Cat Introduction .... Failure?

[RocketPuppy97]

I'm glad they make you as happy as the make me

Actually, they have their own Instagram account since the beginning of the year, so if you are interested in more cute pics of them I try to post fairly regularly
Monty and Cosmo the cats (@montyandcosmo.jpg) • Instagram photos and videos

 

[calicosrspecial]

Do they really? I don;t know instragram but will check it out. You have to admit, they are VERY charismatic AND CUTE!!! Thanks for letting me know!! Really special cats!!

Thanks!!

 

[RocketPuppy97]

Heeeey everyone! Long time no see! And here I am bringing a dead thread back to life.

The past month were okay I think. Cosmo would pee once every one or two month or so. We were not able to find out would caused him to do so.

But
Over the last two to three month, Monty became kind of a bully? He'll chase Cosmo 1 1/2 hours before dinner. He won't stop. Cosmo will hiss at him and sometimes even growl. The only place where he's safe is on top of my boyfriend computer (he's not very pleased with that lol) so if he's got enough, he'll run up and jump on it to get Monty to leave him alone.
Cosmo is (depending on what food he's getting) some what of a slow eater. And Monty will crouch to cosmo while he's still eating attempting to steal his food.
Cosmo will growl really loud and eat angrily? Monty didn't ever get to steal his food, if I witness Monty trying that, I'll tell him to leave cosmo alone.
Sometimes he'll sit somewhere else in the room and watch him from there. If he simply doesn't stop, I'll put him in the bathroom.

Overall: both of them seem to be happy cats? They'll groom each other regularly, often ending in playtime. But Monty will also chase him from where Cosmo is laying and then go lay right in that spot, even if it's somewhere where he would never lay.
Cosmo is also starting to lay on us, which is really great. It took us a really long time to make him a lap cat.
But on the other hand. At night when both of us go to sleep. He'll scratch at the office door and meow to be let in. It's the only room where he can't go without supervision. It was like that from day one. It was never a problem until now suddenly.
He also peed in the hallway last week and yesterday night he peed in the bathtub.
We didn't change anything about the litter boxes so I'm at a loss what it could be.

So in summary:
I think Monty is jealous, because we love Cosmo too and trys to show him again that he's the boss, which is maybe triggering Cosmo peeing again?

Don't get me wrong, Monty is also getting all the cuddles he wants, all day everyday. Since my boyfriend is home nearly 24/7 due to home office.


The whole corona thing is wearing me down quite a bit, work is crazy because of it and the cat thing is making it all worse I can't get a good sleep because of cosmo.

Please help me

 

[Jcatbird]

Hi! The whole virus thing is getting to everyone so we sympathize!
I haven’t caught up with all your thread but when I saw this post I wanted to respond. More than one thing comes to mind. First, a UTI is possible. Urinary tract infections are common. I know vet visits are difficult but maybe your vet can check Monty or even tell you how to drop off a urine sample. If that is the problem, antibiotics are needed. The vet may just prescribe something.
A lot of kitties are feeling the stress of their humans too. They sense what we are going through and they are also having to adjust to new routines along with us. That could account for a change with Monty. Try to reassure Monty, give equal love and attention but also, give a vet a call about him suddenly peeing in unusual places. It might be a simple fix. Please do post back with updates. Sending you all calming kitty purrs!

 

[RocketPuppy97]

Hi! The whole virus thing is getting to everyone so we sympathize!
I haven’t caught up with all your thread but when I saw this post I wanted to respond. More than one thing comes to mind. First, a UTI is possible. Urinary tract infections are common. I know vet visits are difficult but maybe your vet can check Monty or even tell you how to drop off a urine sample. If that is the problem, antibiotics are needed. The vet may just prescribe something.
A lot of kitties are feeling the stress of their humans too. They sense what we are going through and they are also having to adjust to new routines along with us. That could account for a change with Monty. Try to reassure Monty, give equal love and attention but also, give a vet a call about him suddenly peeing in unusual places. It might be a simple fix. Please do post back with updates. Sending you all calming kitty purrs!

Hi!
Thanks for your reply!
I work at a vets office and I got Cosmo checked a while ago, he's not showing any other symptoms which would lead us to believe he has a UTI. He makes good amounts of pee, doesn't go too often and isn't in any pain when he goes to the litterbox.
And Monty didn't have any litterbox problems whatsoever. He'll even go on and bury Cosmo's pee when he doesn't do it.
Cosmo had a big problem with peeing when we got him, which was at that time related to the stress caused by having them seperated and Monty not liking him. After getting them together, the peeing problem stopped, except for one or two times.

I always had the feeling that Cosmo especially was very stress sensitve.
And Monty always was the one who thinks he's in charge, he gets to cuddle with my boyfriend so much, but seems to be jealous when Cosmo is on his lap from time to time.
We want to start playing with them before dinner time again, to get Montys focus off of Cosmo.

 

[Jcatbird]

Oh. Sorry. It’s Cosmo that is peeing other places.
If no UTI or other symptoms then I would think it’s stress from your description. Going back to the routine you had with them before the growling and other problems between them may make a big difference. Kitties really don’t love change. Stress is a big issue. It can totally cause urination problems. I have integrated a lot of kitties into the Clowder here and there is one male that can get to feeling left out at times or he reads my stress or illness. He’s a very intuitive kitty. He’s also the peacemaker in the Clowder. He won’t allow any fussing between others. He grooms any cat that is upset. When his stress happens, he lets me know by spraying. It doesn’t happen often but when it does, I know he is stressed. He is neutered but sprays to tell me his feelings. I pick him up for cuddles and reassurance as I go for the enzyme cleaners! Lol They want a set routine and they always read our stress too. Some people find that the music for cats that can be found online is helpful. There are lots of calming products out there now too if the problem isn’t corrected by returning to your previous routine. I’m betting that when you go back to that routine and your stress level is lowered, both kitties will be okay. Checking Monty for any health issues is also a good idea as Cosmo may be picking up on anything there. They urinate outside the box as a message. There is another thread here that might provide some insight for you. Charlie and Finn have had similar issues. The story there continues but there was some apparent bullying and stress along with urinating problems. Their human used several products that helped. Finn was brought in as a rescue and Charlie was the resident. It’s a fairly long thread but well worth reading. I’ll find it and post a link for you. I hope it helps.

 

[Jcatbird]

Found it! I hope you find this helpful. I Have More Trust Issues Than This Feral..

 

[RocketPuppy97]

He’s a very intuitive kitty. He’s also the peacemaker in the Clowder. He won’t allow any fussing between others. He grooms any cat that is upset. When his stress happens, he lets me know by spraying. It doesn’t happen often but when it does, I know he is stressed. He is neutered but sprays to tell me his feelings.

Oh, that's quite interesting behaviour. Seems alot like what Cosmo is doing.

Some people find that the music for cats that can be found online is helpful.

I'll try that, next time he's upset

I’m betting that when you go back to that routine and your stress level is lowered, both kitties will be okay.

I think. thats unfortunatly gonna take a while. I hope I can calm them otherwise till then

Found it! I hope you find this helpful. I Have More Trust Issues Than This Feral..

Thanks for psting the thread, I'll read it!

 

[Furballsmom]

Hi! Along with the music, are you using any other calming products?

 

[calicosrspecial]

Heeeey everyone! Long time no see! And here I am bringing a dead thread back to life.

The past month were okay I think. Cosmo would pee once every one or two month or so. We were not able to find out would caused him to do so.

But
Over the last two to three month, Monty became kind of a bully? He'll chase Cosmo 1 1/2 hours before dinner. He won't stop. Cosmo will hiss at him and sometimes even growl. The only place where he's safe is on top of my boyfriend computer (he's not very pleased with that lol) so if he's got enough, he'll run up and jump on it to get Monty to leave him alone.
Cosmo is (depending on what food he's getting) some what of a slow eater. And Monty will crouch to cosmo while he's still eating attempting to steal his food.
Cosmo will growl really loud and eat angrily? Monty didn't ever get to steal his food, if I witness Monty trying that, I'll tell him to leave cosmo alone.
Sometimes he'll sit somewhere else in the room and watch him from there. If he simply doesn't stop, I'll put him in the bathroom.

Overall: both of them seem to be happy cats? They'll groom each other regularly, often ending in playtime. But Monty will also chase him from where Cosmo is laying and then go lay right in that spot, even if it's somewhere where he would never lay.
Cosmo is also starting to lay on us, which is really great. It took us a really long time to make him a lap cat.
But on the other hand. At night when both of us go to sleep. He'll scratch at the office door and meow to be let in. It's the only room where he can't go without supervision. It was like that from day one. It was never a problem until now suddenly.
He also peed in the hallway last week and yesterday night he peed in the bathtub.
We didn't change anything about the litter boxes so I'm at a loss what it could be.

So in summary:
I think Monty is jealous, because we love Cosmo too and trys to show him again that he's the boss, which is maybe triggering Cosmo peeing again?

Don't get me wrong, Monty is also getting all the cuddles he wants, all day everyday. Since my boyfriend is home nearly 24/7 due to home office.


The whole corona thing is wearing me down quite a bit, work is crazy because of it and the cat thing is making it all worse I can't get a good sleep because of cosmo.

Please help me

Great responses so far by others.

Don't worry, we can improve this.

I'll echo both your observation that Cosmo is very sensitive and more sensitive to stress and it is probably just general stress in the house due to Covid, changes in routines, etc. Cosmo has seemed very sensitive to those things.

"Over the last two to three month, Monty became kind of a bully? He'll chase Cosmo 1 1/2 hours before dinner. He won't stop. Cosmo will hiss at him and sometimes even growl. The only place where he's safe is on top of my boyfriend computer (he's not very pleased with that lol) so if he's got enough, he'll run up and jump on it to get Monty to leave him alone." - Is he really being a bully or is he just wanting to play? Monty LOVES that rough play. My cats love chasing each other. If you heard my cats running up and down the stairs and jumping on things and all the thuds etc you would think an earthquake was happening.

It always is telling how fast they rebound after a chase. A hiss is communication, as is a growl. If it is respected and a real fight doesn't happen then and they rebound quickly then it is just their way of playing, having fun, pushing buttons, etc. It does seem like Monty has no intention of hurting Cosmo (they do love each other so that base of love is very positive) so the fact Monty respects Cosmo's wishes (hissing, growling) that is very positive. I do think Monty likes to get this response and views it as fun.

So I would love to hear how Cosmo acts after the chase and what he does when he comes down from being high (and how long it takes).

"Cosmo is (depending on what food he's getting) some what of a slow eater. And Monty will crouch to cosmo while he's still eating attempting to steal his food. Cosmo will growl really loud and eat angrily? Monty didn't ever get to steal his food, if I witness Monty trying that, I'll tell him to leave cosmo alone." - This happens fairly often. I would suggest trying to distract Monty is a positive way. So maybe give him a treat or two. Give him some love, attention. Maybe give him a little more food. We want to keep it a positive experience for them. Just use reassuring words, stay calm and confident. Diffuse the situation. It is a little time consuming but it could be very helpful. Just try a few different thing to make it a positive experience and let's see what works. I will say, the fact Monty does respect Cosmo is a positive. I am guessing Monty just likes to be involved and have some fun. I am not so sure it is really about the food more about Cosmo. But let's see.

"Sometimes he'll sit somewhere else in the room and watch him from there. If he simply doesn't stop, I'll put him in the bathroom." - Cats are very territorial so I tend to avoid taking territory away unless absolutely necessary (injury is highly likely). SO I tend to use distraction, play, food, love to turn the attention away but in a positive way. I know time constraints make it very difficult but I have found good success with that method. We'll see how he responds.

"They'll groom each other regularly, often ending in playtime." - This is exactly why the intent seems more "bratty playful" rather than troubling. If there were fundamental issues between them we would not see this. Now, we still need to work on building confidence (Play, Food, Height and Love) and try to continue to make positive associations and positive encounters. Cosmo tends to be a bit more sensitive so it should be helpful to him.

"But Monty will also chase him from where Cosmo is laying and then go lay right in that spot, even if it's somewhere where he would never lay." - Cats so that all the time. It is not necessarily negative. It could be because the spot is warm. It could be because he loves Cosmo and likes to be with his scent. If you are worried just give Cosmo some extra attention, make it positive. If Cosmo is not acting differently (less confident) after this then I would not be too worried.

"Cosmo is also starting to lay on us, which is really great. It took us a really long time to make him a lap cat." - Awwwwwwwwww, that is AWESOME!!

"But on the other hand. At night when both of us go to sleep. He'll scratch at the office door and meow to be let in. It's the only room where he can't go without supervision. It was like that from day one. It was never a problem until now suddenly." - Yes, this happens all the time. Cats don't like territory being "taken away" so they can respond in different ways. It can be stressful and lead to peeing. I am guessing he can;t be in there because he could chew cords, knock things over, etc. If you can somehow make it more cat proof and allow him access it could be helpful. Cosmo is more sensitive (based on his history - he peed when he couldn't be with Monty) so if there is a way to safely give him access that could be helpful. This might be one of the causes of the sometimes peeing. It is VERY common for cats to respond in that way.

"I think Monty is jealous, because we love Cosmo too and trys to show him again that he's the boss, which is maybe triggering Cosmo peeing again?" - Well, it is possible but I think it is just Monty loving his brother and loving to play. Monty plays wilder, rougher. He loves it. Is Monty acting up in other ways?

"Don't get me wrong, Monty is also getting all the cuddles he wants, all day everyday. Since my boyfriend is home nearly 24/7 due to home office." - This is great. Love is VERY important. Try to play as much as possible as well as it drains some energy and builds confidence.

"The whole corona thing is wearing me down quite a bit, work is crazy because of it and the cat thing is making it all worse I can't get a good sleep because of cosmo." - TOTALLY. I am getting so many people having problems because of the stress and the change in routines (people staying at home). It is very hard and stressful and that does impact the cats (Even VERY confident cats).

How else is Cosmo causing problems at night?

See if you can step up play with him to drain some energy and see if you can make some comfy places he would enjoy sleeping. Also, if you can make the office safe that could be helpful.

We'll get you through this. The good news is, they have a great base of love between them. I don;t get a sense their relationship is an issue. It could become an issue possibly but it seems like a ways away. The bad news is they have too much energy and Monty has a bit more than Cosmo. So they get a bit wild and move around at night.

So please step up play, feed after, make positive associations, maximize positive encounters, distract in a positive way, see if you can safely make the office safe for a cat, and stay as calm and confident and loving around them. Let's see how they respond and adjust as needed. We'll improve it. I am not reading anything really concerning or insurmountable. Just some minor adjustments and effort.

Stay safe. Germany seems to be doing better but please still be careful.

 

[RocketPuppy97]

Is he really being a bully or is he just wanting to play? Monty LOVES that rough play. My cats love chasing each other. If you heard my cats running up and down the stairs and jumping on things and all the thuds etc you would think an earthquake was happening.

It always is telling how fast they rebound after a chase. A hiss is communication, as is a growl. If it is respected and a real fight doesn't happen then and they rebound quickly then it is just their way of playing, having fun, pushing buttons, etc. It does seem like Monty has no intention of hurting Cosmo (they do love each other so that base of love is very positive) so the fact Monty respects Cosmo's wishes (hissing, growling) that is very positive. I do think Monty likes to get this response and views it as fun.

So I would love to hear how Cosmo acts after the chase and what he does when he comes down from being high (and how long it takes)

It's a little hard to teel, for me personally. I just see cosmo running away from him, wanting to be left alone, hissing, growling. But he'll just not stand his ground he'll not get angry and tell Monty to back off. And Monty just continues chasing him again and again.
Cosmo becomes a little restless for like 5 minutes, then it's okay again. Until 5 minutes after that, Monty will get on his nerves again

Sometimes he'll sit somewhere else in the room and watch him from there. If he simply doesn't stop, I'll put him in the bathroom." - Cats are very territorial so I tend to avoid taking territory away unless absolutely necessary (injury is highly likely). SO I tend to use distraction, play, food, love to turn the attention away but in a positive way. I know time constraints make it very difficult but I have found good success with that method. We'll see how he responds.

I'll try to get him distracted instead then.

They'll groom each other regularly, often ending in playtime." - This is exactly why the intent seems more "bratty playful" rather than troubling. If there were fundamental issues between them we would not see this. Now, we still need to work on building confidence (Play, Food, Height and Love) and try to continue to make positive associations and positive encounters. Cosmo tends to be a bit more sensitive so it should be helpful to him.

Bratty describes it quite well I think
I bought their favourite cat yogurt again, they didn't get this in month, I think that would be a good treat after playtime

"But on the other hand. At night when both of us go to sleep. He'll scratch at the office door and meow to be let in. It's the only room where he can't go without supervision. It was like that from day one. It was never a problem until now suddenly." - Yes, this happens all the time. Cats don't like territory being "taken away" so they can respond in different ways. It can be stressful and lead to peeing. I am guessing he can;t be in there because he could chew cords, knock things over, etc. If you can somehow make it more cat proof and allow him access it could be helpful. Cosmo is more sensitive (based on his history - he peed when he couldn't be with Monty) so if there is a way to safely give him access that could be helpful. This might be one of the causes of the sometimes peeing. It is VERY common for cats to respond in that way.

I would love for him to be able to sleep there, how he wants to, but it is really not possible I keep hissing cockroaches and I've lost count on how often he'll just throw the enclosure from the shelves. Apart from that, that's the only place where I can safely keep my tarantula enclosures.
Last night, when we were trying to sleep, he was meowing and stratching again and Monty would start chasing him until Cosmo was giving a growling concert and we had to break it up. Then he would go right back to scratching the door it was terrible. I didn't want to make too much fuss about it, to avoid Cosmo scratching the door for attention.

"I think Monty is jealous, because we love Cosmo too and trys to show him again that he's the boss, which is maybe triggering Cosmo peeing again?" - Well, it is possible but I think it is just Monty loving his brother and loving to play. Monty plays wilder, rougher. He loves it. Is Monty acting up in other ways?

No, Monty is just a god damn brat apart from the usual stuff he isn't supposed to do, which he does regardless, the Cosmo annoying stuff is the only thing he does.

How else is Cosmo causing problems at night?

See if you can step up play with him to drain some energy and see if you can make some comfy places he would enjoy sleeping. Also, if you can make the office safe that could be helpful.

The other night he peed in the bathtub, after meowing and scratching at the office door.

He has many comfy places he loves to sleep at, the cat tree in the bedroom right across the office, a cat cave right in the hallway where the office is, our bed.
And I know he wants to either sleep on my office chair, in his cardboard box inside of the office or on the cat office table where we laid down a cozy blanket just for them

I wouldn't mind giving him a box for the hallway, but I know that after a while, when he gets upset again, who knows because of what he'll go and pee in the box. He even peed in the scratch box I build for them, it was their favourite place to scratch.

And sleeping in the office is just not an option. My boyfriend trapped him in the office by accident a few days ago . And Cosmo threw my roaches from a shelve high up (everything was intact luckily) and stole my chocolate Easter bunny I kept in that shelve too. If he wants to get something, he'll God damn get it but no worries, he didn't eat any of it, he just liked it a couple of times.
He mad a little chaos and after that was happily asleep on my chair the whole night no door scratching, nothing. Not even when we were getting up in the morning.

We'll get you through this. The good news is, they have a great base of love between them. I don;t get a sense their relationship is an issue. It could become an issue possibly but it seems like a ways away. The bad news is they have too much energy and Monty has a bit more than Cosmo. So they get a bit wild and move around at night.

So please step up play, feed after, make positive associations, maximize positive encounters, distract in a positive way, see if you can safely make the office safe for a cat, and stay as calm and confident and loving around them. Let's see how they respond and adjust as needed. We'll improve it. I am not reading anything really concerning or insurmountable. Just some minor adjustments and effort.

I changed their feeding schedule to 4 times a day month ago, and their last meal is right before bedtime, so that would be a great opportunity to play with them.

Stay safe. Germany seems to be doing better but please still be careful

Yeah, I'm a little worried about that, since all shops and schools are allowed to open again. I suspect there will be a huge new wave coming

Stay safe too!

Hi! Along with the music, are you using any other calming products?

Not right now, I have to read into some a little more

 

[Furballsmom]

Here are some products;
Feliway multicat may help, and there are these;

Only Natural Pet has a calming product called Just Relax Calming spray with essential oil (catnip oil).

There's this one, be sure and scroll all the way down the page;

Bach Remedies for Pets: Discover the Power of Bach Flower Remedies

Learn how Bach Remedies can help your pets with anxiety, stress, and behavioral issues. Find out more about Bach Flower Remedies for pets here.

www.bachflower.com

Also, there is ThunderWunders calming chews, Richard's Organic Pet Calm drops, Naturevet Hemp, HomeoPet Anxiety Relief, Head to Tail Calming, Relaxivet Quiet Moments Cat treats, GNC Calming formula, and there is Calm-o-mile, Natures Miracle calming spray, Vetri-Science's Composure is another item to look at, Pet Remedy - UK (it has valerian) is yet another, as is Essential Pet Pet-eze, Pet Organics No Stress, Only Natural Pet (brand and website) has other calming products, Pet Naturals also has one I believe, and there are others.

Lambert Vet Supply is a website to look at, and of course chewy, also there's Petwishpros, animaleo, 1-800-petmeds, Petco and PetSmart, and other pet stores.

There is also a product called a lickimat which could be helpful, as cats can be calmed by the process of licking.

The LickiMat - Food Puzzles for Cats

This is a fantastic new tool to slow down those cats that eat wet food too quickly. Available in three different textures and two colors. Easy to wash and clean, easy to fill. This could also be used as a tool while introducing new cats to each other since it will slow down their eating […]

foodpuzzlesforcats.com

This post talks about some other products;

Calming Treats For A Very Picky Cat

I'm at a loss with my pickiest cat on what calming treats to give him. He rejects both that I've tried. NaturVet Quiet Moments was a straight no. Composure by VetriScience gave me hope at first, he ate one treat, but the next day turned up his nose, and hasn't gone near them since. He sees me...

thecatsite.com

 

[calicosrspecial]

It's a little hard to teel, for me personally. I just see cosmo running away from him, wanting to be left alone, hissing, growling. But he'll just not stand his ground he'll not get angry and tell Monty to back off. And Monty just continues chasing him again and again.
Cosmo becomes a little restless for like 5 minutes, then it's okay again. Until 5 minutes after that, Monty will get on his nerves again



I'll try to get him distracted instead then.



Bratty describes it quite well I think
I bought their favourite cat yogurt again, they didn't get this in month, I think that would be a good treat after playtime



I would love for him to be able to sleep there, how he wants to, but it is really not possible I keep hissing cockroaches and I've lost count on how often he'll just throw the enclosure from the shelves. Apart from that, that's the only place where I can safely keep my tarantula enclosures.
Last night, when we were trying to sleep, he was meowing and stratching again and Monty would start chasing him until Cosmo was giving a growling concert and we had to break it up. Then he would go right back to scratching the door it was terrible. I didn't want to make too much fuss about it, to avoid Cosmo scratching the door for attention.



No, Monty is just a god damn brat apart from the usual stuff he isn't supposed to do, which he does regardless, the Cosmo annoying stuff is the only thing he does.




The other night he peed in the bathtub, after meowing and scratching at the office door.

He has many comfy places he loves to sleep at, the cat tree in the bedroom right across the office, a cat cave right in the hallway where the office is, our bed.
And I know he wants to either sleep on my office chair, in his cardboard box inside of the office or on the cat office table where we laid down a cozy blanket just for them

I wouldn't mind giving him a box for the hallway, but I know that after a while, when he gets upset again, who knows because of what he'll go and pee in the box. He even peed in the scratch box I build for them, it was their favourite place to scratch.

And sleeping in the office is just not an option. My boyfriend trapped him in the office by accident a few days ago . And Cosmo threw my roaches from a shelve high up (everything was intact luckily) and stole my chocolate Easter bunny I kept in that shelve too. If he wants to get something, he'll God damn get it but no worries, he didn't eat any of it, he just liked it a couple of times.
He mad a little chaos and after that was happily asleep on my chair the whole night no door scratching, nothing. Not even when we were getting up in the morning.



I changed their feeding schedule to 4 times a day month ago, and their last meal is right before bedtime, so that would be a great opportunity to play with them.


Yeah, I'm a little worried about that, since all shops and schools are allowed to open again. I suspect there will be a huge new wave coming

Stay safe too!



Not right now, I have to read into some a little more

"But he'll (Cosmo) just not stand his ground he'll not get angry and tell Monty to back off. And Monty just continues chasing him again and again." - I am guessing because he doesn't view it as a "serious" threat more of an annoyance.And of course then Monty think it is ok to just keep on chasing. It also could be a lack of confidence BUT everything else doesn't really support that (fast rebounds, hanging out together, grooming each other, etc).

"Cosmo becomes a little restless for like 5 minutes, then it's okay again. Until 5 minutes after that, Monty will get on his nerves again " - That is a fast rebound. It might suggest a little uncertainty since it is 5 minutes but it is a fast rebound. If Cosmo really viewed Monty as a threat he would definitely be acting differently for longer than this time amount.

I am leaning towards it being play. Monty shows no sign of wanting to hurt him and Cosmo's response suggests it isn't serious as well. I do get a sense Monty loves to have fun with him though Cosmo doesn't always like that much energy. You can try to distract in a positive way and see how they respond.

"I'll try to get him distracted instead then." - I think that is a good idea. Make it fun, more interesting if possible. That will help Cosmo build a little confidence as well. We'll see if it helps. It should but we'll see.

"I bought their favourite cat yogurt again, they didn't get this in month, I think that would be a good treat after playtime" - Purrrrfect. I think they will love that. And that will be another great positive association and positive encounter.

"I would love for him to be able to sleep there, how he wants to, but it is really not possible I keep hissing cockroaches and I've lost count on how often he'll just throw the enclosure from the shelves. Apart from that, that's the only place where I can safely keep my tarantula enclosures." - I forgot about the other animals. He does seem fascinated with the cockroaches (I am guessing the sounds). I am really wondering if this is the source of the issues. Cosmo is sensitive and loves to be around others and I am wondering if he wants to be near them, around them and when he can't he acts up. Some day she handles it better than others. Observe and see if there is any correlation between his desire to get into the room and whether in the next few hours or days he goes outside of the litter box. Especially given this from later in your post "The other night he peed in the bathtub, after meowing and scratching at the office door.". I am really starting to focus on his desire to be in there especially by the cockroaches since they are probably very fascinating especially to a cat. Now how we can solve it is trickier. We can;t really give him access as it isn't safe for the cockroaches and tarantulas. Cats really can get stressed not having access to tings that they had access to. So taking away territory (even when necessary) can cause cats issues. Let's think about how best to try to figure that office/animals out.

"Last night, when we were trying to sleep, he was meowing and stratching again and Monty would start chasing him until Cosmo was giving a growling concert and we had to break it up. Then he would go right back to scratching the door it was terrible. I didn't want to make too much fuss about it, to avoid Cosmo scratching the door for attention." - Again, he wants in there (either because he loves the room and loves to sleep in the places that he "owns" and "loves" and/or loves the animals).

And it is understandable that MOnty would then chase because "stuff" (scratching at the door and meowing) is "fun" to another cat and especially at night when cats can be very active it is a trigger to start some running around.

I think he comes back to Cosmo wanting to get into the office. So I am thinking of totally keeping him out of the office or trying in every way possible to secure the cockroaches and tarantulas so that no harm could come to them. It is tricky. Something we should try to figure out.

"No, Monty is just a god damn brat apart from the usual stuff he isn't supposed to do, which he does regardless, the Cosmo annoying stuff is the only thing he does." - Yep, a normal cat. I have two of my own like that.................. Cats like that are just happy having fun and that is how they do it. You should hear the fun chases and jumping around we have here. They just love it but it sounds so crazy and wild.

The other night he peed in the bathtub, after meowing and scratching at the office door.

"He has many comfy places he loves to sleep at, the cat tree in the bedroom right across the office, a cat cave right in the hallway where the office is, our bed." - Great.

"And I know he wants to either sleep on my office chair, in his cardboard box inside of the office or on the cat office table where we laid down a cozy blanket just for them " - So he is really loving the office. Again, it suggests closing of access is probably the source of the issues. Understandably to protect the other animals but some cats respond in a difficult way to losing territory. We saw Cosmo struggle with not having access to Monty so Cosmo seems to be especially sensitive to a lack of access (territory lost).

"I wouldn't mind giving him a box for the hallway, but I know that after a while, when he gets upset again, who knows because of what he'll go and pee in the box. He even peed in the scratch box I build for them, it was their favourite place to scratch." - Yes, he doesn't have access to the office and/or other animals so I would guess he would pee in the box in the hall if one was put there. Totally agree with you.

"And sleeping in the office is just not an option. My boyfriend trapped him in the office by accident a few days ago . And Cosmo threw my roaches from a shelve high up (everything was intact luckily) and stole my chocolate Easter bunny I kept in that shelve too." - I am not surprised. The office door was closed, correct? Cosmo was then feeling "trapped" and then threw a fit (understandably) as cats do not like territory (the rest of the house) "taken" away. Thank goodness the cockroaches were safe and Cosmo didn;t get ill from the bunny.

"He mad a little chaos and after that was happily asleep on my chair the whole night no door scratching, nothing. Not even when we were getting up in the morning." - Where was your chair located? Not in the office, correct? I am not surprised he settled down because the being trapped in the office was a bit traumatic and he had a little negative association and had no desire to repeat that situation. I am guessing he forgot about it the next day and wanted in the office again.

"I changed their feeding schedule to 4 times a day month ago, and their last meal is right before bedtime, so that would be a great opportunity to play with them." - Perfect!! Great!!!

"Yeah, I'm a little worried about that, since all shops and schools are allowed to open again. I suspect there will be a huge new wave coming" - Yes, agreed. Social distancing works well but it is hard when we get back to "normal". Mistakes will happen. Germany has done a good job so hopefully you can catch an outbreak, isolate the person and stop any spread. We'll see. We just need a vaccine to really be safe. Fingers crossed it happens sooner rather than later.

Just keep taking precautions. Masks, don't touch face, wash hands and surfaces, social distance, stay home as much as possible, etc.

Thank you. We are still staying at home totally. Getting everything delivered. Wiping things down and putting them aside when we can. Trying to do our part.

Stay safe!!

Let us know what you think of the above. I am thinking I know the reason why Cosmo has issues at times. It is the office access. How we solve it is tricky so we'll have to figure out something. I just don't get a sense it is Monty at all. Work on the chasing etc as it might help in general but I think the peeing is coming from the office situation. We'll see how it goes and adjust as needed.

I love your two cats. They are just so cool!!!

 

[RocketPuppy97]

Here are some products;
Feliway multicat may help, and there are these;

Only Natural Pet has a calming product called Just Relax Calming spray with essential oil (catnip oil).

There's this one, be sure and scroll all the way down the page;

http://[URL]http://www.bachflower.com/rescue-remedy-pets-bach-flower/

[/URL]

Also, there is ThunderWunders calming chews, Richard's Organic Pet Calm drops, Naturevet Hemp, HomeoPet Anxiety Relief, Head to Tail Calming, Relaxivet Quiet Moments Cat treats, GNC Calming formula, and there is Calm-o-mile, Natures Miracle calming spray, Vetri-Science's Composure is another item to look at, Pet Remedy - UK (it has valerian) is yet another, as is Essential Pet Pet-eze, Pet Organics No Stress, Only Natural Pet (brand and website) has other calming products, Pet Naturals also has one I believe, and there are others.

Lambert Vet Supply is a website to look at, and of course chewy, also there's Petwishpros, animaleo, 1-800-petmeds, Petco and PetSmart, and other pet stores.

There is also a product called a lickimat which could be helpful, as cats can be calmed by the process of licking.

http://[URL]http://foodpuzzlesforcats.com/the-lickimat

[/URL]

This post talks about some other products;

http://[URL]https://thecatsite.com/threads/calming-treats-for-a-very-picky-cat.361707/post-4543321

[/URL]

Thanks for the many suggestions! I'll do some research into what is avaible here in germany!
I've tried Bachflowers way back when we started, maybe that would be a good thing again.

"Cosmo becomes a little restless for like 5 minutes, then it's okay again. Until 5 minutes after that, Monty will get on his nerves again " - That is a fast rebound. It might suggest a little uncertainty since it is 5 minutes but it is a fast rebound. If Cosmo really viewed Monty as a threat he would definitely be acting differently for longer than this time amount.

I am leaning towards it being play. Monty shows no sign of wanting to hurt him and Cosmo's response suggests it isn't serious as well. I do get a sense Monty loves to have fun with him though Cosmo doesn't always like that much energy. You can try to distract in a positive way and see how they respond.

I'm just kind of confused by Cosmo hssing and growling at him.

"I would love for him to be able to sleep there, how he wants to, but it is really not possible I keep hissing cockroaches and I've lost count on how often he'll just throw the enclosure from the shelves. Apart from that, that's the only place where I can safely keep my tarantula enclosures." - I forgot about the other animals. He does seem fascinated with the cockroaches (I am guessing the sounds). I am really wondering if this is the source of the issues. Cosmo is sensitive and loves to be around others and I am wondering if he wants to be near them, around them and when he can't he acts up. Some day she handles it better than others. Observe and see if there is any correlation between his desire to get into the room and whether in the next few hours or days he goes outside of the litter box. Especially given this from later in your post "The other night he peed in the bathtub, after meowing and scratching at the office door.". I am really starting to focus on his desire to be in there especially by the cockroaches since they are probably very fascinating especially to a cat. Now how we can solve it is trickier. We can;t really give him access as it isn't safe for the cockroaches and tarantulas. Cats really can get stressed not having access to tings that they had access to. So taking away territory (even when necessary) can cause cats issues. Let's think about how best to try to figure that office/animals out.

I have one bigger enclosure in the bedroom (It's one big glas enclosure, so they can't throw it fown) and he can go there and watch them as much as he likes.
He'll be in the office all day, sleeping here and everything is fine. It's not just that he'll pee at night, most of the time he'll pee in the evening when he has access to the office and to us.

"He mad a little chaos and after that was happily asleep on my chair the whole night no door scratching, nothing. Not even when we were getting up in the morning." - Where was your chair located? Not in the office, correct? I am not surprised he settled down because the being trapped in the office was a bit traumatic and he had a little negative association and had no desire to repeat that situation. I am guessing he forgot about it the next day and wanted in the office again.

The odd thing is, Cosmo is very vocal. He'll scratch immidiatly when the bathroom door is closed, or the office door at night.
But he didn't even meow or scratch at the door when my boyfriend forgot him in there. As if he was okay with it and used his chance to look around the place where he's normally not allowed on the tables.
My chair was in the office and that's where he slept. Hell, he didn't even bother to get up as we were searching for him, calling him in other parts of the flat xD


Sorry for responding so late!

 

[calicosrspecial]

Thanks for the many suggestions! I'll do some research into what is avaible here in germany!
I've tried Bachflowers way back when we started, maybe that would be a good thing again.



I'm just kind of confused by Cosmo hssing and growling at him.




I have one bigger enclosure in the bedroom (It's one big glas enclosure, so they can't throw it fown) and he can go there and watch them as much as he likes.
He'll be in the office all day, sleeping here and everything is fine. It's not just that he'll pee at night, most of the time he'll pee in the evening when he has access to the office and to us.



The odd thing is, Cosmo is very vocal. He'll scratch immidiatly when the bathroom door is closed, or the office door at night.
But he didn't even meow or scratch at the door when my boyfriend forgot him in there. As if he was okay with it and used his chance to look around the place where he's normally not allowed on the tables.
My chair was in the office and that's where he slept. Hell, he didn't even bother to get up as we were searching for him, calling him in other parts of the flat xD


Sorry for responding so late!

No need to apologize. We know you are very busy.

"I'm just kind of confused by Cosmo hssing and growling at him." - I am not surprised. Cats will do that to all cats (even cats they love). It is just communication. Just like humans sometimes get upset with loved ones. The important and most telling thing is how the other cat responds and how they rebound after.

"It's not just that he'll pee at night, most of the time he'll pee in the evening when he has access to the office and to us." - I wonder if he gets stressed thinking about how it WILL be closed off "soon" for the night. Cosmos is smart so I would not be surprised.

"The odd thing is, Cosmo is very vocal. He'll scratch immidiatly when the bathroom door is closed, or the office door at night.
But he didn't even meow or scratch at the door when my boyfriend forgot him in there. As if he was okay with it and used his chance to look around the place where he's normally not allowed on the tables." - I think you have it exactly right. It was not having "only" access to it by being closed in (since he loves that room and the other pets) but when he DOESN'T have access that is when he gets stressed. Same with the bathroom door (which again is very normal - cats want to go where they aren't supposed to). This actually kind of supports my suspicions in my eyes.

"My chair was in the office and that's where he slept. Hell, he didn't even bother to get up as we were searching for him, calling him in other parts of the flat " - Yep, again, he LOVES it in there especially the chair. And I suspect he loves the pets.

I am really thinking it is about about the loss of access (and the anticipation).

I am guessing he is pretty fascinated with the big enclosure in the bedroom? For a cat hissing cockroaches and tarantulas are REALLY COOL.

Does it seem like Cosmo really loves the office? One of his favorite spots in the house?

How often does Monty go in the office (when it is available during the day)?

Not only is Cosmo super sensitive but he is really smart. Monty is smart as well but not as sensitive.

Everything I am reading is pointing me to the office territory.

What do you think?

 

[calicosrspecial]

Thanks for the many suggestions! I'll do some research into what is avaible here in germany!
I've tried Bachflowers way back when we started, maybe that would be a good thing again.



I'm just kind of confused by Cosmo hssing and growling at him.




I have one bigger enclosure in the bedroom (It's one big glas enclosure, so they can't throw it fown) and he can go there and watch them as much as he likes.
He'll be in the office all day, sleeping here and everything is fine. It's not just that he'll pee at night, most of the time he'll pee in the evening when he has access to the office and to us.



The odd thing is, Cosmo is very vocal. He'll scratch immidiatly when the bathroom door is closed, or the office door at night.
But he didn't even meow or scratch at the door when my boyfriend forgot him in there. As if he was okay with it and used his chance to look around the place where he's normally not allowed on the tables.
My chair was in the office and that's where he slept. Hell, he didn't even bother to get up as we were searching for him, calling him in other parts of the flat xD


Sorry for responding so late!

Hi,

I know you are busy but just wanted to check in and see how you all are doing. Hope you all are safe and doing well.

 

[RocketPuppy97]

Does it seem like Cosmo really loves the office? One of his favorite spots in the house?

He likes being in there, because we and especially my bf spent alot of time in there. He normally is laying somewhere in the office or in the hallway in front of the office.

How often does Monty go in the office (when it is available during the day)?

I would say as much as Cosmo does, a little less the last few weeks I would say. Since cosmo likes laying on us more he'll often lay on my bfs lap and Monty will play the little independent one who doesn't need us until he wants his after dinner cuddles from my bf.



We had one or two peeing incidents since the last post. One was inside a cardboard box on a pillow, it didn't smell nasty right away, so we noticed the pee a few days later, and that was really gross.

My bf trys playing with them more often when I'm at work and we try to talk to cosmo when he's upset meowing in the hallway and we suspect he could pee again.

Some nights he'll scratch at the office door, some nights he won't.

And thank you for your concern! I completely forgot to post my response! We are all alive and well here! I hope you are okay as well!

 

[calicosrspecial]

He likes being in there, because we and especially my bf spent alot of time in there. He normally is laying somewhere in the office or in the hallway in front of the office.



I would say as much as Cosmo does, a little less the last few weeks I would say. Since cosmo likes laying on us more he'll often lay on my bfs lap and Monty will play the little independent one who doesn't need us until he wants his after dinner cuddles from my bf.



We had one or two peeing incidents since the last post. One was inside a cardboard box on a pillow, it didn't smell nasty right away, so we noticed the pee a few days later, and that was really gross.

My bf trys playing with them more often when I'm at work and we try to talk to cosmo when he's upset meowing in the hallway and we suspect he could pee again.

Some nights he'll scratch at the office door, some nights he won't.

And thank you for your concern! I completely forgot to post my response! We are all alive and well here! I hope you are okay as well!

I am so glad you all are well. Staying safe. Whew, I will admit, I was a little worried. :/ Germany has done well but opening up is kinda scary.

"He likes being in there, because we and especially my bf spent alot of time in there. He normally is laying somewhere in the office or in the hallway in front of the office." - Things are making more sense. I think it is most likely his intense ownership of that territory and then not having access at times (for good reasons) which then causes him issues.

Hehehehe, Monty, I can totally see him doing that.

"We had one or two peeing incidents since the last post. One was inside a cardboard box on a pillow, it didn't smell nasty right away, so we noticed the pee a few days later, and that was really gross." - That one sounds like he confused it with a litter box. A box with something soft in it. "Seems like a good place to go".

"My bf trys playing with them more often when I'm at work and we try to talk to cosmo when he's upset meowing in the hallway and we suspect he could pee again." - Perfect. Well done!!! Reassuring him, easing his angst. That is very good. Exactly what i would do. That should help.

"Some nights he'll scratch at the office door, some nights he won't." - Makes sense. Try to see if there is anything that happens before to suggest he might be interested in getting in there (scratching). I think it is jsut the way cats are. Sometimes they really just like a certain place and sometimes it isn't that important.

I do get a sense it is a territorial access thing. Cats are territorial so anytime territory (the office) is taken away for some time it can cause some frustration, stress, etc and lead to a peeing incident.

Thank you for the update!! So glad you all are safe and the cats are doing well. Stay safe!!!

 

[calicosrspecial]

He likes being in there, because we and especially my bf spent alot of time in there. He normally is laying somewhere in the office or in the hallway in front of the office.



I would say as much as Cosmo does, a little less the last few weeks I would say. Since cosmo likes laying on us more he'll often lay on my bfs lap and Monty will play the little independent one who doesn't need us until he wants his after dinner cuddles from my bf.



We had one or two peeing incidents since the last post. One was inside a cardboard box on a pillow, it didn't smell nasty right away, so we noticed the pee a few days later, and that was really gross.

My bf trys playing with them more often when I'm at work and we try to talk to cosmo when he's upset meowing in the hallway and we suspect he could pee again.

Some nights he'll scratch at the office door, some nights he won't.

And thank you for your concern! I completely forgot to post my response! We are all alive and well here! I hope you are okay as well!

Hi,

I was just thinking about you all.

I am so glad Germany is doing better with Covid.

How are Cosmo and Monty doing? I just checked the instagram posts. They are just so adorable. I miss them!!

I have to say, whoever took those photos is a genius photographer. They are amazing photos.

Hope all is well. Take good care.

 

[calicosrspecial]

He likes being in there, because we and especially my bf spent alot of time in there. He normally is laying somewhere in the office or in the hallway in front of the office.



I would say as much as Cosmo does, a little less the last few weeks I would say. Since cosmo likes laying on us more he'll often lay on my bfs lap and Monty will play the little independent one who doesn't need us until he wants his after dinner cuddles from my bf.



We had one or two peeing incidents since the last post. One was inside a cardboard box on a pillow, it didn't smell nasty right away, so we noticed the pee a few days later, and that was really gross.

My bf trys playing with them more often when I'm at work and we try to talk to cosmo when he's upset meowing in the hallway and we suspect he could pee again.

Some nights he'll scratch at the office door, some nights he won't.

And thank you for your concern! I completely forgot to post my response! We are all alive and well here! I hope you are okay as well!

How are you and everyone doing?

I am worried about you all with Covid spiking in Germany. I hope you all are staying safe.

I miss Cosmo and Monty. They are so adorable.

Take good care of everyone. Please stay safe.