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Ibd Or Intestinal Lymphoma

WinniesMomma

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Feb 15, 2019
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I have a 12 year old spayed female indoor cat, she's the only cat in our house. She had her annual well as visit and everything was fine. She had a couple bouts of vomiting, but it was mostly liquid, and it was more of a regurgitation.
Two weeks ago she had another occurrence and she looked like she didn't feel well, along with stomach rumbling so I made an appointment with her vet. They gave her fluids and anti-nausea injection and ran a thyroid test and gave her a gastro sensitive food and Fortiflora probiotic A couple days later she had another small regurg so back we went to the vet. The thyroid test was normal, but they re-ran her blood work along with a pancreatitis test and xray. The pancreatitis test came back positive but the vet noticed abnormalities on her x-ray, so he sent her info to a different hospital and we scheduled an ultrasound.
That doctor went over with me what she saw. I don't remember all of the technical terms, but there are some issues with her small intestines, something like stuff didn't flow through them as they normally should. She also saw enlarged lymph nodes in her stomach area and additional tissue. She told me it is likely what caused the pancreatitis, and the stomach/intestines are the main problem. She said it is either inflammatory bowel disease or small grade (if I have that term correctly) intestinal lymphoma. She explained to know for sure up front, she would need a scope and biopsies done. Or I could start her on a steroid and I'd she had a relapse or didn't do better, we'd know it's most likely lymphoma.
Her main vet called and said they got a quote from the specialty hospital (different one than where she went for the ultrasound) where the scope would be done if I wanted to do that, and it was $5000! I unfortunately don't have that money, so we started her on prednisolone on Wednesday. She seems to be more herself than when I first had to bring her in a couple weeks ago. But she still feels thinner to me, she doesn't clean very often, and she doesn't play much. She wouldn't play much before, but she had her moments oef running around and batting a toy -not really now. She also acts so hungry even after I feed her. The vet has me giving her smaller portions every couple of hours (during the week when I am at work I use an automatic feeder) so as not to irritate her stomach with a larger amount at once. I feel bad that she feels so hungry even when being fed every couple of hours. I know steroids can do this, but this was even before she started them.

I wondered if anyone has been through this, or has any advice. I am wondering if CBD oil for pets is something to consider. I also read about B12 shots, I am not sure if that would help with the hunger issue. I am going to follow up with her vet as well. It scares me to know she doesn't feel well and could be in pain, and not feel like I can heal her, though I'm trying the best I can. I also dread the thought of losing her, although I know it is eventual. I just didn't think it would be something I'd be thinking of this soon in her life. She's been pretty healthy otherwise. Thanks in advance.
 
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WinniesMomma

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Feb 15, 2019
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(P.s. I am sorry for any typos, I posted this from my phone.)
 

daftcat75

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There just aren’t enough (any?) cat studies on CBD. And cats aren’t small dogs. We can guess that what works for a dog can also work for a cat. But without the research to back it up, that’s all it is: a guess. I’m not comfortable with that. Also in my experience with CBD, it’s difficult to find the right dose, it’s not really strong enough for acute pancreatitis pain, and it may have drug interactions with anything else that needs to be processed by the liver but especially opiates if she is prescribed any.

If she tolerates Cerenia well, I would use that instead. It has anti inflammatory action specific to pancreatitis in addition to being an anti-emetic (no barf.). You’ll still likely need an appetite stimulant.

Finally look up bone broth and IBD cats. I’m also on a phone right now or I’d link you. Bone broth will be so helpful for healing gut permeability and might even settle some nausea and shore up her appetite.

Oh. And b-12 shots. Definitely do those. You won’t get anywhere with IBD/pancreatitis without them.
 
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WinniesMomma

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Thank you so much! I wasn't sure about CBD either but saw something come up while trying to research so I figured I'd ask. Cerenia is what she got from the vet as an injection, I will check in with them about that, as well as the B12. And I will look up bone broth as well. I appreciate it!
 

daftcat75

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I don't have a problem with trying CBD for anxiety or arthritis or something a little less high stakes than pancreatitis. Pancreatitis can definitely be brought back to normal but you can't mess around with it. The longer the pancreas remains inflamed, the more damage its digestive enzymes can do to the organ. That's why it's also so painful. The pancreas is literally digesting itself. If your kitty looks like mine below, that’s pancreatic pain. But you also need to get the intestinal inflammation (regardless of the diagnosis) under control too. If you’re feeding dry, start transitioning to all wet or as little dry as you can get away with. Dry food is carb heavy and comes out of the stomach the wrong pH for the digestive enzymes. It will work against you trying to get the inflammation under control.

Bone broth will work in your favor. So will probiotics. Digestive enzyme supplements may work against you. Krista looks the same as the picture below when I give her digestive enzyme supplements. Like those enzymes aren’t just digesting her food.
 

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WinniesMomma

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Oh okay, I gotcha. She has been on wet food for years now. The food she is now eating per the vet is canned wet Purina Pro Plan Veterinary Diets En Gastroenteric Feline Formula. I will stick with this and the probiotics, and look into the bone broth. I'll also speak to her vet about the B12 and Cerenia.

Aww poor Krista. How is she doing now I'd you don't mind me asking? Winnie seems to be acting more like herself, she seems to be sitting and sleeping comfortably, so hopefully that is a good sign.

Thanks again!
 

daftcat75

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Krista was on the glide path to good health again. But her teeth started to bother her again. We’ve got a dental appointment for Tuesday to see how many will need to go this time. Not her first round of extractions. But hopefully she and her appetite will come roaring back. She’s been through too much to be defeated by her teeth.
 

daftcat75

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I'm trying to believe the corner is coming and we're about to turn it. But we've been about to turn that corner for about a year now. Tooth extractions, IBD, pancreatitis, more choleoangiohepatits (hat trick!), more tooth extractions, feeding tube, more tooth extractions, middle ear infection/perforated eardrum/Horner's syndrome, and now something more going on with her mouth. I wish they could yank all her teeth and be done with it instead of waiting for them to go bad and putting the both of us through the stress of as much as five days of hyporexia/anorexia. But she keeps greeting the day with all the adorable persistence of a kitty who's not ready to throw in the towel even if she's also not ready to eat a solid meal. (Or poop a solid poop for that matter.) I think she's got more strength and resilience for this than I do. I just try to keep up and do what I can for her.
 

Bird

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Feb 4, 2019
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The endoscopy estimate seems high. I’ve been dealing with a similar issue, and my cat had an endoscopy with biopsies about a week ago at a VCA hospital. It was around $1700 and I live in a high cost of living area.

My cat was also put on prednisolone, but she is also taking Cerenia (anti-vomiting drug).
 

JazzyKitty

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Feb 15, 2019
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I'm glad you found the automatic feeder! My cat's life revolves around that thing (for the dry food). She is also 100% on the Hills TY (thyroid) prescription diet. Her doctor said that he sees the IBD cats do well with this food, and I noticed a BIG difference when I first put her on it. She also gets prednisone crushed in her food. She has been getting the B12 shot for about three months now and it seems to help. She seemed to be losing weight and not feeling well a few weeks ago, so her vet wants her to come in for a shot of steroids and an antibiotic shot. He said that with IBD cats this can help to get them back on track.

Hang in there! :catface:
 
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WinniesMomma

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Feb 15, 2019
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Daftcat75 - good luck to you both! I'll be thinking of her. And yes, cats do seem more resilient than us when it comes to these situations!

Bird - I thought that seemed like a really high cost that they told me. Your total is more what I was expecting. I suppose I can call around to try to get estimates from other places. The problem is now that she started the steroids, that can change the result of the biopsy, so she would have to be off of them for a certain amount of time. I think I'll see how she continues to do and then depending, will look into other estimates. I think I am going to ask my vet if she should be on Cerenia also. She received a shot in the office but I don't know if it's something she should be on frequently. It's so hard not knowing how they feel.

JazzyKitty - I am, too! So far so good. Good luck to you! I do plan on asking the vet about the B12 as I see this mentioned a lot.
 

daftcat75

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Insist upon the B-12 shots!

The rule of thumb for IBD vs lymphoma seems to be whether you can stabilize the weight loss or even put weight back on. Cancer eats calories! However, you won't be able to put weight back on without B-12. It is so essential for so many processes for deriving nutrition from food. If she's lost weight to this, she's almost certainly having trouble deriving nutrition from her food. Thus oral supplementation of B-12 alone wouldn't be sufficient. But here's the kicker. It is water soluble and extremely safe. Any excess is harmlessly excreted in the urine.

So if she needs it (if she's been losing weight, I'd say yes), it's absolutely critical to her recovery. And if she doesn't need it, it's mildly expensive pee. If you buy the B-12 bottle yourself and do the shots at home (subcutaneous: under the skin in the scruff, not into a vein, not that hard), you'll save money and vet trips. You'll likely need to do one shot per week for the first six weeks and then you can taper off to every other week if her weight is stable or increasing again. It should cost you less than $100 to buy a bottle, syringes and needles, and a Sharps Disposal for the used needles.

B-12 worked so well for Krista that I stopped giving the shots myself. She was getting too perky and squirmy for them. Now I bring my bottle into the vet's office and they do the shot for me at no cost. Make the vet techs the villain. It's also so immediate that I tell the vet techs now to wait to the end of the visit to give the shot because there's no sense in putting an extra charge into her before you fuss her up with whatever else the visit may entail.

Subcutaneous fluids are another one that seems to make a difference for Krista. If she has been vomiting recently or having soupy stools (like with antibiotics), then I ask for fluids. It seems to take the stink out of her face when she's not feeling so hot.
 
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WinniesMomma

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Thank you so much for all of your suggestions and sharing your experiences! :) It's so scary when facing something I'm not familiar with.
 
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WinniesMomma

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Just an update. I made beef broth for Winnie and she was not interested. :/ My local store only had beef bones. So I'll have to try chicken and see if she's more interested in that. Good news, though. Winnie was actually acting more like herself today, cleaning herself and she even played for a few minutes!
 

daftcat75

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Krista isn’t crazy about any bone broth on its own. But I can sometimes sneak it into a tuna treat meal.
 
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WinniesMomma

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Oh gotcha. I was thinking she would love it. Maybe I'll try chicken and see about mixing it with something.
 

daftcat75

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Not all cats like red meat. So if Winnie doesn't go for beef bone broth, try chicken. Try turkey if you can find it. If you're not opposed to feeding fish, you can make a fish stock. Try mixing it into food if she doesn't care for it straight. You may want to mix it with a little tuna water if she likes that. Then you can adjust the tuna water to bone broth ratio until she's getting as much bone broth as you'd like her to have. I will be doing this with chamomille tea when Krista comes back from vet tonight. I can't put her through another round of antibiotics. Her gut hasn't recovered from last week. So she'll get natural antibiotics--one way or another.
 
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WinniesMomma

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She loves tuna/juice! Thank you! Good luck with Krista!
 
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WinniesMomma

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Hello, all. Just an update. Earlier in the week I spoke with the vet office and they were happy to hear Winnie seemed better and has an appetite. They seemed to think keeping her as she is (pred, gastro food, smaller meals more often) was the way to go.

Yesterday early morning Winnie had a small bit of vomit, however there was some fur in it so I figured it was a hairball. She wanted to eat a couple hours after so figured no big deal. But then a few hours from there she didn't want to eat and seemed like her stomach was bothering her. So I called her vet office and they had me bring her in to get fluids, Cerenia injection, and they also gave her prescription for Mirtazapine for me to give every 72 hours if needed in case she doesn't want to eat. I am debating on calling the internal med Dr she saw for the ultrasound to see if she any other recommendations/advice, she was really nice and told me to call if she could help in any way. And my current vet office doesn't seem to think she needs the b12 shots. They told me to call tomorrow to let them know how she is.

Part of me is worried, because the internal med vet said if she relapses while on the pred, it likely means it is lymphoma. I'm not sure if what happened yesterday is considered a relapse. I just had to share my thoughts.
 
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