Feeding questions, 2 week old kittens

[JaySnow]

Hello everyone! I've come here for a bit of advice regarding the litter I've been hand-rearing. Forgive me for the long post, I'll try to sum things up quickly. I found 3 kittens 2 weeks ago crying in the middle of the street in front of my house. It was a hot day and they were on the asphalt so I immediately took them in so they wouldn't overheat. I suspect they were separated from their mother and abandoned, since they were in such an unusual spot. Only one of them had the umbilical chord attached, so I estimate they were about 2 days old at most. Mother cat didn't come back.

I've been keeping them in a box in a dimly lit room of our house, they have a warm water bottle that I re-heat every feeding to make sure they're warm, but they usually don't curl up to it much and prefer to just cuddle each other (I suspect it's hot enough already! Usual temperature here is 85-95degrees). I've been feeding them homemade formula, I know cow's milk isn't ideal for them because of diarrhea but it's pretty much the only thing available in my country (Venezuela). Since it's powdered strengthened milk I add about a tablespoon of it to a cup of water so it's not too thick/heavy for them, and to that I add 1 or 2 egg yolks depending on the size of the egg, and a drop or two of honey to help with their blood sugar. It's as much as I can do with what I have, and they haven't gotten any kind of stomach upset.

I've been weighing them daily and they gain about 3/4 grams per day, which is very slow but they haven't stalled or lost weight, and I consulted a vet about it and told me that as long as they're gaining weight, as slow as it might be, that I shouldn't worry about it. She also told me the formula I was feeding them was fine. They pee every time I stimulate them and poop every 2 or 3 days, which I've been told is normal for kittens on formula. They just recently opened their eyes which is very exciting!

Here is the issue: recently I've been having problems to determine how much to feed them. They've been getting 4ml/4cc of formula every 3 hours and a half/every 4 hours overnight. Right after feeding they fall asleep, so I assume they're satiated. But when I wake them up for the next feeding they're a bit desperate to eat. The biggest one pretty much tries to fit the whole syringe in its mouth! They got a very good suckle reflex, but it feels like they're not getting as much milk as they want to? I don't want to risk overfeeding because I know that's dangerous for them, but when they're finished eating their tummy doesn't bulge out much, so I don't want to risk underfeeding, either. They fall asleep right after though, so I don't think they're as hungry as they act to be.

I know 4ml per feeding for a regular 2 week old kitten is very little. I would increase their formula intake, but they're very underweight. They all weigh around 95 grams, so I'm not sure if their stomach capacity has increased much since I've had them. I read somewhere a good rule is 4ml or 4cc for every 100 grams, so that's what I've been doing.

They're not lethargic, are well hydrated and are very active (they keep trying to climb me). Should I increase the amount of formula fed to them? Or make it more concentrated (less water, more egg yolk) so it fills them up more (and maybe helps them gain weight better)? I'm probably driving my vet crazy with the amount of questions I ask her, but I'm probably still gonna consult her about it. I appreciate any help I can get!

 

[catapault]

You are doing the best you can, which is all any of us can do. Other people with more experience will be along - StefanZ Jcatbird - and offer good advice. Meanwhile - can you get goat's milk? That's often suggested for very young kittens if KMR is not available. Also, maybe if you can get unflavored Pedialyte, use that instead of water to mix their formula.

And pictures of your 3 little kittens would be welcome, so we can ooh and aah over how adorable they are.

 

[Sarthur2]

Does your vet have any formula at all? Your kittens need more nutrition in general, as well as a higher amount of food. Can you get goat’s milk? Or evaporated milk? They need more milk product, along with the egg and honey. They also need a sprinkle of salt in the formula. Add more milk instead of water. If you can get goats milk, feed that all by itself.

Since they are still the size of newborns, they need feeding at least every 2 hours around the clock. You can also feed them as much as they want. They will turn away when they are full. By feeding more often they will get more food overall. They seem desperately hungry because they are going too long between feedings. It is almost impossible to overfeed kittens, and they should poop more often if they are getting more food.

Once they get bigger they will eat more at each feeding, and then you can go longer between feedings. At two weeks old they should ideally weigh a minimum of 8 ounces (226 grams), so they have a way to go yet.

Thank you for saving them and keep up your fantastic efforts on their behalf. Raising newborn kittens by hand is a lot of work!

 

[Jcatbird]

Well, I was just posting when I saw that you just got the best possible help! Please follow the advice given by Sarhur2
You are doing a wonderful job with these babies! Thank you for saving those little ones! Please keep us updated.

 

[JaySnow]

You are doing the best you can, which is all any of us can do. Other people with more experience will be along - StefanZ Jcatbird - and offer good advice. Meanwhile - can you get goat's milk? That's often suggested for very young kittens if KMR is not available. Also, maybe if you can get unflavored Pedialyte, use that instead of water to mix their formula.

And pictures of your 3 little kittens would be welcome, so we can ooh and aah over how adorable they are.

Thank you so much! I will try and convince my parents to get some goat's milk.

 

[JaySnow]

Does your vet have any formula at all? Your kittens need more nutrition in general, as well as a higher amount of food. Can you get goat’s milk? Or evaporated milk? They need more milk product, along with the egg and honey. They also need a sprinkle of salt in the formula. Add more milk instead of water. If you can get goats milk, feed that all by itself.

Since they are still the size of newborns, they need feeding at least every 2 hours around the clock. You can also feed them as much as they want. They will turn away when they are full. By feeding more often they will get more food overall. They seem desperately hungry because they are going too long between feedings. It is almost impossible to overfeed kittens, and they should poop more often if they are getting more food.

Once they get bigger they will eat more at each feeding, and then you can go longer between feedings. At two weeks old they should ideally weigh a minimum of 8 ounces (226 grams), so they have a way to go yet.

Thank you for saving them and keep up your fantastic efforts on their behalf. Raising newborn kittens by hand is a lot of work!

Thank you very much for the suggestions! My vet doesn't have any formula unfortunately. It's an extremely rare product around here, and from what advice I've gotten from her it seems like most rely on homemade formulas... Importing it from abroad would also take a really long time. I will ask her about the goat's milk for sure, but it's something I've seen mentioned on a lot of forums so it's probably worth a try. Goat's milk and evaporated milk are very pricy around here, but I will look into it.

Yesterday I made the formula a bit more concentrated to see how they'd react, and today they all pooped, and they pooped a LOT. It wasn't runny or anything but I was worried about dehydration, so I fed them more at the next feeding. They seem to be taking the increments well!

The only thing that worries me, and correct me if I'm wrong, wouldn't a change in the kind of milk used upset their tummies? Would a gradual transition into goat's milk or evaporated milk help them? And how should I go about it?

Also, this is the first time I hear about adding a pinch of salt to the formula. What's its purpose? Does it help with electrolytes?

 

[JaySnow]

Thank you so much, everyone! Definitely keeping your suggestions in mind.

Here's an update: Kittens just ate about an hour and a half ago. Noticed they were a tiny bit dehydrated, which I assume was because of the heat (today has been VERY hot, when doing the tent test the skin sprung back but not as quickly as I'd like). Diluted the formula a tiny bit with water, they all drank around 4.5 ml each before rejecting the syringe, so they looked pretty full. They were still very active and responsive.

Would like to note that at their previous feeding the biggest one of the litter wasn't as active as he usually is. He could suckle with no problem still, but didn't seem his usual self. A bit of sugar water on his gums and immediately saw an improvement, he's been acting normal since. Keeping an eye on him still. Added a tiny bit more of honey on their formula to make sure their blood sugar stays okay. Will feed them again in an hour and make feedings more frequent according to what Sarthur2 suggested.

I will look into changing their diet into a more appropiate one, but I feel guilty about not currently being able to feed them exactly what they need. Things are very rough for everyone here, so I'm doing the best I can. My parents are already protesting that I'm wasting too much milk/eggs/tissue paper haha

If anything else arises is it okay to keep posting on this same thread? Just making sure! I've been really anxious about this whole ordeal but being able to talk to other people about it really helps me feel more calm about it all

 

[Sarthur2]

Yes, salt helps with electrolytes - just a few grains. More honey was an appropriate addition as well. Maybe double the milk and still add the water as you had been doing.

If you are able to get goat milk or evaporated milk, you can of course transition slowly. If your little guy is a bit more lethargic, it may indicate the need for the more frequent feedings as discussed - they are growing, and if they had a mom they would nurse frequently.

I understand your situation in Venezuela. Here in the U.S. it is easy to find all of these items. I think you are doing a wonderful job with these babies!

Will you be able to buy canned wet cat food when they begin to transition to solids eventually? Or dry cat food that you can moisten with water?

Yes, please continue all your questions and comments on this same thread. Barring differences in time zones we will try to answer as quickly as we can!

 

[JaySnow]

Yes, salt helps with electrolytes - just a few grains. More honey was an appropriate addition as well. Maybe double the milk and still add the water as you had been doing.

If you are able to get goat milk or evaporated milk, you can of course transition slowly. If your little guy is a bit more lethargic, it may indicate the need for the more frequent feedings as discussed - they are growing, and if they had a mom they would nurse frequently.

I understand your situation in Venezuela. Here in the U.S. it is easy to find all of these items. I think you are doing a wonderful job with these babies!

Will you be able to buy canned wet cat food when they begin to transition to solids eventually? Or dry cat food that you can moisten with water?

Yes, please continue all your questions and comments on this same thread. Barring differences in time zones we will try to answer as quickly as we can!

Thank you! Yes, I'll be able to buy dry cat food when they start their weaning process. I remember about two years ago one of my older cats had a litter but refused to nurse them. Ended up feeding them until they finished weaning, where they ate solid foods (they really liked scrambled eggs...) but now I'm in a better position and I'll be able to buy them proper dry cat food, which I'll wet with water or a bit of the formula.

Thank you so so much for the advice, it means a lot.

 

[Sarthur2]

Scrambled eggs are good for cats! So is boiled chicken and rice. These will supplement a dry food diet nicely when the time comes.

 

[Jcatbird]

I just have to tell you that you have my greatest admiration. I live in a place that has been less well supplied with many items too so I really appreciate all you are doing for these babies. You have a great talent for giving care to them.

 

[JaySnow]

I just have to tell you that you have my greatest admiration. I live in a place that has been less well supplied with many items too so I really appreciate all you are doing for these babies. You have a great talent for giving care to them.

Thank you so much! I'm just glad I was able to help them when they needed it. I know otherwise they probably wouldn't have made it. I'm making them as comfortable as I can so they thrive.

 

[StefanZ]

Thank you so much! I will try and convince my parents to get some goat's milk.

Goats milk is excellent. If you dont have goats milk nor any good kmr, human baby mother milk subsititute may work. But dilute it less than for a baby. Once, a desperate forumist tried with nutrient solution for baby birds... The kittens did survive.

 

[JaySnow]

Goats milk is excellent. If you dont have goats milk nor any good kmr, human baby mother milk subsititute may work. But dilute it less than for a baby. Once, a desperate forumist tried with nutrient solution for baby birds... The kittens did survive.

Thank you so much! I will see if we have some baby formula available.

Here's a small update: Made some adjustments to the formula so they would get a bit more protein and sugar from it (tiny bit more milk, bit more honey) and they haven't had any stomach upset so I will probably keep doing it. They've been drinking 4.5 ml every 2 hours and a half/3 hours, since I note that their tummies are pretty full (round, not hard) after feeding. That's pretty much the amount they're willing to take before pushing the syringe away. And at the next feeding they still have some pudge in them I think feeding them more frequently would result in bloating, so I'm proceding with caution. They all gained about 2-3 grams since yesterday, which is pretty much the rate they were at before, but I'm hoping the increase in feeding frequency and more concentrated formula helps them speed that up a bit.

Something they do a lot is try to suckle each other, even with their tummies full. I think it's more of a comfort thing, since they don't have a mother cat they can nurse from whenever they please. Feeding them more frequently seems to have helped with that as well. Their skin doesn't get irritated from it, nor are their genitals inflamed or irritated. Sometimes I just find them a little bit wet! I dry them thoroughly and separate them so they don't try to do it again. I hope that's alright. Will update again if anything else arises!

 

[JaySnow]

Hello everyone, I'd like some assurance on something. I don't think it's urgent but I'd rather ask to keep my mind at peace.

They got fed at around 6:30pm, ate about 5ml each, which is a bit more than what they usually eat, but they went until they pushed the syringe away. One of them went to sleep right after, but the other 2 were very restless and kept trying to suckle each other. I didn't think they were hungry as their tummies were full, so I thought they just wanted attention. Spent about 30 minutes trying to get them to quiet down by rubbing them gently, but they were REALLY determined to keep sucking on each other's genitals. Ended up feeding them around 2ml more of formula and that seemed to calm them down. They're now sleeping. Is this okay? Should I be worried about overfeeding, or is it okay to actually feed them that much if they want it? They didn't seem bloated at all.
I was feeding one of them when suddenly a drop of sweat from my forehead fell on his head it gets really hot around here and I was so concentrated on feeding them I didn't notice I was sweating buckets. I dried the kitty up and he didn't seem to mind. Since it was that hot (85-95 degrees) I didn't warm up the water bottle again, which had gone a bit cold. They sleep apart from each other, so I don't think they're cold, otherwise I assume they would form a kitty pile. Correct me if I'm wrong!

This all may seem like nothing but I really won't be able to rest easy without knowing if any of this is a reason to worry.

 

[IndyJones]

Do you have an old teddy bear that they could snuggle? That might help them feel more comfortable.

Kittens also love the sound of a mechanical clock if you can find one. A loud quartz clock may also work. The ticking sounds like a heartbeat.

One like this is ideal but a loud quartz clock can also work as long as you can hear it ticking.
Equity by La Crosse 4 in. Round Analog Wind-Up Bell Metal Alarm Clock-12020 - The Home Depot

 

[Sarthur2]

You can feed as much as they want. You did not overfeed, however, suckling on genitals is a big no-no. It can cause damage, so that needs to stop. Maybe give them a soft rag with the corners soaked in formula to suckle on. The suckling reflex is normal and usually kittens use mom’s nipples as a pacifier.

 

[JaySnow]

You can feed as much as they want. You did not overfeed, however, suckling on genitals is a big no-no. It can cause damage, so that needs to stop. Maybe give them a soft rag with the corners soaked in formula to suckle on. The suckling reflex is normal and usually kittens use mom’s nipples as a pacifier.

That's what I thought. Most of the time they just suckle the towel I've put in the bottom of the box to keep them comfortable, and they don't do it when they're satiated. It's just when I wake them up to feed that they try to suckle on anything they can get a hold of. Since the syringe I'm using is a 3cc one I have to do a couple of rounds so they're full, so in that time while the other two wait that's where the problem starts. I actually have my brother look at them while I feed them one by one so they don't suckle on each other, and he immediately separates them if they do try it. None of their genitals look irritated or swollen up, and they pee without any problem. I'd like to keep it that way. IndyJone's suggestion might be worth looking into, I have a couple of soft old plushies I could give a wash and give to them, see how they react.

I don't think I'm comfortable putting a rag soaked in formula in there, mostly because the climate here is very humid and hot, and that's just asking for bacteria to thrive. I keep the box as dry as possible and change the bedding every couple of days if it isn't soiled.

 

[JaySnow]

I want to thank everyone for the suggestions and advice regarding the kittens' feeding. They've started to gain more weight now that I let them eat as much as they want (about 6 grams per day, compared to 2-3 before). Still slow, but they're progressing really well.

Two of them on the last feedings have had runny, yellow stools. Nothing too severe, just that when I wiped them with tissue paper to stimulate them the tissue came back a bit dirty with it. Since I assume they're still adapting to the more concentrated formula I diluted it a tiny bit every other feeding just to be safe, but they're extremely well hydrated (pee is completely clear, barely yellow).

Today when I went to feed them I noticed the towel I put on the bottom of the box was a bit soiled with pee. I stimulate them thoroughly before and after each feeding, but I didn't find it too odd since they're nearing 3 weeks and as I've read that's around the time where they start to pee on their own. One of them actually peed on his own while he was waiting to be fed! Put away the towel to be cleaned and dried and I'll put it back in the box. But it does make me wonder if their bladders are getting way too full. Is over hydration a possibility? I read somewhere that kittens don't concentrate their urine very well until they're older and that a clear color is normal for them, but do correct me if that's wrong.

I'll keep updating if anything else happens. I really can't thank you enough for all the advice.

 

[JaySnow]

Small update and a couple of questions!

The kittens are doing really well. They've been gaining 7-10 grams every day and drink 9-10ml every 3 hours. They're very very active now and the biggest one is already trying to jump out of the box They're starting to eliminate on their own too, so that's a relief. I keep a couple of newspaper sheets in the box and they've learned to poo/pee there, I replace it every couple of hours. Cat litter is very uncommon here but so far they haven't had any problems.

Today they're 23 days old, meaning nearing 3 weeks and a half. I've been reading around online to learn when to start the weaning process and how, but I haven't found any solid info. Most say 3 weeks and a half to 4 weeks to start, but others say starting from 5 weeks. Read that orphan kittens tend to initiate the weaning process earlier than those that stay with mama cat.

They LOVE to bite the syringe when feeding, so I assume their teeth are coming in and that's one way to alleviate the discomfort from teething. When would be a good time to start transitioning into proper kitty food? Should I wait until 4 weeks or start now? Should I try boiled chicken and rice mashed up mixed with the formula, should I moisten dry kibble, scrambled eggs? I'm just trying to prepare for when they start eating solids I'll ask my vet about it too, but would love some advice just in case.