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Global Warming - What Do You Think?

Discussion in 'IMO: In My Opinion' started by doomsdave, Nov 28, 2018.

  1. doomsdave

    doomsdave Thread Starter TCS Member Top Cat

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    The comments by @JamesCalifornia inviting thoughtful commentary in another thread inspired this one.

    This is too complicated so far for a poll, but, once thought trains emerge, maybe that will come later.

    I think there's no question that the planet's warming. Glaciers are melting. They're the canary in the coal mine, and if the average is too warm, they melt. The odd cold spike, ever over years, won't save them.

    I think this will lead to disasters for some, possible bonanzas for others. For example, much of the water supply of northern India depends on Himalayan glaciers that are melting now. In a very real sense, glaciers are like savings accounts for precipitation, dribbling out meltwater over the summer, to provide water where rainfall is scant or unreliable.

    If the "wine country" moves from the present wine country, to another, newly warmed enough WC 1 will lose and WC 2 will win.

    Northern Alberta, Canada, is able to grow corn, which produces twice the yield per acre, and, from what I've read, three times the money. They couldn't before; now, summer is a couple weeks longer, and they can.

    And on and on.

    As for who's "guilty" we all are. Whether you have a Lexus powered by gasoline, or use a dung fire in India, you're adding hydrocarbons to the atmosphere.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2018
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  2. kittypa

    kittypa TCS Member Top Cat

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    You’re right, there is no doubt that the earth’s climate is warming.

    The real question seems to be is it caused by our actions. It very well could be. I can’t prove to you that it is and you can’t prove to me that it isn’t.

    I would error on the side of caution here. Seems to me that the things we would do to “combat climate change” are healthy things to do anyways.
     
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  3. Willowy

    Willowy TCS Member Top Cat

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    I'm not a climate scientist. Fortunately, there are a lot of climate scientists out there telling us what we need to know.

    13 government agencies, under the Trump administration, released their report, and it's not good news. Of course, the administration released it right when everybody was busy with baking and shopping, hoping nobody would notice: Climate change will shrink US economy and kill thousands, government report warns

    (Here's a link to the actual report if you can decipher it yourself: Fourth National Climate Assessment: Executive Summary)

    Of course Trump hates it and is trying to ignore it. Again, it was released by the scientists in his own administration! Trump admin climate report wrong, says Trump admin

    So I don't expect any preparations will be made or any precautions will be taken. I'm glad I live here in the middle instead of near an ocean, although the storms here are getting worse too.
     

  4. Katie M

    Katie M TCS Member Top Cat

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    The planet has been warming since the Industrial Revolution. The chemist Svante Arrhenius first put forward the idea that humans were causing it in 1896, which conclusively disproves Trump's twisted notion that it's a recent Chinese hoax. As we saw with the hole in the ozone layer, we are quite capable of changing the environment drastically, even disastrously.
     

  5. DreamerRose

    DreamerRose TCS Member Top Cat

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    Of course, climate change is real, but I think it's part of a natural cycle but exacerbated by human activity. During the Renaissance, there was a mini ice age. It was so cold in London that they held winter fairs on the iced over Thames river. Remember Hans Brinker and the Silver Skates? It's not that cold in Holland anymore. The climate began to warm up in the 18th Century, and as @Katie M pointed out, the Industrial Revolution accelerated the warming.

    Whatever we can do to slow the process down is great, but we will never be able to stop it. We humans will adapt, of course. The Plains may turn into desert, but further north, acres of arable land will open up. The Dutch have kept the sea at bay for a long time, and we can, too.
     
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  6. Willowy

    Willowy TCS Member Top Cat

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    Of course. But as long as the politicians refuse to do anything to help us adapt, there will be needless deaths and problems that need not exist. Americans will be years behind when it comes to adapting to the new realities.
     
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  7. DreamerRose

    DreamerRose TCS Member Top Cat

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    Let's be clear about this. It's not politicians in general who refuse to adapt, but one in particular. He will in fact set us back.
     

  8. doomsdave

    doomsdave Thread Starter TCS Member Top Cat

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    Whether hydrocarbons caused global warming or not, sooner or later that canned sunshine from ages past will run out. When that happens, the "alternative" power sources will be all that's left.

    The good news is that the technology's there. We just have to adjust to it, and make room for it. And accept that oil, gas, coal, will go the way of the dodo and the dinosaurs.
     
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  9. Willowy

    Willowy TCS Member Top Cat

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    It's not only one. A TON of Republican politicians don't "believe in" climate change. I'd actually be incredibly surprised if one said he did. Granted, those guys may feel pressure to take action if the President supported science. But they have been fighting against efforts to prepare for climate change for years.

    This article is from 2014: Meet the Republicans in Congress who don't believe climate change is real

    This guy is trying to package it in a way conservatives will believe. He hasn't had a lot of success but I hope he can change some minds: A former GOP congressman believes climate change is real. Can he convince his party?
     

  10. mschauer

    mschauer TCS Member Top Cat

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    Well, he isn't totally ignoring it. He has offered an earnest and persuasive argument against it:
    :lol:
     
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  11. Katie M

    Katie M TCS Member Top Cat

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    Welp, that's good enough for me! *puts on MAGA hat*
     
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  12. DreamerRose

    DreamerRose TCS Member Top Cat

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    To carry the scenario forward, someday the sun will burn out, and if humans want to survive as a species, we will have to escape the planet and migrate to a younger planetary system.
     

  13. DreamerRose

    DreamerRose TCS Member Top Cat

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    That's what his gut is telling him.
     
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  14. doomsdave

    doomsdave Thread Starter TCS Member Top Cat

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    True, though that's a long way off. Billions of years. Most of us have trouble planning for 20 or 30.

    AND, the sun will likely swell to the size of earth's orbit before then, turning earth into a cinder, so we'll have long since left, one way or another.

    Meantime, I expect we'll have a nice planet, if we take care of it. And mind Mother Earth's tantrums.
     
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  15. Willowy

    Willowy TCS Member Top Cat

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    That would be billions of years from now. Humans may have evolved into something entirely different by then. But if current oil consumption continues, many estimates say that we'll run out before the turn of the century. That's a slightly more pressing concern!
     
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  16. DreamerRose

    DreamerRose TCS Member Top Cat

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    I realize the sun will turn into a red giant before it dies, which is why we need to keep plugging away with the space program as well as protecting our planet.
     
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  17. doomsdave

    doomsdave Thread Starter TCS Member Top Cat

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    Hard to say whether they really "don't believe" or they're just toadying to well-heeled (for now) drillers and pushers of fossil fuels. The buggy-whip dealers of tomorrow.
     

  18. denice

    denice Advisor Staff Member Advisor

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    There is one bit of hypocrisy that I see a lot, not everyone but I do see it. GM's reason for closing plants, at least Lordstown, is that cars aren't selling. Everyone wants an SUV or Truck. I have personally seen many people who say that things like climate change, fracking, the pipeline, and opening up ANWR to drilling is important to them. They want the fracking stopped, the pipeline stopped and ANWR left alone and they drive a large SUV or truck when they have no need for either.

    I believe that humans are contributing to global warming and I see no reason to get every last drop of oil out of the earth at any cost, I also drive a compact car.
     

  19. surya

    surya TCS Member Top Cat

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    I agree with the hypocrisy. And I feel like peoples values are so out of whack, with huge mansions and all the toys they don't have time to play with. I think their material worship is reflected in the president our country has chosen. I also am thinking more about wastefulness in my own life. Most of us can do better.
     
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  20. DreamerRose

    DreamerRose TCS Member Top Cat

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    I agree with you both. There are alternative fuels. I've even seen a prototype solar-powered car.

    I don't understand the fixation on SUVs. Many elderly people I know drive them. They don't have 6 kids, transport furniture, or carry heavy loads, and they have no need for those gas guzzlers.
     

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