Flame point cats

James&Misty2019

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Are all flame point cat’s purebred Siamese ???Or do you need papers to prove your cat is purebred Siamese
 

StefanZ

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Oh ok I actually was thinking of that
Domestic look alikes are more common than the purebreds. And "not even" lookalikes points are common.
So appropriate paperwork is necessary.

BUT we wanna see some good pics of your cat you are talking about. We do like pics! Whatever label there is.


Most look alikes are domestics, but now and then, we discover such a good look alike that is probably "the real thing", although without papers. Such moments are extra satysfying for me! :)

You know, Im bred on these sagas and stories of the orphan of unkown parentage, whom was the kings or princes son... It feels important for me this child gets a connection to its roots. Even if there are no sure proofs nor paperwork.
 

lutece

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Are you asking the question because you are thinking of getting a red point (flame point) kitten or cat?

Genetically speaking, red point (flame point) cats are basically red tabby cats (also known as "ginger" or orange) with two copies of the recessive colorpoint gene. The colorpoint gene originally came from the Siamese about 70 years ago, but at this time, the gene is widespread in the domestic cat gene pool. Most pointed cats don't have recent Siamese breed ancestry, although they are often labeled as "Siamese" or "Siamese mix" simply because of their color.

If you are asking about a specific cat, you could post pictures so that we can see if it looks like it might have recent Siamese breed ancestry.
 
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James&Misty2019

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Are you asking the question because you are thinking of getting a red point (flame point) kitten or cat?

Genetically speaking, red point (flame point) cats are basically red tabby cats (also known as "ginger" or orange) with two copies of the recessive colorpoint gene. The colorpoint gene originally came from the Siamese about 70 years ago, but at this time, the gene is widespread in the domestic cat gene pool. Most pointed cats don't have recent Siamese breed ancestry, although they are often labeled as "Siamese" or "Siamese mix" simply because of their color.

If you are asking about a specific cat, you could post pictures so that we can see if it looks like it might have recent Siamese breed ancestry.
Oh no I was just wondering because I’ve seen a few flame points at my shelter 😸😸
 

di and bob

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The cat in my avatar, Casper, was described as a flame point. He was pure white when born and kept his deep blue beautiful eyes. He was just part of a litter that had strong Siamese ties. He was also the most beautiful white color. with deep orange ears. ringed orange tail, and small amounts of deep orange on his feet and nose. He had other characteristics of a Siamese background too, long legged and lean, long slender face, VERY talkative, stubborn, very active, loved people, and had the deep, raspy meow. He was such a clown he became known as Bobo.
 

Kieka

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Great responses so far, just to add a little saying....

All Siamese are pointed, not all pointed are Siamese.

Breeds are a human concept and hobby. For a cat to be a recognized Siamese breed they have to have the pedigree and paperwork to support it. But any cat of any lineage can be pointed as long as they have the genetics to make it show.
 

lutece

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Breeds are a human concept and hobby. For a cat to be a recognized Siamese breed they have to have the pedigree and paperwork to support it.
It's not just paperwork, though. Most random bred pointed cats in the US have primarily Western European ancestry, plus the colorpoint gene. All Siamese cats have Southeast Asian ancestry (although not all Southeast Asian cats are Siamese :) ).
 

Meowmee

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Are all flame point cat’s purebred Siamese ???Or do you need papers to prove your cat is purebred Siamese
No, they are not considered pure bred without paperwork and proof of lineage etc. Do they have siamese in them? I think if characteristics are strong they do somewhere along the line. There are obvious ways it can happen. The color points which include flame point, tortie point and lynx point and some other variations were not considered part of the officially accepted siamese points which are seal point, chocolate point, blue point and lilac. Originally there were several breeds of cats in Siam not all were siamese pointed. It was described in the Tamra Maew. ( an ancient text about these cats.) They were smaller, thinner cats with points, solid colors, usually grey, black, white and caramel, and blue, green and amber eyes. I think there were some with darker body color and light points as well, in the paintings anyway. Photos of the more recent original siamese or thai cats show them as stocky, larger cats with only seal points and rounder faces. A set were gifted to British and American diplomats who then bred them. They have been interbred with black cats, I think both domestic and others. Siamese cats have been bred with numerous other breeds to get the color point traits.
 
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