Does Tiki Cat Have Menadione?

[daftcat75]

Maybe I should write a Tiki Cat saved my cat's life review.

 

[Kristi01]

There are other recipes of weruva that don't have menadione like the chicken recipes without fish.

 

[Kristi01]

Maybe I should write a Tiki Cat saved my cat's life review.

Please do

 

[daftcat75]

Please do

While I feel like she is turning the corner, I'd like to finish the B12 treatment, get a clean fPL, and put a pound back on her before I write that success story. But we wouldn't even be this far without Tiki.

 

[Kristi01]

While I feel like she is turning the corner, I'd like to finish the B12 treatment, get a clean fPL, and put a pound back on her before I write that success story. But we wouldn't even be this far without Tiki.

I use tiki cat sometimes. I have it in my home but I am afraid of using it because of menadione.

 

[Kristi01]

While I feel like she is turning the corner, I'd like to finish the B12 treatment, get a clean fPL, and put a pound back on her before I write that success story. But we wouldn't even be this far without Tiki.

What it's her diagnosis?

 

[Kristi01]

I also try not to feed much menadione, I just don't feel certain about it. I'll occasionally feed a can of something that has it. (Edit: I think some of Weruva's Cats in the Kitchen cans used to have it but apparently they now don't, if only the ones I feed.) And that's pretty much that. Like @duckpond, I just don't feel right consistently feeding something I'm unsure about. (duckpond and I have pretty similar lists of ingredients we don't like!)

I almost forgot to add that it's really too bad about Tiki: not only did they add menadione, they changed their recipes (and even their shredding!) quite a bit. Our cats used to love it but now won't even finish it. Not that it really matters now, after the addition of menadione, but the other night the cats were angry about a leftover can of chicken/turkey that came out before the big changes.

 

[Kristi01]

Other people have had different experiences. From an Amazon review:

Weruva just about killed our cat

By catfan141 - April 7, 2013
This is an alert for anyone currently feeding a diet of Weruva to their cats. The short story: Weruva products gave our totally healthy, 8 year old cat kidney failure. He is now in hospital with CREA (toxicity levels) 5 times the healthy amount (his levels are 11.1 - most cats dies before their levels get this high) and basically what would have been a long healthy life has just been cut short.

The long story:
My husband and I fed Weruva to our 8 yr old, healthy kitty for about 8 months. He had just had a very good vet check up - the vet said he was an example of a 'success story' in diet (we fed a mix of raw and canned food, raw egg yolk supplement, natural vitamin supplements). The canned component of the diet was EVO. But 8 months ago we switched to Weruva from EVO because of concern over the levels of ash in EVO. For the first 6 months we fed half Weruva (a mix of all varieties) and half Stella and Chewy's raw patties (which we've done for a long time). He seemed to be doing well, although seemed a little bit malnourished, like he wasn't getting all the nutrients he needed (we kept finding him licking the cast iron pan on the stove, for e.g. - we now know he was becoming anemic, and was probably licking the pan for iron). We realize now that this was because the food was having an adverse effect on his kidneys, so he wasn't absorbing all the nutrients he should be. We took him to the vet, and got him tested. All was okay, except his kidney values were a little high - his CREA and BUN especially. We brought him in for a urine sample a month later. His urine tested well, highly concentrated. Here's what went wrong - we ran out of the Stella & Chewy patties, & they're not easy to get in our neighborhood so we stopped feeding them to him for a while. We were stressed out in our jobs and (we are kicking ourselves) didn't make time to pick up the patties. So he began an ONLY Weruva diet. At the same time, we were so busy we needed to order from wag.com, so we ordered Weruva in bulk. The only kinds they had in bulk? The seafood kinds. Mack n Jack, Polynesian BBQ, and Asian Fusion. All of these contain the artificial "vitamin K" supplement menadione sodium bisulfate, and have very high phosphorus levels. It is also NOT good to feed your cat only seafood. But we only did this for THREE weeks.

What happened next? Within 2 - 3 weeks of being on the only Weruva diet major kidney failure symptoms started. He stopped eating all the food on his plate, but he was begging for food. In the last week he was thirsty all the time. His haunches became stooped. In the 3rd week we finally realized something was wrong (we are kicking ourselves, again, that it took us so long to realize this). We took him to the vet as soon as possible, and that's when we found out he had 80% - 90% kidney failure. The vet told us we should put him down, or opt for expensive emergency therapy - we opted for the therapy, and thankfully his levels are dropping, but he may not live much more than a few months longer.

Meanwhile, we thought we should warn our good friends who were also feeding their cat the Weruva-only diet. As soon as we realized what had happened we got in contact with these friends who we hadn't seen in a long time (they'd just had a baby). Sadly, they reported that their also young (younger than our cat) kitty had liver disease - he had just been diagnosed. They too had stopped feeding their cat Weruva.

How could this happen to very healthy, active, young cats who were apparently eating the healthiest diet possible? We're not sure, but we're sure it's related to this food. NOTHING else changed in our cat's life, and just before he went on the all Weruva diet he had had a clean bill of health. We think the answer might be related to Menadione Sodium Bisulfate, which quickly damaged our kitty's organs, in tandem with the very high phosphorus levels.

Menadione Sodium Bisulfate is the only Vitamin K supplement that AAFCO approves, but it's safety for pets is "not known," (although many people are of the opinion that is is highly toxic for pets), it is known to be toxic (and fatal) to humans. Several experts consider that it is dangerous for many of the major organs, including kidneys, liver. Here are some linke for more info:

[...]

[...]

[...]

some of the negative effects of menadione are...
* causes cytotoxicity in liver cells
* damages the natural vitamin K cycle
* causes hemolytic anemia and hyperbilirubinemia, not just linked to large doses
* is directly toxic in high doses (vomiting, albuminuria), unlike natural vitamin K
* has never been researched or specifically approved for long term use, such as in pet food
* FDA has banned synthetic vitamin K from over-the-counter supplements because of its high toxicity
Some of the weruva recipes don't have menadione
[...]
A report at Oregon State University that mentions mendione toxicity
[...]

Here Weruva owner David Forman explains why Weruva chooses to use Menadione:
[...]

Note that at the end of his comment, he states: "if we didn't put it in we would have to label the cans 'for intermittent feeding only'," because AAFCO requires the supplement to be in seafood cans if it's labeled a 'complete food.'
It seems to us that that's the real reason Weruva choose to keep menadione in their products. If we had seen an 'intermittent feeding only label, we would have fed our cat Weruva less often (and he would not be in hospital right now - though perhaps in time the same problem would have developed.) That is what Weruva wants to avoid - people using their cat food less often. The ethical choice would have been to leave out the menadione and label their food correctly, while taking up with AAFCO its lack of safe Vitamin K supplement approvals.

One more note - we've spent over $500 on Weruva food in the past 8 months. And our hospital bill for this weekend, for our cat that may not survive? $2500 and counting. It's going to take months for us to recover from this financially, let alone the pain of losing our beloved pet to the greed of a wolf in sheep's clothing. Meanwhile Weruva hasn't lost any funds and continues to add a harmful ingredient to its cat food.

We're pretty sure there's going to be an epidemic of Weruva-food related illnesses. As the product is on the market for a longer time, more and more cats are going to develop organ damage as a result of the diet.

Why do pet food manufacturers (including these so-called 'organic' food manufacturers) and AAFCO have to play the waiting game with consumers, waiting until enough pets die until they are forced to change their ingredients and regulations?

162 of 175 people found this review helpful

 

[Kristi01]

Some of the Weruva recipies don't have menadione

 

[daftcat75]

What it's her diagnosis?

Her fPL was high enough. I didn't test her fTLI because I just got her eating again and didn't want to take her off her supplements and fast her long enough for a clean fTLI test. The vet agreed with me that she should start B12 treatment and be retested in a month. She had her second shot this morning. She's not diabetic and the symptoms of EPI and IBD overlap as do the treatments. In most respects, she shows a marked improvement. I just wish she would put on some weight already but I know she needs her B12 built back up before that will happen.

 

[Kristi01]

Her fPL was high enough. I didn't test her fTLI because I just got her eating again and didn't want to take her off her supplements and fast her long enough for a clean fTLI test. The vet agreed with me that she should start B12 treatment and be retested in a month. She had her second shot this morning. She's not diabetic and the symptoms of EPI and IBD overlap as do the treatments. In most respects, she shows a marked improvement. I just wish she would put on some weight already but I know she needs her B12 built back up before that will happen.

Her fPL was high enough. I didn't test her fTLI because I just got her eating again and didn't want to take her off her supplements and fast her long enough for a clean fTLI test. The vet agreed with me that she should start B12 treatment and be retested in a month. She had her second shot this morning. She's not diabetic and the symptoms of EPI and IBD overlap as do the treatments. In most respects, she shows a marked improvement. I just wish she would put on some weight already but I know she needs her B12 built back up before that will happen.

What is EPI? And IBD?

 

[daftcat75]

What is EPI? And IBD?

EPI = Endocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency

Not enough digestive enzymes, basically, so diarrhea, poor nutrient absorption, lethargy, anorexia, and weight loss. The way to confirm this one is the fTLI test which is a fasting test that also requires me to suspend the digestive enzyme supplements long enough to not taint the result. Krista goes scrunch-faced pained cat loaf after eating without the enzyme supplements so maybe we can try this fast and test after a course of B12.

IBD = Inflammatory Bowel Disease

Autoimmune inflammatory response to food or food ingredients/allergens. When the immune system recognizes these food particles as foreign invaders, and creates inflammation and immune response, it changes the gut microbiome and the composition of the intestinal lining compromising nutrient absorption. Symptoms are vomiting, diarrhea, anorexia, poor nutrient absorption, and weight loss.

In both cases, the treatment is control the vomiting and diarrhea, remove problematic foods, rebuild the gut microbiome with probiotics, supplement digestive enzymes, replace nutrient deficiencies especially B12, and give the gut the time to heal. Removing problematic foods and food stuffs is absolutely essential or this is all just a waste of time and unnecessary medications. Hence why I'm a vigorous defender of Tiki Cat.

 

[Kristi01]

I'm glad to hear she's on enzymes and probiotics. The dry food my cats are on is wysong epigen 90, it has probiotics and enzymes and only5 carbs.@and wet, weruva recipies without menadione.

 

[Kristi01]

I chose Tiki Cat as one of the foods in my girls’ rotation. I just read an Amazon review which said it now has Menadione in it. I searched the ingredients and I guess she’s referring to the “vitamin K supplement.” It’s the very last ingredient listed so how much could it be?

Am I being rash if I stop feeding it?

 

[Kristi01]

EPI = Endocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency

Not enough digestive enzymes, basically, so diarrhea, poor nutrient absorption, lethargy, anorexia, and weight loss. The way to confirm this one is the fTLI test which is a fasting test that also requires me to suspend the digestive enzyme supplements long enough to not taint the result. Krista goes scrunch-faced pained cat loaf after eating without the enzyme supplements so maybe we can try this fast and test after a course of B12.

IBD = Inflammatory Bowel Disease

Autoimmune inflammatory response to food or food ingredients/allergens. When the immune system recognizes these food particles as foreign invaders, and creates inflammation and immune response, it changes the gut microbiome and the composition of the intestinal lining compromising nutrient absorption. Symptoms are vomiting, diarrhea, anorexia, poor nutrient absorption, and weight loss.

In both cases, the treatment is control the vomiting and diarrhea, remove problematic foods, rebuild the gut microbiome with probiotics, supplement digestive enzymes, replace nutrient deficiencies especially B12, and give the gut the time to heal. Removing problematic foods and food stuffs is absolutely essential or this is all just a waste of time and unnecessary medications. Hence why I'm a vigorous defender of Tiki Cat.

i just received this letter from tiki cat...Thank you for reaching out to us! As fellow pet parents we can definitely understand your concern. Our formulas meet the nutritional standards established by National Research Council and AAFCO to ensure a diet has all known required nutrients in the proper amounts and proportions based on a cat’s life stage. Supplementation of Vitamin K is necessary when you don’t have natural sources to meet the vitamin K requirement. Primarily fish-based diets may require supplementation of Menadione (Source of Vitamin K). Menadione is approved by the FDA, G.R.A.S (generally regarded as Safe) and an AAFCO approved ingredient. Vitamin K is absolutely necessary in cat foods. With that said, we listened to consumer feedback and tested all of our Tiki formulas to see if removing the vitamin K supplement was possible. We have confirmed a select range of Tiki formulas meet the required level of vitamin K without supplementation so you will see it being removed from the formula and ingredient panel of these diets in the coming months. This included the majority of our chicken based diets. Please let us know if you have any other questions!

 

[Georgia on my Mind]

This is great news! Thanks for posting Kristi!

 

[Kristi01]

This is great news! Thanks for posting Kristi!

Your welcome. I'm happy that i will be able to buy tiki cat again

 

[Sebby]

Question: has anyone actually gotten their hands on the new version? If yes, where did you buy it?