cat will not leave dark unfinished basement

minka

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Originally Posted by mimi3908

I hope you give the cat a chance... worst come to worst is that the cat continues to live in basement, and by all accounts, it appears to be okay living the way it is. Ideally, the cat shouldn't have been kept there for such a long time but can't turn back the clock. I don't see what is the big deal that the cat is in a basement, and for someone to generalize that old age and adaptability issue being a reason to put the cat down is downright sad to hear.
The problem with living in the basement is that:
1. It's hiding there in fear. So it's basically constantly stressed.
2. There are small spaces in the basement that it could get stuck in.
3. Lack of socialization has led to an almost feral state, and if the cat did bolt outside, it might not come back.
 

mimi3908

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Minka, so what is the problem? My brother has a cat that lives in his basement by itself all the time too. The cat hardly comes out when i visit and hides all the time too. What is the problem with a cat living in a basement on its own? even if it is not social or in a feral state after being left in the basement for so long... If it is up to me, I would do my darnest to help it adjust, but not everyone wants to put in the time or effort, or wants to help an older animal - Again, I'm not seeing what is the big deal - at worst it lives out its life the way it has been living for 12 years... if it was stressed out for 12 years, it wouldn't have lived for this long. I just don't think it is right to jump to generalization about the cat. Each kitty has its own comfort level and maybe this one is a basement kitty..and is okay with its existence.
 

farleyv

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The cat is in a constant state of fear...fear in cats brings on illness. But no one knows because no vet visits.'

It is not living there happily, getting visits by the family. It's mortified.

That's the problem.
 

cat person

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Originally Posted by Jen

I thought this exact same thing. Many times a cat in its teens cannot be changed and it stresses the cat out even more trying to. Stress can lead to illness... then everyone is miserable, owner for failing and cat for being put through such traumatic events. It is sad but sometimes it is the best.

At the shelters I worked at, we would get people calling to surrender their 15 year old cat who is scared to death of everything and now they work more so they can't care for it properly. Often times we told them that the stress will kill the cat before we can find it a home and if they really decide they can't care for it, euthanasia would be the best option.

I am sorry to say that what is really sad is that the owner left the cat in the dark basement for 12 years in the first place.
That is because in my opinion me and you have real hands on experience with such cases and many members do not. Also what the shelter staff told you is correct in my opinion and experience.

KTLynn;3106987 At 14 said:
To me a cat incrementally using the whole basement to have bowel movements is causing harm to your property. But even if that is not correct to you, you would have to agree it is VERY unpleasant experience. Plus since the OP said it is making the home smell I feel that is also contributing to property damage.

Now if you feel a fourteen year old cat is not elderly that is fine as well. But I feel the combination of behavioral problems (being feral and litter box avoidance) plus the cats age makes euthanasia a possible REALISTIC solution.

Lastly if you feel this is a medical issue how do you expect the OP to find out
? The OP is not going to go grab the cat I suspect
.

Originally Posted by Rosiemac

And there's a chance that this person does have the time and the patience?!.

Too many people give up too easily and take the easy option of having animals euthanised.

Please remember the member has come here for help from us
I am not saying the owner should not try and modify the cats behavior. I was saying how difficult it will be and that it might not be able to be done. So euthanization might be a fairer solution to the human and the cat.

Originally Posted by mimi3908

Minka, so what is the problem? My brother has a cat that lives in his basement by itself all the time too. The cat hardly comes out when i visit and hides all the time too. What is the problem with a cat living in a basement on its own? even if it is not social or in a feral state after being left in the basement for so long... If it is up to me, I would do my darnest to help it adjust, but not everyone wants to put in the time or effort, or wants to help an older animal - Again, I'm not seeing what is the big deal - at worst it lives out its life the way it has been living for 12 years... if it was stressed out for 12 years, it wouldn't have lived for this long. I just don't think it is right to jump to generalization about the cat. Each kitty has its own comfort level and maybe this one is a basement kitty..and is okay with its existence.
There is nothing wrong with having a feral cat in your basement if the HUMAN ENJOYS IT and the animal is HEALTHY.

I feel the problem is this: if people do not enjoy owning any animal for whatever reason and the animals behavior can not be modified to the humans enjoyment then there is NO reason to expect the person to keep the animal. So euthanization in some cases is the most humane thing that can be done.
 

ktlynn

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Originally Posted by Cat Person

That is because in my opinion me and you have real hands on experience with such cases and many members do not. Also what the shelter staff told you is correct in my opinion and experience.
There are many on TCS who have worked with cats who have behavior issues as well as those who've socialized feral cats. Anyone working in animal welfare over a long period of time has seen and heard of all sorts of cases. However, it's wrong to generalize that older cats specifically, will become so stressed in a new situation that the stress alone will kill them. I've seen year old cats admitted who are terribly frightened and fearful. Shelters should not dissuade people on the basis of their cat's age. Better to admit the cat and give him a chance to find a home than to have his desperate person abandon him in the street or euthanize him.



Originally Posted by Cat Person

To me a cat incrementally using the whole basement to have bowel movements is causing harm to your property. But even if that is not correct to you, you would have to agree it is VERY unpleasant experience. Plus since the OP said it is making the home smell I feel that is also contributing to property damage.
I've already stated that pooping outside the box is unpleasant for both guardian and cat. This is apparently a recent development, since maretlyle has not said the cat has pooped indiscriminately throughout the basement for the past 12 years. So is the smell creating an unpleasant situation? Obviously. Will it require a clean-up? Of course. Property damage? No.


Originally Posted by Cat Person

Now if you feel a fourteen year old cat is not elderly that is fine as well. But I feel the combination of behavioral problems (being feral and litter box avoidance) plus the cats age makes euthanasia a possible REALISTIC solution.
I know a 14 year old cat isn't elderly. I know what elderly is. My Mickey was 21 when she passed. My cousin's cat 22. Most members here have cats who've lived well into their teens. Those cats are elderly. There's not a vet worth his/her salt who will tell you a 14 year old is an elderly cat.

Barring an unforeseen critical illness, Luna can look forward to at least several more years of life, if not more.

Originally Posted by Cat Person

Lastly if you feel this is a medical issue how do you expect the OP to find out
? The OP is not going to go grab the cat I suspect
.
Please re-read the posts in this thread more carefully. From the beginning, myself and others have told maretlyle that she needs to borrow a humane trap to get Luna out of the basement.

(Just an aside here, but how did you think the OP would accomplish euthanasia, as you suggested, since obviously she "is not going to go grab the cat"?)

Originally Posted by Cat Person

I am not saying the owner should not try and modify the cats behavior. I was saying how difficult it will be and that it might not be able to be done. So euthanization might be a fairer solution to the human and the cat.
What's fair is to give maretlyle and Luna a chance to work this out. Maretlyle is obviously willing to put in the effort to see if she can improve her cat's life. How about we encourage her in this and take the "glass half full" approach, rather than talk about "fairer solutions" which means putting her cat to death?

Luna, for one, would disagree with that "solution". Her life is precious to her.


Originally Posted by Cat Person;3107`114

There is nothing wrong with having a feral cat in your basement if the HUMAN ENJOYS IT and the animal is HEALTHY.

I feel the problem is this: if people do not enjoy owning any animal for whatever reason and the animals behavior can not be modified to the humans enjoyment then there is NO reason to expect the person to keep the animal. So euthanization in some cases is the most humane thing that can be done.
Most humane thing? You mean the most expedient thing, I believe.

Euthanasia is for animals who are critically ill and suffering from their illness and have no chance for recovery. Imagine bringing your cat to the vet asking to have her put down because "I no longer enjoy her ...", as you say "for whatever reason."

This plays right into our "throwaway" society. If "it", whether an object or an animal, no longer amuses us, or inconveniences us in any way, just ditch it.

Maretlyle is trying to help her cat. Why don't we help her do that?
 
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maretlyle

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I've appreciated reading through the suggestions.
I just want to clarify a couple things:
We love all animals and want what's best for them. Even though we wish we could 'enjoy' Luna the way we do our other 2 cats, I accept that she has her own temperament and I've tried to be respectful of that. She is NOT afraid when she is in the basement. This is her territory where she feels safe. It is warm down there, she has cushions to sleep on, a litter box (which she sometimes uses) and she gets fed daily. We've let this go on for so long because this is what she was most comfortable with. She is extremely stressed when she is in the house. She used to also be fine outside (allow us to stroke her), up until the new cat arrived 1.5 years ago. She is obviously fearful of him. I was able to socialize the new cat with the other one because they had gradual exposure to each other. However with Luna, since she had not been coming into the house was not able to be socialized. To have forced it by bringing her upstairs would have caused both animals alot of stress. We did not plan on a third cat, but my daughter was not able to take him with her when she moved into her new apt. We must say that we have thoroughly enjoyed him as he is very affectionate.
What causes us stress is that Luna has been urinating and defecating indiscriminately in spaces that she probably assumes are outside (granite rock comes into the basement) and the smell is starting to come into the house. We are not able to get into these spaces to clean it up. If she was no longer there we would have the basement professionally disinfected.
We are willing to try to socialize her. We feel we owe it to her after having her for all these years and see how it goes. If she ends up more stressed in the end, then we would also consider other options. Euthanasia would be an extremely difficult and sad decision for us.
 

rosiemac

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Originally Posted by maretlyle

Euthanasia would be an extremely difficult and sad decision for us.
I'm so pleased your not thinking of taking this option. 14 years is a long time, and it's like having a member of your family.

Not sure if anyones mentioned the Feliway Plug ins or Rescue Remedy drops to add to the water and food?. This helps to destress them and l swear by them.

What's she like for playing with you, say with a dangling toy?
 

mimi3908

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Originally Posted by farleyv

The cat is in a constant state of fear...fear in cats brings on illness. But no one knows because no vet visits.'

It is not living there happily, getting visits by the family. It's mortified.

That's the problem.
From reading your other posts, I think we are on the same page. The point is I would rather let the cat live in the basement than follow advise of someone to put it down simply because it is living in the basement for so long and is unable to socialize. Again, if it was up to me, I would definitely try to socialize it and take it step by step
 

mimi3908

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Originally Posted by Cat Person

There is nothing wrong with having a feral cat in your basement if the HUMAN ENJOYS IT and the animal is HEALTHY.

I feel the problem is this: if people do not enjoy owning any animal for whatever reason and the animals behavior can not be modified to the humans enjoyment then there is NO reason to expect the person to keep the animal. So euthanization in some cases is the most humane thing that can be done.
I hate to think someone has to "enjoy" the animal in order to save it. To me, it is about the animal/kitty, it isn't about me. I do appreciate humane way of dealing with certain situations but I hardly see this problem of a basement kitty as warranting the thought of euthanasia. I had an FELV+ and FIV+ cat that lived happily with us till the day she passed away on her own terms and in her own bed. I know most people would put her down but that is just me. I guess we just have to agree to disagree in the way we would handle this basement kitty.
 

ktlynn

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Originally Posted by maretlyle

I just want to clarify a couple things:
We love all animals and want what's best for them. Even though we wish we could 'enjoy' Luna the way we do our other 2 cats, I accept that she has her own temperament and I've tried to be respectful of that. She is NOT afraid when she is in the basement. This is her territory where she feels safe. It is warm down there, she has cushions to sleep on, a litter box (which she sometimes uses) and she gets fed daily. We've let this go on for so long because this is what she was most comfortable with. She is extremely stressed when she is in the house. She used to also be fine outside (allow us to stroke her), up until the new cat arrived 1.5 years ago...
Thank you, maretlyle, for further clarifying Luna's situation.

I've put two of the sentences you wrote in bold letters because they're so important. It's gratifying that you accept Luna on her terms and understand what makes her feel comfortable, as well as what doesn't.


Originally Posted by maretlyle

We are willing to try to socialize her. We feel we owe it to her after having her for all these years and see how it goes.
Luna is lucky that you have her best interest at heart, and very fortunate as well that you want to try to change her life for the better.

Originally Posted by maretlyle

If she ends up more stressed in the end, then we would also consider other options. Euthanasia would be an extremely difficult and sad decision for us.
There are indeed other options, which would not include euthanasia.

Let's start by being optimistic. We're here to help and support you so please continue to let us know how you and Luna are doing.
 

ktlynn

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Originally Posted by mimi3908

I hate to think someone has to "enjoy" the animal in order to save it. To me, it is about the animal/kitty, it isn't about me. I do appreciate humane way of dealing with certain situations but I hardly see this problem of a basement kitty as warranting the thought of euthanasia.


Exactly. Thank you for that.

And bless you for taking care of your special needs kitty and letting her live out her life being safe and loved.
 

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I wonder... would there be a way of blocking off the areas that aren't accessible for cleaning, so that she could stay in "her" basement but only use either floor that can be cleaned, or a litter box?

I would also add another litter box, so that she has the choice of one when the other is dirty. Many cats are pretty finicky; after all, they have to lick those paws clean and if it were me I wouldn't want to go in a dirty box! To some cats, "used once" equals "dirty", so daily cleaning isn't enough and providing a second box will solve the problem.

Once the place is a little less bad-smelling, add some furniture and spend some time down there with her. Lawn furniture, I guess, since this is an unfinished basement--I'm assuming there's enough head room there for a human to sit?
 

yayi

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Originally Posted by Callista

I wonder... would there be a way of blocking off the areas that aren't accessible for cleaning, so that she could stay in "her" basement but only use either floor that can be cleaned, or a litter box?

I would also add another litter box, so that she has the choice of one when the other is dirty. Many cats are pretty finicky; after all, they have to lick those paws clean and if it were me I wouldn't want to go in a dirty box! To some cats, "used once" equals "dirty", so daily cleaning isn't enough and providing a second box will solve the problem.

Once the place is a little less bad-smelling, add some furniture and spend some time down there with her. Lawn furniture, I guess, since this is an unfinished basement--I'm assuming there's enough head room there for a human to sit?
Great advise!
One thing I learned reading this thread - state all details when posting your problem. It will avoid a lot of arguing from respondents.
 
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