Introducing Betty White

daftcat75

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OMG... Betty sounds just like Geoffrey! And I do the same thing--talking to him!!

So glad Betty is improving.
Another point: was it hot in your apartment yesterday? That could have done it also...
I think iPappy hit upon it on the other thread. That all the anesthesia drugs probably took an extra day to metabolize out of her system. I’ve seen her with heat and this wasn’t it. I was very encouraged by nighttime when she was once more bunting with vigor. Yesterday morning she was bunting so weakly I thought she’d fall over.

Scaling her mix back towards normal. Last night I sweetened it by half. Today that’s unsweetened by half. Her usual A/D to I/D mix is 40 grams to 80 grams. Last night it was 60:80. This morning it’s 50:80. Hopefully we’ll be back to 40:80 by dinner. I think she gets more burps with the richer mix.

Yesterday she finished at 125 calories. Not a bad finish considering how most of the day went.

This morning she showed up for breakfast like yesterday didn’t happen. She left a remainder. 9 grams. She’ll finish that. About all that is left is a three hairball treat poop. 💩🫣 Hopefully before I leave for my burger and beer this afternoon.
 

daftcat75

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There we go. She just had her three treat poop and it was perfect. 💩👍 Looks like I don’t have to fear three hairball treats like the two Greenies she had the other week. I think we’ll stick to two a day for now until and unless she yaks another hairball.

🙊
Now her breath… We need to queue up a dental for sooner than later. This weekend I will finally get her some gizzards to see if she will eat them for dental health.
 

lisahe

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I'm glad Betty's starting to show her sass again! I'm not surprised she'd been a little lethargic, given the procedure, her gut, the meds, and all the stress that comes with them. By comparison... Edwina had a bad barf night on Monday so had a Tuesday morning vet visit that included fluids, rabies shot, short car ride, blood tests, and Cerenia for four days... And only yesterday was she back to her almost usual self! I gave her the last Cerenia chip an hour ago and am now hoping that taking lamb out of her diet will resolve her problem... I've also slowly started her on the same hairball fishies that Betty White is taking. So far so good on one a day, plus she loves them. I think I'll give her two today and see how it goes. I'm glad you mentioned those!

Pepcid did come up during our vet visit and the vet suggested only one dose a day if acid becomes a problem. I, too, had seen the study on two weeks being Pepcid's limit for helping cats. I take it myself sometimes and am realizing that I ought to think of my own stomach acid problems when I consider Edwina's meals and appetite: She's gained a lot of weight in the last year and I suspect that's a combination of aging (the cats are nine, less active after being hellions for years) and the stomach acid. The acid can make me want to eat and eat and eat (usually rich foods like cream and cheese!) to fill and, hence, soothe my stomach. I have to wonder if cats with lots of stomach acid might have similar urges. I'm not always sure how to use that in feeding Edwina and trying to control the acid with food rather than pharma, but at least it does help me observe and sort her apparent attitudes and moods, rather like how you can tell when Betty might spit.

Here's hoping you and Betty have a good weekend!
 

tarasgirl06

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Interesting analogy, lisahe lisahe and sounds logical to me. @daftcat is a fountain of knowledge on all things feline health (or a lot of them, anyway) so you're in a good place to maybe figure this out.
Sounds like Betty is a true baseball fan! Wishing you (all) a good Caturday and Ms. Betty a nice, calm, comfortable day.
 

daftcat75

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I'm glad Betty's starting to show her sass again! I'm not surprised she'd been a little lethargic, given the procedure, her gut, the meds, and all the stress that comes with them. By comparison... Edwina had a bad barf night on Monday so had a Tuesday morning vet visit that included fluids, rabies shot, short car ride, blood tests, and Cerenia for four days... And only yesterday was she back to her almost usual self! I gave her the last Cerenia chip an hour ago and am now hoping that taking lamb out of her diet will resolve her problem... I've also slowly started her on the same hairball fishies that Betty White is taking. So far so good on one a day, plus she loves them. I think I'll give her two today and see how it goes. I'm glad you mentioned those!

Pepcid did come up during our vet visit and the vet suggested only one dose a day if acid becomes a problem. I, too, had seen the study on two weeks being Pepcid's limit for helping cats. I take it myself sometimes and am realizing that I ought to think of my own stomach acid problems when I consider Edwina's meals and appetite: She's gained a lot of weight in the last year and I suspect that's a combination of aging (the cats are nine, less active after being hellions for years) and the stomach acid. The acid can make me want to eat and eat and eat (usually rich foods like cream and cheese!) to fill and, hence, soothe my stomach. I have to wonder if cats with lots of stomach acid might have similar urges. I'm not always sure how to use that in feeding Edwina and trying to control the acid with food rather than pharma, but at least it does help me observe and sort her apparent attitudes and moods, rather like how you can tell when Betty might spit.

Here's hoping you and Betty have a good weekend!
I’ve read a recommendation or two for priming a cat’s stomach with a freeze dried meat treat before meals for those kitties with extra acid. Not sure how that works.

Her three treat poop was 👍. So Betty is officially up to two fishes a day and she also loves them. I break them in half for her. I plan to make fish hunting a new sport for her. Right now all four fish halves are put together on the carpet. But over the coming days and weeks, I’m going to experiment with putting the pieces further and further apart until she learns to hunt for them. Her coat is feeling great and she sheds less since we’ve been getting closer to two a day. And since there wasn’t a huge double ended disaster like Greenies, I may try four with her the next time she seems hairball-y.

First breakfast is in the books. Now it’s just a long wait for the both of us until lunch. There’s a big quarterly baseball card show that last year was an hour and a half away. Last quarter it was only 45 minutes away. Now they’ve found a new location for this weekend and the next several quarters and it is just across town. So excited! And hey! They refunded $600 on her ultrasound. I have some spending money this afternoon. Just as soon as I can plate lunch and claim the afternoon for myself.
 

tarasgirl06

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I’ve read a recommendation or two for priming a cat’s stomach with a freeze dried meat treat before meals for those kitties with extra acid. Not sure how that works.

Her three treat poop was 👍. So Betty is officially up to two fishes a day and she also loves them. I break them in half for her. I plan to make fish hunting a new sport for her. Right now all four fish halves are put together on the carpet. But over the coming days and weeks, I’m going to experiment with putting the pieces further and further apart until she learns to hunt for them. Her coat is feeling great and she sheds less since we’ve been getting closer to two a day. And since there wasn’t a huge double ended disaster like Greenies, I may try four with her the next time she seems hairball-y.

First breakfast is in the books. Now it’s just a long wait for the both of us until lunch. There’s a big quarterly baseball card show that last year was an hour and a half away. Last quarter it was only 45 minutes away. Now they’ve found a new location for this weekend and the next several quarters and it is just across town. So excited! And hey! They refunded $600 on her ultrasound. I have some spending money this afternoon. Just as soon as I can plate lunch and claim the afternoon for myself.
Definitely shaping up to be a happy Caturday for you two! Enjoy the show...and enjoy your special treats and good food, Betty!
 

lisahe

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I’ve read a recommendation or two for priming a cat’s stomach with a freeze dried meat treat before meals for those kitties with extra acid. Not sure how that works.

Her three treat poop was 👍. So Betty is officially up to two fishes a day and she also loves them. I break them in half for her. I plan to make fish hunting a new sport for her. Right now all four fish halves are put together on the carpet. But over the coming days and weeks, I’m going to experiment with putting the pieces further and further apart until she learns to hunt for them. Her coat is feeling great and she sheds less since we’ve been getting closer to two a day. And since there wasn’t a huge double ended disaster like Greenies, I may try four with her the next time she seems hairball-y.

First breakfast is in the books. Now it’s just a long wait for the both of us until lunch. There’s a big quarterly baseball card show that last year was an hour and a half away. Last quarter it was only 45 minutes away. Now they’ve found a new location for this weekend and the next several quarters and it is just across town. So excited! And hey! They refunded $600 on her ultrasound. I have some spending money this afternoon. Just as soon as I can plate lunch and claim the afternoon for myself.
The freeze-dried treats do work nicely for Edwina if/when acid is really the problem. A few pieces of Northwest Naturals chicken FD raw food or Pure Bites used to work very well for her. She ate a combo of NW chicken and Chewy's freeze-dried chicken during the dark hours this morning, along with a tiny bit of broth from Tiki carnivore food... and there was no froth this morning. (Of course she's still on Cerenia but even so...) But that didn't work very well at all when she was apparently barfing because of some other problem, the one I so (so so!) hope was caused by lamb. Time will tell. For now, though, she's still getting slippery elm bark syrup a few times a day, too, which seems to help with just about everything, even in small amounts.

Given those hairball pictures, I'm especially glad to hear that just a couple fish help with Betty's shedding. I bought those for Edwina on a whim after you mentioned them and someone else on this thread said they were working for their cat, too. I've been crushing a fish on a small mound of food and that works well but I like the idea of hiding them. Maybe I'll try giving her two today. 🤔 Even the smallest changes can feel pretty radical with cats like Edwina and Betty.

Anyway, fingers crossed for more good poops, a successful lunch, and fun at the baseball card show. And hurray for that refund!
 

daftcat75

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The freeze-dried treats do work nicely for Edwina if/when acid is really the problem. A few pieces of Northwest Naturals chicken FD raw food or Pure Bites used to work very well for her. She ate a combo of NW chicken and Chewy's freeze-dried chicken during the dark hours this morning, along with a tiny bit of broth from Tiki carnivore food... and there was no froth this morning. (Of course she's still on Cerenia but even so...) But that didn't work very well at all when she was apparently barfing because of some other problem, the one I so (so so!) hope was caused by lamb. Time will tell. For now, though, she's still getting slippery elm bark syrup a few times a day, too, which seems to help with just about everything, even in small amounts.

Given those hairball pictures, I'm especially glad to hear that just a couple fish help with Betty's shedding. I bought those for Edwina on a whim after you mentioned them and someone else on this thread said they were working for their cat, too. I've been crushing a fish on a small mound of food and that works well but I like the idea of hiding them. Maybe I'll try giving her two today. 🤔 Even the smallest changes can feel pretty radical with cats like Edwina and Betty.

Anyway, fingers crossed for more good poops, a successful lunch, and fun at the baseball card show. And hurray for that refund!
I am not convinced that the hairball treats alone are keeping them at bay. I think the poop pills from AnimalBiome are also helping greatly. Although we did have spits over the last month. I don’t remember many hairballs while she was on the first course. They returned when we finished the course. Now it’s too early to say on this second course. But I feel pretty good that acid doesn’t seem to be a problem with Betty. Maybe reflux? Nah. She just has cuddle burps. And I think that’s just her body positioning against me after a meal. Even though she seems like she’s going to pop with her cuddle burps, she never does. Hey it’s her preference. At least three meals a day she wants to cuddle afterwards even if it gives her the burps. 🤦🏼‍♂️😻😽🥰
 

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I am not convinced that the hairball treats alone are keeping them at bay. I think the poop pills from AnimalBiome are also helping greatly. Although we did have spits over the last month. I don’t remember many hairballs while she was on the first course. They returned when we finished the course. Now it’s too early to say on this second course. But I feel pretty good that acid doesn’t seem to be a problem with Betty. Maybe reflux? Nah. She just has cuddle burps. And I think that’s just her body positioning against me after a meal. Even though she seems like she’s going to pop with her cuddle burps, she never does. Hey it’s her preference. At least three meals a day she wants to cuddle afterwards even if it gives her the burps. 🤦🏼‍♂️😻😽🥰
Yes, it seems like a lot of things need to come together to keep hairballs at bay. Brushing is big for Edwina and then there are lots of ingredients in her various foods -- egg yolk, pumpkin, psyllium, all the stuff in the fish treats -- that help, too. I feel like I'm on the verge of finding the right balance but I've been wrong about that before! I do think the treats may be helping, though, even just one a day. I brushed her this afternoon and there was far less dandruff than usual and the brush didn't get as full as it generally does.

I know exactly what you mean about those burps! Both our cats get those sometimes after meals and even now, almost nine years after we adopted them, I still worry that someone's about to barf! For Edwina, the acid has historically come up early in the morning (most common) or if a meal later in the day has been delayed for some reason. If fed strategically, freeze-dried treats or raw food can help keep her from spitting up.
 

lisahe

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Each cat is unique. The Greenies "hairball treats" and brushing seem to work really well for us, as it's very, very rare for Baby Su or Elvis to have a furball.
It's so true about the uniqueness! Hair wasn't really a problem with our cats until the last few years... the cats are now nine and I think their motility is slowing down a little. I'm hoping we can keep Edwina (who's very, very fluffy) under control with food instead of pharma so feel fortunate that the cats like egg yolk and brushing!
 

daftcat75

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Each cat is unique. The Greenies "hairball treats" and brushing seem to work really well for us, as it's very, very rare for Baby Su or Elvis to have a furball.
As it should be. I think in Edwina and Betty’s cases, there is an underlying gut issue affecting the normal motility. It’s tempting to try to solve the hairball problem. But it’s that underlying issue that once solved should also solve the hairballs. For Betty, still waiting to learn what that underlying issue is. If it’s not cancer, we’ll stick with the poop pills as long as they are helping. I much prefer that to pred and pray. I might be willing to try budesonide with Betty if she really does need a steroidal boost. But I’m not yet convinced that the poop pills won’t get us there. It was pretty nice seeing how they shifted a lot of her imbalances in the correct direction.
 

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It really would be nice to know once and for all too what is causing all this IBS/Lymphoma in cats in general. This is my first cat in a very long line of them w/ it, and can’t help wondering if there’s an uptick, or something the catfood companies are doing, or what. Anyway, really rooting for these pills….Miss Betty really is like the Tenzing Norgay of Poop Mountain! A real pioneer for all cats!
 

lisahe

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It really would be nice to know once and for all too what is causing all this IBS/Lymphoma in cats in general. This is my first cat in a very long line of them w/ it, and can’t help wondering if there’s an uptick, or something the catfood companies are doing, or what. Anyway, really rooting for these pills….Miss Betty really is like the Tenzing Norgay of Poop Mountain! A real pioneer for all cats!
I think about this, too! I do wonder if some part of it is that people are now more cognizant of their cats' illnesses rather than just saying that cats are, for example, just naturally barfers. I would also hope that vets are now more attuned to IBD and lymphoma than they used to be. Our cat in the 2000s had IBD symptoms (bloody stool!) that a vet completely brushed off, saying cats got them a lot. And when two other vets at that practice saw her with full-blown symptoms in 2013, I was the one who finally said I thought she had IBD! We take our current cats to a different practice, to a cat specialist.

More than that, though, I wonder about things that cause inflammation in cats. Like all the ingredients that are in foods but not a cat's natural diet: vegetables, thickeners, and other additives that are in foods. I most suspect the thickeners -- all the gums and carrageenan, for example -- since corn, wheat, and other grains have been part of dry food for decades. And then there are environmental chemicals in cleaners, carpets, fabrics, and the like. One vet tech I talked with is convinced they're contributing to increased cases of asthma. (We have a cat with asthma...) We're very careful now not to put harsh cleaners (meaning just about anything other than water or basic soaps that are easy to rinse) on the floors or in the shower but I confess I didn't used to think about them.

On a brighter note, I'm rooting for the pills and Miss Betty, too!
 

lisahe

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As it should be. I think in Edwina and Betty’s cases, there is an underlying gut issue affecting the normal motility. It’s tempting to try to solve the hairball problem. But it’s that underlying issue that once solved should also solve the hairballs. For Betty, still waiting to learn what that underlying issue is. If it’s not cancer, we’ll stick with the poop pills as long as they are helping. I much prefer that to pred and pray. I might be willing to try budesonide with Betty if she really does need a steroidal boost. But I’m not yet convinced that the poop pills won’t get us there. It was pretty nice seeing how they shifted a lot of her imbalances in the correct direction.
I somehow missed this post earlier. Yes, Edwina definitely has some chronic motility issues that sometimes involve hair, though historically those problems have been relatively minor and managed very well with yolk and small amounts of fiber in her foods. (Plus brushing, since hair is what doesn't always move.) What's most concerning right now is that she's vomited far more than usual recently, something that I tend to think is related to something she's eating. I'm hoping lamb is the culprit. The timeline for lamb fits, I've just be painfully slow with the 2+2... acting first to remove the gums and other odd things in food that seemed, to me, more likely to cause her problems since thus far it's always been those ingredients (and not a primary protein) that's caused her vomiting problems, which have been very episodic, with some breaks. We've gone through this with her before, three times, when potato, agar-agar, and green-lipped mussels came out of her diet, so I am really kicking myself for not figuring this out sooner!

I'm hoping the poop pills work for Betty! And I'm particularly keeping a good eye on her case since it's totally possible we'll need to consider them for Edwina at some point, too.

P.S./Edit: I'm glad you created this thread so we can all learn from you and Betty, it's incredibly helpful.
 
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daftcat75 daftcat75 Are the hairball treats, Vermonts Naturals? I want to look up the ingredients for Geoffrey... He cannot have any chicken--none at all. He even gets sick from the hydrolyzed chicken treats.. But he is different. He has IBD plus Small Cell Lymphoma..
Bad day today, for us... --- not hijacking..

Margot Lane Margot Lane Yes, I think IBD and lymphoma are rally too widespread-- too prominent to be a coincidence. I really wonder.. Many years ago.. indoor and a lot of outdoor cats, lived long lives--and they ate a lot of table scraps, and some cat food... Cat food was not very popular...

I swear it is all the additives, chemicals we use, and poor manufacturing---allowing diseased and medicated meat sources.. and the over use of antibiotics..

Sorry---hijacked Betty's thread....((hugs))
 

daftcat75

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daftcat75 daftcat75 Are the hairball treats, Vermonts Naturals? I want to look up the ingredients for Geoffrey... He cannot have any chicken--none at all. He even gets sick from the hydrolyzed chicken treats.. But he is different. He has IBD plus Small Cell Lymphoma..
Bad day today, for us... --- not hijacking..

Margot Lane Margot Lane Yes, I think IBD and lymphoma are rally too widespread-- too prominent to be a coincidence. I really wonder.. Many years ago.. indoor and a lot of outdoor cats, lived long lives--and they ate a lot of table scraps, and some cat food... Cat food was not very popular...

I swear it is all the additives, chemicals we use, and poor manufacturing---allowing diseased and medicated meat sources.. and the over use of antibiotics..

Sorry---hijacked Betty's thread....((hugs))
Yes the hairball treats are Pet Naturals of VT. They have “hydrolyzed chicken liver flavor.” That may or may not make Geoffrey pop. 🤦🏼‍♂️ But at least they are trying to be IBD sensitive.👍

Hairball for Cats
 

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daftcat75 daftcat75 Are the hairball treats, Vermonts Naturals? I want to look up the ingredients for Geoffrey... He cannot have any chicken--none at all. He even gets sick from the hydrolyzed chicken treats.. But he is different. He has IBD plus Small Cell Lymphoma..
Bad day today, for us... --- not hijacking..

Margot Lane Margot Lane Yes, I think IBD and lymphoma are rally too widespread-- too prominent to be a coincidence. I really wonder.. Many years ago.. indoor and a lot of outdoor cats, lived long lives--and they ate a lot of table scraps, and some cat food... Cat food was not very popular...

I swear it is all the additives, chemicals we use, and poor manufacturing---allowing diseased and medicated meat sources.. and the over use of antibiotics..

Sorry---hijacked Betty's thread....((hugs))
I agree, and the same applies to what passes for "food" that most people in industrialized societies eat. TERRIBLE. It's so good that @daftcat takes such good care of Betty and is so concerned for her wellbeing!
 
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