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I Have More Trust Issues Than This Feral..

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  • #741

Buffster7

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Jul 1, 2019
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Charlie! :redheartpump: He really does want Finn around. I love how he is calling. That trill call is a very good thing. I know when Finn is better, Charlie will be glad to see him.
I sure hope so! Never thought I'd see the day when Charlie would be the needy one! I hope that Finn will warm up to Charlie once he gets to feeling better. So grateful for all your input!
 

Feral Mom

TCS Member
Adult Cat
Jul 11, 2019
105
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Clearwater Florida, USA
Okay, I am late to the party here, but I "was" avidly following the introduction of Finn to Charlie,
but I have been offline for quite a while.
Last i knew, there were some spotty but questionable introductions, but, "seemed to be" going in the right direction.
and now,
i am like 5 pages of posts behind.

in a nutshell,
did Charlie accept Finn?
Did Finn accept Charlie?
or,
still a work in progress?

at any rate, i am so rooting for both cats Plus the momma too!!
 
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  • #744

Buffster7

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Alpha Cat
Jul 1, 2019
484
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Okay, I am late to the party here, but I "was" avidly following the introduction of Finn to Charlie,
but I have been offline for quite a while.
Last i knew, there were some spotty but questionable introductions, but, "seemed to be" going in the right direction.
and now,
i am like 5 pages of posts behind.

in a nutshell,
did Charlie accept Finn?
Did Finn accept Charlie?
or,
still a work in progress?

at any rate, i am so rooting for both cats Plus the momma too!!
Hi Feral Mom Feral Mom ! Well, all introductions are on pause right now while Finn recovers from his second bout of UTI. He went to ER Vet when he was unable to pee and was diagnosed with FLUTD. About 10 days later the symptoms resurfaced, and back to the vet he went for another steroid shot and more antibiotics.

He looks to be feeling better and his last antibiotic pill is tomorrow, so I will wait a couple days and take a urine sample to vet and make sure that there is no blood in his urine. So Finn is still recovering in his room, and Charlie waits impatiently for him to feel better. I get the feeling that they are enjoying this pause - both of them. The other night I carried Finn out in my arms to adjust the thermostat (just so I didn't have to go through the drama of escaping his room without him, all the wailing that follows, and then try to re-enter without him escaping) - and both he and Charlie seemed relieved when I re-entered Finn's room and closed the gates behind us! It was almost palpable. So there's a little excitement on Charlie's part but still uncertainty/anxiety on both sides. Thanks for checking in on us! Hopefully introductions can start up again in a week or so..
 

Feral Mom

TCS Member
Adult Cat
Jul 11, 2019
105
255
Clearwater Florida, USA
OH Buffster, (someday, we must find out what "buffster" :lol: means, and why there are 7 of you... )
edit: I got it, you love working out, and you do work out 7 days a week, right? am i right? (cmon, tell i am right, i havent' been right once today!! haha)
thank you for update,:fallsmiley: (i will go back and read all the 5 pages that i missed, at some point, because i am very interested!!!)

I was so sorry to hear little Finnster has FULTD. I had to google that,, so thank you for new word in my head.:hellocomputer:
Awwww,
well, your intuition and sense that maybe both cats needed some respite :bicolorcat::paranoid::bicolorcat: from all the intensity of excitement:hyper: of a new sibling, is probably accurate. You have been right about many things all along.
Poor lil stinkers, the both of 'em!!

Hope you are doing well, too. I know how exhAUSTing school can be,:sleep2: especially those first few semesters. :paranoid: Hang in there, i will be back to lurking and catching up on TCS soon.
SO happy to hear, that so far, so good, mostly.
 
Last edited:
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  • #749

Buffster7

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Awww... poor Finn. Hope this is the end of his UTI issues. :crossfingers:
Thank you, me too! I felt terrible to think that much of the time stress brings it on. He comes across as so cocky, I didn't know he was feeling as stressed as he was. :(

I think a paws in the whole process is a much needed rest for all. :p
Ha! I've come to peace with it and now that school is in full swing, I haven't been able to give it much thought. Although I am getting company in a couple weeks, so am going to have to figure out where to put Finn. I do need my guest bedroom back at some point. :tongue: But yes, another good thing that has come from it is that I have been leaving Finn's door open when I'm in there with him (previously I would close it so as not to make Charlie jealous) - and Charlie has been hanging out watching us play and interact. I think that's been good for both of them, actually. Charlie seems to look forward to his nightly "viewing" now and will lay in the hallway and watch us. Sometimes he'll chirp and try to entice Finn to pay attention to him (it never works). In fact, sometimes Finn will follow me into the enclosure and Charlie will stick his paws through the wire and bat at Finn's tail; Finn will glance at him and turn his back, then walk away. That's like a cat insult, right?

Poor lil stinkers, the both of 'em!!
They sure are...just tonight I was telling them, "You know, when you two get your act together and decide to get along, I'm going to be outnumbered and in trouble.." They have me wrapped around their little paws and they're SMART. Finn is exceptionally bright.
Tonight was the first night that Charlie didn't come lay and watch us play. I actually left Finn's room to check on him; he was laying by himself listening, but not bothering to come watch. Finn kept looking for him, too. After all his snubbing of Charlie, he got snubbed tonight and he noticed.. :lol: I sure hope things are going well for YOU! One day I will get caught up on both yours and Walli's threads - goals! I look forward to having free weekends again one day!
 

Jcatbird

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A snub by Charlie is exactly what he needed to do. Any cat being pursued may find it something they feel they should reject. Thus ,turning their back. For Charlie to show disinterest is a good way to get Finn curious and interested. Lol Smart boy Charlie! He turned the tables on Finn. :lol: This could be good! I love watching the interactions between cats. They have a culture and language all their own. I notice you are becoming very fluent in cat speak.
This break in everything may be exactly what was beeded. Slowing the pace is working for everyone. :yess:
 
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  • #751

Buffster7

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Hi guys! I have a vet appointment for both Finn and Charlie tomorrow. Finn will be checked to make sure there's no more blood in his urine. Charlie will receive a "well cat" checkup. He hasn't had a checkup in a long time, and I want to make sure that he is healthy on all levels. I've heard that cats will attack each other if one of them is hiding illness, so thought it might be a good idea rule that out since Finn was so intent on going for Charlie before. Anything specific I should have them check on Charlie? I don't even know what to ask for.

Now Finn...as long as he is clear and there's no sign of blood in urine, I suppose we will be starting intros again soon. Can anyone help decipher some body language? Finn is mock-charging Charlie through the barrier. I *think* he's playing but not sure - and it scares Charlie. I caught the tail end of one on vid that I will post.

Also, can anyone translate cat into English for me? I put Finn in the cage tonight. I sat on the floor beside it and Charlie was on the other side of me. Finn finally joined us on the ground floor of the cage but went right toward Charlie and started smacking through the bars. I couldn't see whether claws were out or not, but Charlie was mock-snapping at his paws. At one point I thought I heard a hiss, and I did see Finn bite the blanket he was sitting on. What is that? Also, when he was in his cage, his pupils were huge. Is that a sign of fear? I'm trying to decipher his reactions and body language. Can't figure out whether Charlie makes him scared or jealous/angry.
 

Jcatbird

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Dilated pupils is a clear sign of excitement. Cats do that at many times. It can be in play, pursuit of prey or in attack mode. It’s aroused state. Finn does have Cattitude. I think you are trying to read them before they make their minds up. It’s not a ,one statement and all is said and done. It’s still a process of working through ,that they have not had a chance to do. Neither one has established their decision. It could very well be play. It sounds like it and Charlie only bit the air so he wasn’t too worried. Lol You can expect Finn to be excited. He is young and wants to rule the world. That’s just any young male. He may have been a little frustrated when he bit the blanket but that’s okay. I would be too. The only thing that has been consistent since he came in is your love and his room. Everything else has been off and on because of vetting and being sick. He’s been under a lot. I would like to see how things go if you have a very set routine. If it were me, just how I manage things here, I still suggest room to cage until Finn is totally comfortable. Let him see how everything works from a safe place that only belongs to him. Charlie should stay out of the cage for now. Stress needs to be minimal for Finn right now. I know how hard it is to put restrictions on a kitty but this is just how I would restart things. If everyone is healthy and Finn accepts being out for long periods of time in a fairly relaxed state, then proceed further. Make sure he has lots of toys and activities in the cage. Video of today would be helpful. It’s a little hard to read them without actually seeing them.
I am really hoping they both check out well.
As for vet check. Since Charlie as not been checked in awhile , take a fecal sample, or have them get that there. A wellness check should include checking eyes, ears, mouth, teeth, heart, breathing, temperature, paws, skin and fur. The skin should be sort of pulled up to check for hydration. Updated on vaccines and you need to tell them of any changes you may have noticed. Things like a change in eating. They should check for fleas and parasites. Weight as well. They should feel under his belly and just generally look him over. As kitties get older they may want other things like urine or blood. It’s pretty routine. If the vet is decent, they should be able to guide you on any visit. Make sure they know that FInn was sick and in contact with Charlie although that should not affect Charlie. Just good to keep records on every detail.
 
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  • #753

Buffster7

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I still suggest room to cage until Finn is totally comfortable.
Thanks so much for your advice, Jcatbird! I did catch a vid of the very last time they had any eye contact through the barrier, but it doesn't show Finn charging Charlie. It shows him crouched and watching Charlie like he would stalk him if he were out roaming free. You can see Charlie tentatively walk toward him with tail up, but then Finn rises suddenly and scares Charlie away. Finn looks quite proud of himself when he comes back to me. ;)

About the cage. When Finn is in the cage he cries continually. I think the cage actually stresses him out. I should take a video for you. If I have him in the cage and I'm sitting right next to it in the home office, he eventually will stop wailing after about 30 mins, but if I leave the room he starts yelling again. I would also like to leave him out in the cage, but I wasn't sure if the cage was creating stress for him. I contemplated leaving him in the cage in the living room when I went to lab this morning since it's only a half day, but then I made a vet appointment for today and that's just too much stress for one day. But a half day or even just my leaving the house for errands might be a great way to leave him out in the cage when I'm not there (it is secure and I would back the door side up to a wall) where he and Charlie could "reside" together in the same room safely. What do you think of the fact that he wails and cries and hates the cage, though? It's still less stressful than face-to-face, right?
 

walli

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Do you have a camera to show you what happens when your gone?
I would suspect he isn't wailing while your not there.
Just a guess tho.
 

Jcatbird

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Totally proud of himself! :flail:
You are the security blanket for Finn and wanting contact if you are present is understandable. What I am very curious about is what Finn would do if you went outside and left him in the cage. Pretending to be gone might give you a clue as to what he would do if you left while he is in the cage. Any way you can video that??
He looked like he had fun chasing Charlie.
 
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  • #756

Buffster7

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Do you have a camera to show you what happens when your gone?
I would suspect he isn't wailing while your not there.
Just a guess tho.
I don't have a camera, but I could prop my phone up and record while I "left" for about 5 or 10 minutes?

Pretending to be gone might give you a clue as to what he would do if you left while he is in the cage. Any way you can video that??
I could leave my phone propped up, not sure how long it would record, but it's worth a try. I think leaving him in the cage and leaving the house might be very scary for him at first, but he would eventually settle down, wouldn't he? Still less stressful than exploring the house with Charlie out roaming free..

He looked like he had fun chasing Charlie.
He did appear dang proud of himself, didn't he? I just took another vid and will be back to upload - surprised me!
 
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  • #757

Buffster7

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Took both boys for their vet appt today, and I just admit I kind of hoped they would bond over the trauma. :lol: I'm not entirely convinced that something didn't happen! Finn's urine is free from blood and he's still peeing! Finn got his boosters and micro-chipped, and we took bloodwork from Charlie for his well-kitty visit. Finn gained .5 and Charlie lost .5 lb!

On the way home, Charlie was in his Cat-In-the-Bag in the passenger seat, and Finn was in his hard carrier in the back seat facing forward. Charlie kept looking between the seats back at Finn. Once home, I freed Charlie first. He couldn't get away from me fast enough but came back to put his nose to the front gate of Finn's carrier.

Finn has become very antsy as he's been feeling better. He's not as cuddly and doesn't tolerate being held as much - he was velcro kitty before; now he just wants OUT. You'd have to have the volume up on the vid - but this is Finn calling to Charlie rather than Charlie calling to Finn. You'll see Charlie run past on his way to do a zoomie, but hang in there til the end of the video and Charlie will reappear. Tonight definitely felt more playful whereas last night felt somewhat aggressive. See what you think! Heck, maybe the vet visit DID do them some good. :dunno:

 

Jcatbird

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:flail:Charlie! Zooming and then as he passed Finn he got out of swatting range but he looked back to see what Finn would do. Finn really did seem to want to play. You know it has been my opinion from the start that they can be integrated. I’m not saying everything would always be purrfect but I still feel that it will happen. I am sure Finn is antsy and this may contribute to a level of excitement but as he adjusts AND gets older I think it could be great for both. Charlie certainly seems more kittenish than before. I think you have seen how Wanda Heart was rejected at first but now has the older females playing. She still gets swatted, disciplined and dirty looks but all is fine 99% of the time now. As she gets older, I expect she will do a little swatting as she tries to establish her more mature position. Down deep, they will care about each other. Just like with humans, trust and love can grow over time.
Going to the vet together gave them a bond and the same scent. :yess: A good thing.

So Charlie gave Finn .5 lb.? Charlie is more active and Finn is not having to struggle for survival outside. That seems like a good trade off.;)
So glad to hear that they got checked out and Finn has no blood in his urine.:banana1: Lots of progress being made!
I do love the videos of those two. They are such great kitties. They are smart, funny, full of personality and I just want to keep watching them! It kind of makes me think of two male versions of Banjo. She’s a handful, keeps me on my toes and I have never gone a day without smiling. I wouldn’t trade having rescued her for anything.
I still would like to see if you can find a way to observe Finn in the cage if he thinks you are gone. My phone goes into sleep mode pretty quickly but maybe you could be outside a window? I use baby monitors to spy on kitties here. Not so much now but a LOT in the beginning. Any way you can figure to listen in or even call someone and leave the phone line open so they can listen for you can give you clues.
 

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