Since it is both illegal and dangerous to let Cats outside unattended, I don't quite follow the "Hunting" argument. My cats are well fed and don't need to Hunt. They wear a bell so that no one steps on them. Their collar is a bit of a fashion statement, but mostly so that they can wear a tag telling where they belong in the unlikely event that they get out without me. In fact, their tag says "If I am out, I am lost".
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cat collars and bells cruel?
- Thread starter russiankitten
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My cats both don't wear their collars they are indoor only cats. I bought glitzy collars with bells on them but after I buckle them on they get all crazy trying to pull them off. Wish I could get them acclimated to the collars! They are really cute collars.
Dangerous? Definitely. Illegal? Not where I live.
I've tried (unsuccessfully) to convince neighbors to keep their cats safely indoors, but there is no law saying they have to.
Margret
The fact that your cats don't need to hunt is neither here nor there. Hunting is in their nature. If they're not hungry they won't eat their prey.
So, are you advocating that they not only be Outside (illegal and dangerous) and hunt for prey only to have another creature die for their amusement?
That's what toys are for. My 2 cats are happy, healthy and well cared for; different point of view.
That's what toys are for. My 2 cats are happy, healthy and well cared for; different point of view.
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No matter how well fed a cat is, it will need to expend energy either hunting or in hunting exercises. Also, I don't know where you live, but it's not illegal to let cats outside unattended here.
I amight certainly not advocating that cats be allowed out God forbid. Mine certainly don't but were they to go out they would hunt. In England our cat was outside in the garden and disgustingly caught birds. She certainly didn't need to. I was just tryingoing to make a point.
Do you live in Australia?
No, I do not live in Australia; Central Illinois.
My cats (one boy, one girl, littermates) run and play an tussel.
And, they have a large screened porch from which they observe plenty of nature.
Vets exact words "they are very well muscled".
My first two lived to be about 21 years old.
After them, my next pair, about 15 years.
These two are 4.5 yrs old.
My cats (one boy, one girl, littermates) run and play an tussel.
And, they have a large screened porch from which they observe plenty of nature.
Vets exact words "they are very well muscled".
My first two lived to be about 21 years old.
After them, my next pair, about 15 years.
These two are 4.5 yrs old.
I don't know where you live that it's NOT illegal to let cats unattended. It is illegal in the Dallas/Ft. Worth/Denton area in Texas. (As I said a while back in this thread.) That's probably the law statewide as well, but I've not done research on other counties. And as KJCook also said, enforcement is mostly "Complaint Driven". I suspect it is the same in most urban/suburban cities in the USA as well. Rural areas are likely less strict.
My 3 cats still wear collars as indoor cats. It doesn't interfere with play hunting. A toy mouse or feather bird toy aren't scared off by a little tickling bell. It does alert a cat that another is approaching its "territory" if it doesn't want to be bothered because they often like to play hunt with each other. So the bell collars are for my peace of mind and their safety even as indoor cats.
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Where I live its is not illegal for cats to be outdoors, unattended. The city ordinance states that it is a cats nature to roam and hunt. Animal control will not respond to cat calls. Dogs on the other hand are meant to be fenced or leashed. We are big on off leash dog parks here, but you are meant to control them at all other times whether by leash, fence, whatever... dog at large are not well tolerated. I think the biggest difference is that cats (generally) do not go around biting people unprovoked, and cats help conrol the rodent population (rodents spread disease). . Dog attacks on the other hand are more frequent, and do MUCH more damage to humans. (I think birds and mice would disagree).
Collars and bells cruel? I guess thats up to the cat. Some don't seem to mind them. Mine don't wear them, but we do put them in a harness when we go outside. A regular collar wouldn't stand a chance. I think it is the same how some women feel naked without a necklace or a bracelet. as for me, I cannot wear any jewlery. Not even ear rings. My skin is very sensitive to metal and I break out really bad. As such, it just doesn't appeal to me to put it on my pets. My daughter on the other hand loves jewelry, for her and for the cats.
So as someone said, cat collars must be breakaway for their safety, whether they are indoors or out, cats like to climb, and squeeze through small spaces and getting their collar stuck and chocking themselves is a real possibility. If you put a breakaway collar on my cats, they WILL figure out how to break it away.
Collars and bells cruel? I guess thats up to the cat. Some don't seem to mind them. Mine don't wear them, but we do put them in a harness when we go outside. A regular collar wouldn't stand a chance. I think it is the same how some women feel naked without a necklace or a bracelet. as for me, I cannot wear any jewlery. Not even ear rings. My skin is very sensitive to metal and I break out really bad. As such, it just doesn't appeal to me to put it on my pets. My daughter on the other hand loves jewelry, for her and for the cats.
So as someone said, cat collars must be breakaway for their safety, whether they are indoors or out, cats like to climb, and squeeze through small spaces and getting their collar stuck and chocking themselves is a real possibility. If you put a breakaway collar on my cats, they WILL figure out how to break it away.
There's no reason why they shouldn't live long lives. Indoor cats do.
My lotto was 19 and gentle 16.
My two are younger than yours. One is an abandoned siamese and the other a black and white street cat. They behave like litter mates.
So no misunderstandings between us?
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You do realize that this site is used by people not only all over the United States, but in other countries as well? And, FYI, I live South Carolina and it is, I repeat, not illegal to let cats out unattended here.
It seems like you thought I was trying to start an argument which wasn't my intention, but it's the internet and I could be taking your tone wrong as I feel you did mine. You said the same thing, "I don't know where you live" to KJCook which I why I said, "I don't know where you live that it not illegal" to you. I didn't state any of my views above as fact other than what I know to be true in my area. And yes, I do realize TCS has many wonderful members all over the the US and in many other countries. I know other countries have different laws. Obviously, now I see different states do too on this subject. But I still think that in the US it's probably more common for it to be illegal for cats (and dogs) to be out unattended than it is for it to be legal.
Legal or not to have a cat unattended outside is each communities choice. I have had indoor/outdoor cats all my life. Mine do not wear a collar and do not have a microchip. That may be irresponsible for most people but I believe that cats are free roaming creatures. I keep their shots up to date and I have them fixed. They know where home is and know what time they get fed. I love my cats and had an outside cat with a collar on and he died because the collar got hung on the underbrush of the woods behind our house. I will not put one on any of my cats because of this.
As far as hunting; mine do that all the time. They are fed very well and love eating. They do not kill to eat. They do, in fact, kill to bring home for me to see how good they are at hunting. I guess since I feed them so well they want to make sure they feed me just as well. I don't care to eat moles or rats so I thank them, pet and love them and when their backs are turned my "gift" is thrown in the trash.
Hunting is as natural to cats (whether it's live animals outside or toys or each other inside) as walking or sleeping. It's something they have done since creation. It's not a bad thing, it's how they learn.
As far as hunting; mine do that all the time. They are fed very well and love eating. They do not kill to eat. They do, in fact, kill to bring home for me to see how good they are at hunting. I guess since I feed them so well they want to make sure they feed me just as well. I don't care to eat moles or rats so I thank them, pet and love them and when their backs are turned my "gift" is thrown in the trash.
Hunting is as natural to cats (whether it's live animals outside or toys or each other inside) as walking or sleeping. It's something they have done since creation. It's not a bad thing, it's how they learn.
That is very true but I personally don't think a law like that is a good one because A) Stuff happens. Animals get out by accident and get picked up by animal control or whoever and sometimes never make it home for a variety of reasons. B) Ferals obviously live outside and this this just makes their already difficult lives harder
I respect your right to raise your cats anyway you see fit. They sound very healthy and happy. I could never do that though. I do frequent head counts now just to make sure they are all OK and they are always inside. I would be a nervous wreck if they were outside. I'd constantly have visions in my head of every horrible thing that could happen to them going on at once and then my head would explode. Who would feed them then?
I also have a fairly busy street in front of the house and a VERY busy street in back. There are no street lights on the one in back. The trucks that carry citrus from the groves to the packing houses and out to I-95 (which I can see from my driveway) treat that road like it's a racetrack. Add 3 black cats to that, 2 who are quite small, and you have a recipe for disaster.
My HOA also has a zero tolerance policy for any animal out unattended. Dog, cat, collar or no collar, they call AC to come get them.
They have to make do with the screened in porch that is out back. I have chairs and 2 big tables out there that they can lounge on and get fresh air. There are plenty of small lizards that come in that they love to chase. They have never caught one that I know of. It's more about the chase for them. The lizards are lightning fast though.
I luckily live in a very rural area and live off the main road so my cats have 5 acres to roam around in.
Yeah. That sounds nice and peaceful. I wouldn't hate that a bit.
I'd still keep them inside though. I'd be paranoid about birds, dogs, raccoons and nasty people doing bad things to them. We have tons of hawks and vultures (not to mention gators, snakes, poisonous toads and lizards) here in Florida. I'd imagine the birds waiting to swoop in on my 5 pound Sophie the minute she walked out the door.
Sophie? you're OK... Good. gotta go find Lilith. You're OK?.. good. gotta go find Henry.. You're OK. Good. Now I better go back and check on Sophie again because something could have happened while I was looking for the other 2.
Put that on a continuous loop until I had a nervous breakdown or gave up and brought them back in.
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There are risks to having cats that are both indoor and outdoor, as well as other problems. I think one of the reasons that my state doesn't have a law like that is because there are a lot of farms around here with "working cats"--cats whose sole purpose is to take care of rodents and other pests that might be nibbling on the crops. I also might be a little sensitive since I've been banging my head against a glass ceiling while dealing with arrogant and idiotic veterinarians who believe a "pretty little thing" like me doesn't need to worry her head about such niceties as: a) what the vet actually intends to do during surgery, b) why the vet can't put two names on an identification microchip, and c) side effects (because there are always side effects) of various vaccinations--especially the ones they want me to give the cats that aren't required by law or common sense (like the rabies vaccination). And the worse part is if the SPCA clinic would just freaking re-open I wouldn't have to deal with these idiots!
Here's a couple data points if anyone is interested:
Note, all cats were/are inside the house only in my case. They never ever go outside.
Several years ago we brought in an additional cat to live with Amber, my cat who had lived alone with just me for 10 years. You can imagine this didn't go over too well, but the other cat was from someone who could no longer car for her. This cat was about 14 years old and we believe also lived at least most of her life as an only cat. They lived in the same house for about 3 years until the older cat succumbed to various diseases, and they never did get along. One of the things I tried was to put a bell collar on Amber, because she would stalk the intruder cat so to speak. Well, this lasted about a day. To me, for Amber, that collar with a bell was cruel. You could tell she was purposely staying still so as not to hear the noise. I'm sure many young cats get used to it fine, but for an old set in her ways cat, it just wasn't going to work. Even the collar plain was really annoying to her so I let it go. She wasn't even chipped I realize, but after so many years I knew she wasn't going to get out. I didn't like it, but I let it be.
Fast forward about 5 years, several months after Amber died we brought home two 4 year old cats from the shelter. The shelter asks that we keep collars on the cats despite them being chipped and inside only, so I figured it was a good excuse to roll with that plan. They're also both all black and earlier on (and occasionally still!) were hard to tell apart, so two different color collars helped us do that. They came home with some collars and tags and seemed to be okay wearing those. The dangling tags were bothering me, getting in the way of the food bowl and potentially snagging on things, so eventually when I got the collars I wanted we left all of those off and got collar tags from Boomerang Tags. This is a piece of metal just a little wider than the collar and it attaches and lays flat against the collar. Can attest that for nearly 2 years it has never fallen off (it's guaranteed not to). It doesn't have room for a lot of info (if you need more info, you can always put two), and I wanted what info there was to be as large as possible, so we put the cat's name, I AM LOST, and phone number. Because if anyone catches the escaped cat and reads that, I want it to be clear that the cat is lost. We can hope that is clear enough anyway! Most likely it will never come into play; they aren't escape artists or door rushers. But it's better to be safe.
I did not consider putting bells on the new cats. Although it is probably not a huge deal for them, my memory of what it did to Amber makes it seem like a bad idea which is just not necessary for these two indoor cats.
Note, all cats were/are inside the house only in my case. They never ever go outside.
Several years ago we brought in an additional cat to live with Amber, my cat who had lived alone with just me for 10 years. You can imagine this didn't go over too well, but the other cat was from someone who could no longer car for her. This cat was about 14 years old and we believe also lived at least most of her life as an only cat. They lived in the same house for about 3 years until the older cat succumbed to various diseases, and they never did get along. One of the things I tried was to put a bell collar on Amber, because she would stalk the intruder cat so to speak. Well, this lasted about a day. To me, for Amber, that collar with a bell was cruel. You could tell she was purposely staying still so as not to hear the noise. I'm sure many young cats get used to it fine, but for an old set in her ways cat, it just wasn't going to work. Even the collar plain was really annoying to her so I let it go. She wasn't even chipped I realize, but after so many years I knew she wasn't going to get out. I didn't like it, but I let it be.
Fast forward about 5 years, several months after Amber died we brought home two 4 year old cats from the shelter. The shelter asks that we keep collars on the cats despite them being chipped and inside only, so I figured it was a good excuse to roll with that plan. They're also both all black and earlier on (and occasionally still!) were hard to tell apart, so two different color collars helped us do that. They came home with some collars and tags and seemed to be okay wearing those. The dangling tags were bothering me, getting in the way of the food bowl and potentially snagging on things, so eventually when I got the collars I wanted we left all of those off and got collar tags from Boomerang Tags. This is a piece of metal just a little wider than the collar and it attaches and lays flat against the collar. Can attest that for nearly 2 years it has never fallen off (it's guaranteed not to). It doesn't have room for a lot of info (if you need more info, you can always put two), and I wanted what info there was to be as large as possible, so we put the cat's name, I AM LOST, and phone number. Because if anyone catches the escaped cat and reads that, I want it to be clear that the cat is lost. We can hope that is clear enough anyway! Most likely it will never come into play; they aren't escape artists or door rushers. But it's better to be safe.
I did not consider putting bells on the new cats. Although it is probably not a huge deal for them, my memory of what it did to Amber makes it seem like a bad idea which is just not necessary for these two indoor cats.
