Diagnosed with kidney failure.

[Furballsmom]

Hi! Can you talk to a different vet?

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

I am familiar with injection site carcinoma, but never with sub-q fluids. I suppose it could happen, but I've just never heard of it happening, and certainly not in so short of a time span. It may be that you happen to be placing the needle in exactly the same spot each time . The scruff is a pretty large area, so try to move it a little to one side or the other, even if it's just 1 /2 inch or so. Use that lump as a guide and go to either side of it. It's always good to change up where you insert the needle just because it can definitely gt tender of doing it in the same place over and over, and over time could toughen up the skin too, I would imagine. You are using a fresh needle each time, right? What size needle are you using?

Overall, how does she appear to be feeling? Better? Is there only one Vet at the place where you go? No one covering for your Vet that you could ask about that lump? You probably don't need to take your cat in, just ask about what might be causing it. What is your cat's name, BTW? I just realized I don't know it.

 

[kitteh_]

Hi! Can you talk to a different vet?

Hi I called in a few places but they don't answer me properly unless I get an appointment and chip money unfortunately... Her vet said she will be available on Friday so I am not sure if I should wait or not at the moment

 

[kitteh_]

I am familiar with injection site carcinoma, but never with sub-q fluids. I suppose it could happen, but I've just never heard of it happening, and certainly not in so short of a time span. It may be that you happen to be placing the needle in exactly the same spot each time . The scruff is a pretty large area, so try to move it a little to one side or the other, even if it's just 1 /2 inch or so. Use that lump as a guide and go to either side of it. It's always good to change up where you insert the needle just because it can definitely gt tender of doing it in the same place over and over, and over time could toughen up the skin too, I would imagine. You are using a fresh needle each time, right? What size needle are you using?

Overall, how does she appear to be feeling? Better? Is there only one Vet at the place where you go? No one covering for your Vet that you could ask about that lump? You probably don't need to take your cat in, just ask about what might be causing it. What is your cat's name, BTW? I just realized I don't know it.

I tried moving sides each time to make sure I don't end up in the same place and only had to use the same needle once because I dropped the new one without the lid and I didn't have a spare one, could it be because of that???? OMG If so I won't forgive myself ever... and I don't know about the size the pharmacy gave me a serum set and I bought some additional syringes for the needles but they're not big when you look at them, she normally didn't feel a thing except for tonight she started screaming, I don't know what happened but I gave her time and tried afterwards she was OK.

About her appearance, she appears fluffier.. her coat looks good, I mean she looks healthy and her appetite is ok even tho it's renal food only. Our vet said she will be available this Friday and me as a paranoiac panicked person don't know if I should wait or not because I contacted other vets and they won't answer properly unless I take Bobo (that's my cats name btw) and pay them...

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

OK, I did real that sometimes in research labs they do reuse needles and it seems the real issue is the needles can become dull from reuse. BUT, you really don't want to do this is you can possibly avoid it just because of contamination. If you plan on giving fluids for any length of time, I would suggest ordering a box of needles via the internet. On Tanya's website I believe they recommend Terumo 20 gauge i inch needles and the are very inexpensive for a box of 100. To avoid dropping an uncapped needle, we always put a new needle, still capped, on the end of the serum set as soon as we were finished giving fluids. Capped the old needle, took it off the line, put it in the disposal container, then put the new one on to be ready for the next time. And we kept the serum line attached to the bag until time to get a new bag. Then we just put the entire set up in a bag inside a drawer so no cats messed with it.

You might have nicked a nerve last night when you gave her her fluids. Once in a great while something like that happens and you just need to pull the needle out and change the angle. It's rare but does happen. I'm so glad she is looking good and eating at least "ok". So all in all you think she is improving? How's her UTI? Have you finished the round of antibiotics yet? Howlong are you supposed to keep giving her fluids on a daily basis?

 

[Jem]

I wonder if the lump could be an abscess. The lump, plus the wound on top and the pain (if you inserted the needle too close to the infection site)...makes sense to me.
Perhaps try to clean the area really well, and place a warm compress on it (if the wound seems open) to see it if will drain (if it is an abscess). It could have happened from using a dirty needle, or just by chance that she had some sort of bacteria that got in. I know that a couple of times, I wasn't very accurate when inserting the needle and scraped/cut the skin a bit before it went in.
Like mrsgreenjeens said, if this is something you will have to continue, get a box of needles. A box of 100 needles was only about 10 dollars for me at my vet. You can also buy the bags separately from the lines. Bags of lactated ringers were also about 10 dollars a bag, and I would reuse the same line several times, the vet said this was perfectly fine as long as I was careful not to contaminate the ends when changing it.

 

[kitteh_]

I wonder if the lump could be an abscess. The lump, plus the wound on top and the pain (if you inserted the needle too close to the infection site)...makes sense to me.
Perhaps try to clean the area really well, and place a warm compress on it (if the wound seems open) to see it if will drain (if it is an abscess). It could have happened from using a dirty needle, or just by chance that she had some sort of bacteria that got in. I know that a couple of times, I wasn't very accurate when inserting the needle and scraped/cut the skin a bit before it went in.
Like mrsgreenjeens said, if this is something you will have to continue, get a box of needles. A box of 100 needles was only about 10 dollars for me at my vet. You can also buy the bags separately from the lines. Bags of lactated ringers were also about 10 dollars a bag, and I would reuse the same line several times, the vet said this was perfectly fine as long as I was careful not to contaminate the ends when changing it.

OK, I did real that sometimes in research labs they do reuse needles and it seems the real issue is the needles can become dull from reuse. BUT, you really don't want to do this is you can possibly avoid it just because of contamination. If you plan on giving fluids for any length of time, I would suggest ordering a box of needles via the internet. On Tanya's website I believe they recommend Terumo 20 gauge i inch needles and the are very inexpensive for a box of 100. To avoid dropping an uncapped needle, we always put a new needle, still capped, on the end of the serum set as soon as we were finished giving fluids. Capped the old needle, took it off the line, put it in the disposal container, then put the new one on to be ready for the next time. And we kept the serum line attached to the bag until time to get a new bag. Then we just put the entire set up in a bag inside a drawer so no cats messed with it.

You might have nicked a nerve last night when you gave her her fluids. Once in a great while something like that happens and you just need to pull the needle out and change the angle. It's rare but does happen. I'm so glad she is looking good and eating at least "ok". So all in all you think she is improving? How's her UTI? Have you finished the round of antibiotics yet? Howlong are you supposed to keep giving her fluids on a daily basis?

Yes after you told me I threw the whole serum and the set and everything away and got new ones today to avoid anything like that, I also bought a lot of needles so I never do something like that again... I will try to put warm compress and see what happens, today it seems like the lump got smaller but harder.

Yes I think the serum is helping her, her face and expressions look healthier to me, she's super soft now and usually didn't defecate much but now she does it with ease..
Vet gave us enrofloxacin pills divided in 4 to use for 15 days, tomorrow is the last day and I think the timing is good because the vet said she'd be back on Friday so I can take Bobo to retest her urine immediately and show the lump as well meanwhile.
My eyes used to burn badly from the acidity and smelled awful when I changed the litter box but now it doesn't so I hope it got better... but I also remember the vet told us she has bladder epithelial tissue shedding in her urine test but no crystals were present, but didn't say much about if it would stop shedding after the UTI is gone, so I wonder what that was all about

I've been told to give fluids for 2 months on a daily basis and give only renal labelled food during this period then do another blood test after to see if the values dropped, I started on 13th of August when I wrote this post so it's like 13 days now.. still got like a month and a half to go to have her blood rechecked *fingers crossed*

 

[Jem]

I also remember the vet told us she has bladder epithelial tissue shedding in her urine test but no crystals were present, but didn't say much about if it would stop shedding after the UTI is gone, so I wonder what that was all about

It could be what my vet called "inflammatory cells" when explaining that when the bladder and urethra become inflamed (in my kitties case it was cystitis) it will shed the lining. Think sort of like when it's a lady's "time of the month"...
It will look like little slimy blood clots if you see them. It should stop when there is no more inflammation to cause the thickening and shedding of the bladder/urethral walls. So her UTI could be causing the inflammation, or she could have cystitis that caused the UTI....the fluids and antibiotic will help. But cystitis is often caused by stress...so that might be a whole different ball game.

 

[35 year catdad]

I would check all of her food sources for anything inflammatory like corn products.Also I think farmed salmon is very bad for pets and us and is loaded with toxic chemicals like PCBs on and on.They spray the overcrowded salmon holding pens with toxic chemicals to keep parasites at bay. I've never seen "wild " salmon listed in cat food but maybe it exists.
Hills and Royal canin used to have corn as a main ingredient for more profits.Many cats won't eat it knowing not to eat corn products.

My 19 yr old who last had normal kidney tests a year ago, but is getting thinner and drinking a bit more, seems to be drinking less water and eating more after 15 days on AminaVast
kidney support supplement. Today after her "movement" in the clean litter box she did some high speed runs around the place just cause she was feeling great! She hasn't done that for a few months so maybe its the supplement?
Chewys has it for about $10 a bottle of 60 capsules I empty into her wet food twice a day. Its some isolated amino acids and a patented secret formula.
Hope Bobo lives many more years Our family had a 3lb teacup poodle named Bobo..he was enuff to turn us away from dogs forever!

 

[kitteh_]

I would check all of her food sources for anything inflammatory like corn products.Also I think farmed salmon is very bad for pets and us and is loaded with toxic chemicals like PCBs on and on.They spray the overcrowded salmon holding pens with toxic chemicals to keep parasites at bay. I've never seen "wild " salmon listed in cat food but maybe it exists.
Hills and Royal canin used to have corn as a main ingredient for more profits.Many cats won't eat it knowing not to eat corn products.

My 19 yr old who last had normal kidney tests a year ago, but is getting thinner and drinking a bit more, seems to be drinking less water and eating more after 15 days on AminaVast
kidney support supplement. Today after her "movement" in the clean litter box she did some high speed runs around the place just cause she was feeling great! She hasn't done that for a few months so maybe its the supplement?
Chewys has it for about $10 a bottle of 60 capsules I empty into her wet food twice a day. Its some isolated amino acids and a patented secret formula.
Hope Bobo lives many more years Our family had a 3lb teacup poodle named Bobo..he was enuff to turn us away from dogs forever!

aw, what happened to turn you away from dogs? Thank you for the great advice, I agree with your opinion about the chemicals, I have been told to feed her only renal labelled foods but I will check for the ingredients especially for corn and will try to find AminaVast and ask my vet about it. I am so glad your cat is feeling better and thank you!! I also hope your cat(s)/pet(s) live for many more years and healthy lives

 

[kitteh_]

It could be what my vet called "inflammatory cells" when explaining that when the bladder and urethra become inflamed (in my kitties case it was cystitis) it will shed the lining. Think sort of like when it's a lady's "time of the month"...
It will look like little slimy blood clots if you see them. It should stop when there is no more inflammation to cause the thickening and shedding of the bladder/urethral walls. So her UTI could be causing the inflammation, or she could have cystitis that caused the UTI....the fluids and antibiotic will help. But cystitis is often caused by stress...so that might be a whole different ball game.

Update about Bobo, I also have another thread asking about the lump and posted it there but felt the need to post here as well
So I went to the vet on friday and they said the lump is an infection and gave me some antibiotic cream to apply.. they said her skin is very sensitive in general (by the way she had basal cell carcinoma before but got removed with clear margins and clean from it now) and her back skin got thick so that's why she's reacting a lot to the needles (I couldn't give her SubQs the night before the vet {thursday} since it hurt her and she screamed and jumped, didn't sit still at all) so they told me to open an IV catheter but on first try she ripped it off after a few minutes her arm got bruised and wounded so then they put another one on her other arm to stay for a few days until her back skin gets better but when I woke up the morning after, her arm was really HUGEEE and she was in pain, I legitly was about to faint when I saw her arm (it was bruised too) so I took it out myself immediately and I called them they told me to take her again to put another IV catheter but her arms are bruised and wounded really badly, I asked if they can do it from her back legs they said it's hard and they can't so they will put again from the same places in her arms I didn't want to risk that as they were already bruised and wounded tho I don't know what else I could do since I couldn't give her subqs as well.. I don't know if I did the right decision by not allowing them to open IV catheters again but I couldn't give subqs for 2 days straight but I will try to do again tonight.. (her skin rested for 3 days)
We retested her urine and the UTI is still there and Bobo has to take antiobiotics for another week.. one quarter of enrofloxacin (baytril) for another week...and my vet is going on a vacation again until the 10th of September I am beginning to lose hope in my vet and thinking to take Bobo to a new place, I am really in so much stress I don't know what to do

 

[MissClouseau]

my vet is going on a vacation again until the 10th of September I am beginning to lose hope in my vet and thinking to take Bobo to a new place, I am really in so much stress I don't know what to do

I read your thread and I think a different vet is a good idea to get a second opinion too. Don't forget to take all the test results from this office first. You don't have to tell them you will show them to a different vet.