I Have More Trust Issues Than This Feral..

Buffster7

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Well I wish I knew how to have Ziggy not chase Waffles. I'm intervening but not sure how to help it stop other than intervening, make things positive, time, play, distraction and all that. If any suggestions! But then it's only been 2 months so we are very early.
And it's good Ziggy is happy in her room- plus when she's out.
And yes, Jcatbird Jcatbird , it was just like "yeah ok, all's good..." Wish they'd do that all the time!
What's the age difference between them, just out of curiosity? Finn will still try and chase Charlie now and then. Sometimes I will tell him "no no" - he is such a smart cat, he knows. I also have to make a concerted effort to give Charlie extra playtime which is hard because he's old and doesn't really like to play. I have to prompt, cajole, try to tempt nonstop before he'll engage. It wears ME out actually, ha. But the more I engage him in play, the more his self-confidence grows, and the less he puts up with from Finn. Finn senses it and tends to chase him less.
 

pearl99

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What's the age difference between them, just out of curiosity? Finn will still try and chase Charlie now and then. Sometimes I will tell him "no no" - he is such a smart cat, he knows. I also have to make a concerted effort to give Charlie extra playtime which is hard because he's old and doesn't really like to play. I have to prompt, cajole, try to tempt nonstop before he'll engage. It wears ME out actually, ha. But the more I engage him in play, the more his self-confidence grows, and the less he puts up with from Finn. Finn senses it and tends to chase him less.
Ziggy 13 years, Waffles will be 6 years in August. Ziggy hasn't been around other cats before this so she's still learning and she just came here at the beginning of March. They both like to play so I've been doing that. Will keep it up! I guess saying it's only been since March makes me remember time! time! time! :D
 

Buffster7

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So.... how are you and the boys doing? Well I hope!
Hiiiiii Jcatbird Jcatbird ! I hope you and your clowder have all been behaving and doing well! I will hop over to your thread shortly and sneak a peek!
My boys have been going through a little rough patch. I never have any idea what sets them off, but lately I've noticed them both being very jumpy, like they suspect the other one is sneaking up on them from behind. Both acting defensive and then sneak-attacking each other. Maybe sometimes it's playing, but my feeling is that it's territorial dispute. They no longer sleep on the same chair - they haven't for quite a while now. Last night I was getting ready for bed when I heard bodies hitting the floor and Charlie yelping from the other room. It wasn't a quick tussle, it was a lengthy one - Finn had attacked when he left the litter box. I have 3 litter boxes available but they refuse to use any but one - and then they are territorial over it. The other 2 go untouched.

Then a few minutes later, I was watching on the camera, and Finn made a beeline for Charlie and bit him pretty good on the back. Charlie yelped, I got pissed, and so the evening went. :lol: Charlie still "goes for" Finn more in the mornings. Usually Finn is minding his own business in the mornings; he just wants to lay in front of the fireplace or play with one of his toys, and Charlie starts picking on him. I have been starting to correct it as I watched it go on for a while, and to me it does not look like Finn enjoys it. It's hard for me to tell what is play and what is not. Yes, I've watched all the videos on play vs fighting. The cats display both qualities; I think sometimes it starts as play but they're very mismatched in size, so it appears to turn serious. So maybe Finn got fed up and decided to start asserting himself. :bat: It's tiring!

Then this morning we had this little dude show up. Thank the Lord for outdoor critters that help establish a truce on the inside!! Thought you might like this one:
FinnCharlieFroggie.jpg
 

pearl99

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Good to hear from you Buffster7 Buffster7 ! That is pretty funny, the little frog. Oh those boys, hope they settle down.

With the stay at home stuff I've been mostly doing cat intros and yard work, with my extra time at home!
I have Ziggy out with the others a couple of times per day with supervision right with her for a short period, there is progress. She loves her room and never complains about being in there, thank goodness. I bet her intro will take another 6 months or more, but it's so doable and not a hard process.
She's so playful for being 13 years old.
Gracie is out and about in the house more, just strolling around- which is good, more exercise for her.
Moofles are great also!
I got these tunnels for them and they are so funny with them, they are a hit:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00Q2G83K0/?tag=thecatsite
 

Buffster7

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Good to hear from you Buffster7 Buffster7 ! That is pretty funny, the little frog. Oh those boys, hope they settle down.

With the stay at home stuff I've been mostly doing cat intros and yard work, with my extra time at home!
I have Ziggy out with the others a couple of times per day with supervision right with her for a short period, there is progress. She loves her room and never complains about being in there, thank goodness. I bet her intro will take another 6 months or more, but it's so doable and not a hard process.
She's so playful for being 13 years old.
Gracie is out and about in the house more, just strolling around- which is good, more exercise for her.
Moofles are great also!
I got these tunnels for them and they are so funny with them, they are a hit:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00Q2G83K0/?tag=thecatsite
I just love hearing your updates! Your clan sounds like they're doing fantastic! I recently got a tunnel for Finn, too, along with that fish that flops. He actually gets pretty good use out of his toys - he does like the tunnel!

This down-time has been a gift in so many ways, hasn't it? Will your schedule be changing once the restrictions are lifted? I had one remaining clinical rotation when COVID hit, which was put on hold. The facility has not yet opened up. I don't know when I'll be able to go back at this point. I was supposed to graduate in May and sit for boards sometime this summer. Never in my life have I been in a position where I have no idea what my life will look like in 3 or 6 months, it's a real test of faith.

Anyway, I hope things continue to go this smooth and that your guys are fully integrated in the remainder of this year. More videos and pics, please! I could look at cat pics and vids for days.:lol:
 

pearl99

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Buffster7 Buffster7 , are you doing nursing or PT or something by chance? No, my schedule won't change since I'm retired. There will only be social things to do that will be added. Last week those over 65 were allowed to return to volunteering at the shelter, so I am back to that now.
I've kind of enjoyed the down time outside of getting a bit stir crazy being limited on what we can do.
Today I maybe let Ziggy be out too long, Moo was in a chair, Gracie asleep, Waffles in the basement- Ziggy laying here and there and playing some- then all of a sudden she decided to rush at Moo in the chair. I had my trusty cardboard to put in front of Ziggy. So maybe she looks calm but something is building inside.
I'll try to get some pics tomorrow and maybe a video!
Keep us posted on yours, I love hearing about them!
 

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I just love hearing your updates! Your clan sounds like they're doing fantastic! I recently got a tunnel for Finn, too, along with that fish that flops. He actually gets pretty good use out of his toys - he does like the tunnel!

This down-time has been a gift in so many ways, hasn't it? Will your schedule be changing once the restrictions are lifted? I had one remaining clinical rotation when COVID hit, which was put on hold. The facility has not yet opened up. I don't know when I'll be able to go back at this point. I was supposed to graduate in May and sit for boards sometime this summer. Never in my life have I been in a position where I have no idea what my life will look like in 3 or 6 months, it's a real test of faith.

Anyway, I hope things continue to go this smooth and that your guys are fully integrated in the remainder of this year. More videos and pics, please! I could look at cat pics and vids for days.:lol:
If you have room for it a children's play tent with a tunnel might be good for both of them. I have one and all 4 of mine love it, even my 16 year old senior would run through it occasionally but never even considered the smaller Cat tunnels.
 

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Ziggy laying here and there and playing some- then all of a sudden she decided to rush at Moo in the chair. I had my trusty cardboard to put in front of Ziggy. So maybe she looks calm but something is building inside.
Oh my goodness, look at you being calm and level-headed! Just with a fast-draw on the cardboard, narrowly avoiding disaster like it's NBD. :lol: I need to go back and read Ziggy's story....was Ziggy the cat of a friend's son who passed away? I need to get my stories straight. I'm always curious to know how much of an impact loss of home has on a cat's temperament.
If you have room for it a children's play tent with a tunnel might be good for both of them. I have one and all 4 of mine love it, even my 16 year old senior would run through it occasionally but never even considered the smaller Cat tunnels.
I never thought about a children's play tent, but that's a great idea! I don't know if I could get away with it with them but it's something to work toward. By that I mean that new toys tend to become territorial disputes for them. Bad. Remember the ripple rug that Finn absolutely LOVED? I can't even bring it out, because they fight over it. I am not spending ANY money right now, none. No clinical/graduation and resulting employment in sight, scary times. So I can't purchase duplicates of anything. But at some point in the future I'll get another Ripple Rug so they can each have one. And I'll look into the children's tent - I do love that idea!!
 

pearl99

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Oh my goodness, look at you being calm and level-headed! Just with a fast-draw on the cardboard, narrowly avoiding disaster like it's NBD. :lol: I need to go back and read Ziggy's story....was Ziggy the cat of a friend's son who passed away? I need to get my stories straight. I'm always curious to know how much of an impact loss of home has on a cat's temperament.
Yes Ziggy was from the neighbors' son who died. She's 13 years old, so this has been an adjustment. But I haven't seen that much that I can attribute to that, she adjusted well! She just has never been around other cats so I'm going real slow.
 

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Hiiiiii Jcatbird Jcatbird ! I hope you and your clowder have all been behaving and doing well! I will hop over to your thread shortly and sneak a peek!
My boys have been going through a little rough patch. I never have any idea what sets them off, but lately I've noticed them both being very jumpy, like they suspect the other one is sneaking up on them from behind. Both acting defensive and then sneak-attacking each other. Maybe sometimes it's playing, but my feeling is that it's territorial dispute. They no longer sleep on the same chair - they haven't for quite a while now. Last night I was getting ready for bed when I heard bodies hitting the floor and Charlie yelping from the other room. It wasn't a quick tussle, it was a lengthy one - Finn had attacked when he left the litter box. I have 3 litter boxes available but they refuse to use any but one - and then they are territorial over it. The other 2 go untouched.

Then a few minutes later, I was watching on the camera, and Finn made a beeline for Charlie and bit him pretty good on the back. Charlie yelped, I got pissed, and so the evening went. :lol: Charlie still "goes for" Finn more in the mornings. Usually Finn is minding his own business in the mornings; he just wants to lay in front of the fireplace or play with one of his toys, and Charlie starts picking on him. I have been starting to correct it as I watched it go on for a while, and to me it does not look like Finn enjoys it. It's hard for me to tell what is play and what is not. Yes, I've watched all the videos on play vs fighting. The cats display both qualities; I think sometimes it starts as play but they're very mismatched in size, so it appears to turn serious. So maybe Finn got fed up and decided to start asserting himself. :bat: It's tiring!

Then this morning we had this little dude show up. Thank the Lord for outdoor critters that help establish a truce on the inside!! Thought you might like this one:
View attachment 337925
My mom always made us a tent when we were kids by putting a sheet over a table. Got two tables? Lol we loved the sheet tents. Great idea.

I think Banjo must have sent word down the Froggie pipeline! That looks a lot like a Froggie relative to me! Keep a light on near there and the frogs will come at night. Lol
 

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My mom always made us a tent when we were kids by putting a sheet over a table. Got two tables? Lol we loved the sheet tents. Great idea.
Yes, I remember you telling me to try this, now! I didn't relish the thought of having blankets strewn over tables and the disheveled house, but my house is already looking like cat candy land and anything is worth a little peace! Besides, Finn is so smart and so energetic, he really needs new diversions on a regular basis for his mental health.

I just wanted to pop back in and report something positive. These boys have been bickering and fussing for weeks, now. I mean, really not being nice to each other. I was starting to give up hope that they were ever going to get along. Next month will be a year since I took Finn in. And then (and looking back, I guess this is a bit of a pattern), just as I'm giving up hope, I get up to get more coffee this morning and this is what I see. Keep in mind that they've been testy with each other this morning already, so I nearly fainted when I saw this! And so the little flame of hope is fanned once more:
CrazyCats.jpg
 

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Yes, I remember you telling me to try this, now! I didn't relish the thought of having blankets strewn over tables and the disheveled house, but my house is already looking like cat candy land and anything is worth a little peace! Besides, Finn is so smart and so energetic, he really needs new diversions on a regular basis for his mental health.

I just wanted to pop back in and report something positive. These boys have been bickering and fussing for weeks, now. I mean, really not being nice to each other. I was starting to give up hope that they were ever going to get along. Next month will be a year since I took Finn in. And then (and looking back, I guess this is a bit of a pattern), just as I'm giving up hope, I get up to get more coffee this morning and this is what I see. Keep in mind that they've been testy with each other this morning already, so I nearly fainted when I saw this! And so the little flame of hope is fanned once more:
View attachment 338944
Some Cats just like to be "frienemies". It's not abnormal at all, even with people. When I was younger there was a kid who lived down the street from me and we'd constantly go back and forth between fighting and being friends. We just couldn't stand being around eachother for long, even though we had some things in common and had fun playing together we'd always end up getting into a disagreement about something that would turn into fighting.
 

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Some Cats just like to be "frienemies". It's not abnormal at all, even with people. When I was younger there was a kid who lived down the street from me and we'd constantly go back and forth between fighting and being friends. We just couldn't stand being around eachother for long, even though we had some things in common and had fun playing together we'd always end up getting into a disagreement about something that would turn into fighting.
This is hilarious! And a pretty apt description! I wish I didn't get so stressed when they go through the enemy stage! It's so hard for me to see and hear those tussles and fur flying. But even when they're not getting along I still have the sense that they're happier hating each other than they would be being alone.

Last night I sprinkled some Zylkene in their food to chill them out for bed after they picked on each other all day, forgetting that Zylkene really has a strange effect on Charlie. Well, when the Zylkene kicked in and Charlie started giving some really eerie, distressed cries (this is when I remembered why I don't give it to him anymore) - Finn started crying in response and went to find him, all concerned. So even after a day of being not nice to each other - it still distressed Finn to see Charlie act weird. So I do think they consider themselves part of a pack somehow. Frenemies..
 

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P.S. See that bald spot on Finn's left ear? Pretty sure that's where Charlie bit it. And Charlie has a scab on the back of his neck where Finn bit HIM. SMH. And yet here they sit butt-to-butt..... cats.
 

pearl99

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Buffster7 Buffster7 I got a couple short videos of Moo with Ziggy out (Waffles is in the basement, Gracie is asleep.) First one with Moo in a chair, Ziggy having beelined for one of her favorite spots to roll around and hang out. Pretty benign.

Second one when Ziggy gets really focused on Moo before she might rush Moo and I have to have all my distraction wits about me!

View media item 423505
View media item 423506
 

Buffster7

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Second one when Ziggy gets really focused on Moo before she might rush Moo and I have to have all my distraction wits about me!
Moo just makes me smile! I love the chill, laid-back attitude! And boy oh boy, do I know the Ziggy stare all too well! BOTH of my boys get that look on their faces, and it can be intense! Does Ziggy make a beeline for any of the other cats like that, or just Moo? I wonder what it is that makes some cats fixate on particular others, especially when as benign as Moo?
 

pearl99

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Ziggy does the stare with Mooshoo and Waffles, not at all with Gracie.
When Gracie sees Ziggy she has no reaction, just a glance and Gracie just continues sauntering on her way. Plus Gracie sleeps a lot so not much chance for interaction. They have met in the hallway twice, each going a different direction and nothing.

Waffles and Moo do crouch in the pounce ready pose, watch closely, when they see Ziggy out of her room. But Waffles now knows the signs that I'm about to let Ziggy out (taking the gates down, getting my cardboard) and he heads for the basement :lol:. He's choosing not to be part of this introduction right now. So it's mostly Moo. And it takes about 15 minutes before Ziggy gets intense.
Yesterday Moo got down on the floor to move from the chair after carefully seeing where Ziggy was. Progress!
 

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Okay you guys! Anyone who has ever had attacking kitties might benefit from reading this thread. I know everyone gets tired of me saying,” they are reacting to something”! Lol I have always believed that our kitties come into contact with things that cause anxiety, allergies, reactions etc. and food can be a possibility. I found this thread verrry interesting and possibly , right on the mark.
Obviously cats react to many things but this could be one! Diet change solved problem of cats fighting
 

pearl99

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Okay you guys! Anyone who has ever had attacking kitties might benefit from reading this thread. I know everyone gets tired of me saying,” they are reacting to something”! Lol I have always believed that our kitties come into contact with things that cause anxiety, allergies, reactions etc. and food can be a possibility. I found this thread verrry interesting and possibly , right on the mark.
Obviously cats react to many things but this could be one! Diet change solved problem of cats fighting
I read that thread the other day! Very interesting. Ziggy came with food she already had, and I'm getting to the end of it so starting to change her over to what I feed mine. (I didn't want to waste all that food of hers, and she'd been on it for years so decided new home plus new food might be a bit much, so left her on her old food.) It's not a very good food.
We will see!
 
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