doubts.

We'll get through this. Just keep doing what you are doing. You have been doing great and will. I am highly confident. You have the desire and are getting the knowledge and the cats are responding.

Just ask anything anytime. And keep with the positive associations, positive encounters, reassurance, build confidence, and distract as needed.
 
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I trust your judgement and experience! It seems like no lasting damage was done after the squabble yesterday. The cats have resumed meals and snacks pretty close together with no hissing or alarming body language. Charmin sat up in her cat tree during the first get together. During the second, she jumped from tree, to tall table, to short table, to floor which is a bit noisy and startling. No fear from Trudie. I plan on more together times today verses fewer longer ones. Fingers crossed.
 

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"It seems like no lasting damage was done after the squabble yesterday. The cats have resumed meals and snacks pretty close together with no hissing or alarming body language."- FANTASTIC!!! The most telling part is how they act after a negative encounter. If they bounce back quickly then they are telling us it wasn't that negative. AND when they go back to "normal" and nothing negative happens it is even a bigger positive encounter. Tells us a lot.

"Charmin sat up in her cat tree during the first get together. During the second, she jumped from tree, to tall table, to short table, to floor which is a bit noisy and startling. No fear from Trudie." - This is also telling. She was cautious but decided that the reward was greater than the risk and went ahead with Trudie showing her there is no threat. That is another step in the trust building process. Really great to hear.

I am more confident that "The Incident" was just an unfortunate misunderstanding. It happens. I don't think we have to worry about it. I just don't get the sense Trudie means harm.

"I plan on more together times today verses fewer longer ones." - Sounds good. Just distract if you sense anything as avoiding a negative encounter is a positive.

Keep up the great work!! :clap2:
 
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My husband has been supervising the cats for about an hour a day while I disappear. He is more comfortable letting them explore around each other. We have seen both of them start to walk around each other without incident. Trudie is still very inquisitive about Charmin, and Charmin still hisses when Trudie gets too close at times. The most interesting event was a few days ago when Charmin was on top of her cat tree. Trudie approached the tree, Charmin hissed, and Trudie back off. A little bit later when Charmin was sleeping on it, Trudie jumped up on the tree, and climbed into the cubby on the second level. Charmin knew she was there but nothing happened.
I became a little concerned this morning while I supervised them. Trudy played with a ribbon for a while while Sharman watched. They had a few treats without incident. Sherman became comfortable enough to go play with her favorite toy. Trudy hissed with ears sideways. For a little while after that she seems to want to run after Charmin. I distracted her because I felt it would really set Charmin back to be chased while she was playing. I don’t know why Trudie still seem so intent on chasing Charmin. That is really holding us back. I will try to focus focus on the fact that we have seen them be able to be around each other for longer periods of time.
 

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"We have seen both of them start to walk around each other without incident." - AWESOME!!!

"Trudie is still very inquisitive about Charmin" - Totally normal. It could be Trudie wants to make friends. Could be challenging the hierarchy. It could be a number of things but that is why we do the intros, build confidence, and do our part and count on them to do their part. It really is a team effort.

"and Charmin still hisses when Trudie gets too close at times." - Totally normal and good. Hissing is communication. Charmin telling Trudie to "watch it" and "don't try anything". When it is successfully communicated (no negative incident) it is positive. The fact Trudie does listen to Charmin is very positive and they are doing their part in the intros.

"The most interesting event was a few days ago when Charmin was on top of her cat tree. Trudie approached the tree, Charmin hissed, and Trudie back off. A little bit later when Charmin was sleeping on it, Trudie jumped up on the tree, and climbed into the cubby on the second level. Charmin knew she was there but nothing happened." - WOW., this is positive in SO MANY WAYS. Shows Trudie is respecting the communication again. Also, shows that neither feels the need to attack to defend out of fear of being hurt. They trusted each other to a good degree. IF there wasn't trust it would have blown up into a fight right there. Shows Charmin isn't that territorial (shared the tree). Shows that Trudie is not afraid or Charmin of Trudie. This is why they will be fine with continued effort. IF there was an issue you would never see this happen. Tremendously positive.

"I became a little concerned this morning while I supervised them. Trudy played with a ribbon for a while while Sharman watched. They had a few treats without incident. Sherman became comfortable enough to go play with her favorite toy. Trudy hissed with ears sideways. For a little while after that she seems to want to run after Charmin. I distracted her because I felt it would really set Charmin back to be chased while she was playing. I don’t know why Trudie still seem so intent on chasing Charmin. That is really holding us back. I will try to focus focus on the fact that we have seen them be able to be around each other for longer periods of time." -

How far was Charmin from Trudie when playing with her favorite toy?

The fact Charmin felt that comfortable to go near Trudie (Even if it was 20 feet away but still towards Trudie) THAT is really positive. Shows that Charmin trusts Trudie which is a big positive AND shows that Charmin was confident enough to try it.

Now, Trudie did hiss BUT remember hissing is communication. Trudie still does not completely trust BUT she didn't attack.

"I distracted her because I felt it would really set Charmin back to be chased while she was playing." - And this is really positive. Trudie was able to be distracted. She chose a distraction over chasing Charmin. That shows it was not that serious of a threat in Trudie's mind AND a negative was avoided which is a positive and builds Charmin's confidence. And a confident cat is less likely to attack or be attacked.

In a cat intro we view this as incredibly positive. Sure, we want to get to the hissing to be not needed BUT you are on that path. It just takes time to build confidence and to build their trust.

What you experienced is totally normal in intros and I am not only not worried but am really encouraged as to this update.

Just keep up the great work. I think this update shows more progress. You are closer now than you have ever been. Just keep doing what you are doing and reinforce those positive associations and positive encounters.

Also, remember, cats do have disagreements even when they are intro'd and love each other. It happens. The key is what happens (how serious it was) and how they act after. Cats will hiss at each other at times just as family will "fight" with each other. Just because we get mad at someone doesn't mean we don't love them. Same with cats. The key is to get over the disagreements and remember we love the other family member. Cats love to chase. Most of the time it is play, sometimes it is a disagreement. But what happens after is important. Just de-escalate and make those positive associations/positive encounters and distract.

Your cats are going to be fine. Just keep up the great work. This update is incredibly positive. You are closer than ever.
 
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Charmin was about 6 feet away while playing. It’s this nagging fear that Trudie might hurt Charmin that I can’t shake. I know it is my own issue more than anything that has actually happened.
 

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Ok, so it was really close. I am actually impressed that Charmin was as confident to go that close. That is pretty good. It depends on how fast the cat approaches as well. If Charmin was moving fast (out of the ordinary) it can cause a response. I am not surprised that Trduie hissed BUT I like how you resolved it.

What did Charmin do after the hiss? How did she act?

I know, it is hard for us. That is totally normal. We love our cat and fear them being hurt. As time goes by you will see that the fear is much greater than the risk. But it takes time. I just helped someone that was very afraid their older cat would get hurt (and her cats really wrestled - what we call rough play). It caused her anxiety understandably but as she observed she understood the intent of that "rough play". It wasn't a "kill" action but just a "rough play" action. The fact you really haven't seen a rough encounter yet is probably why you fear it because you haven't seen it result in no negativity. Well, you may have, under the couch I think it was. But it wasn't really seen. And in that encounter no one was hurt which was great.

I just don't see either cat wanting to hurt the other one. Of course, I could be wrong and something could accidentally happen but the probability seems very low. Just keep doing what you are doing to keep and even reduce that probability.

Everything you are going through emotionally is normal and understandable. We are just loving mothers, that is how we feel. Protective. Just as the cats take time so do we humans. But you will get there (just as the cats will). Just keep observing them and let them ease your concerns and fears. Most importantly, keep doing what you are doing as you are doing great!!!
 
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I don’t think that Charmin even noticed the hiss. You are right. It is because i haven’t seen a physical confrontation, i have made it huge in my mind. Charmin and the cat that we had to say goodbye to in December played rough and even fought on occasion. It did not cause the panic in me that this does. I don’t want to let my anxiety lead me to believe that Trudie and Charmin will not work out if that is not the case. I would hate myself if i gave up prematurely. Thank you for pointing out the positives.
 

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Really? She didn't notice the hiss? So she acted normal after? If so that is really positive.

"Charmin and the cat that we had to say goodbye to in December played rough and even fought on occasion." - Interesting. SO you know how cats can be. That will be very helpful.

"I don’t want to let my anxiety lead me to believe that Trudie and Charmin will not work out if that is not the case." - I am not worried. Your anxiety will lessen as they continue to act well behaved. It may not totally disappear because we can always have a little bit but it will be totally manageable. You are going to be fine especially since I know you have done it before.

"I would hate myself if i gave up prematurely." - I don't think you will have to. We aren't anywhere near a decision like that. And I highly doubt we ever will be.

"Thank you for pointing out the positives." - You are welcome but I hope I am pointing out the positives and negatives. The reason we don't talk much about the negatives is because there really aren't many. I guarantee I will tell you negatives as I see them. I will fail you and the cats if I don't and I do not want to fail anyone.

I honestly think they are doing great. It is not yet perfect but it sure is close to being intro'd. And my background is I tend to be more cautious so I think that says even more about how happy I am with where you all are at. They are going to be fine and I think you will see more evidence of that in the near future. It just takes a little time. Just keep doing what you are doing, you are doing great!! AND your husband and the cats deserve credit as well.

Don't worry, you are doing fine. Everything will be alright. :purr:
 
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I trust your judgement. I know they have come a long way. I am just anxious for that moment when I feel they are both comfortable around each other. They are both good cats and deserve to feel safe and happy.
 
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