Carrageenan/agar Agar

Rini

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What's the deal with these ingredients exactly? Though I've done my own research, I am still a bit confused.

Especially because at least one of these two ingredients seems to be in absolutely everything one way or the other. I recently purchased a case of Merrick Purrfect Bistro Turducken for Aslan, and he's a big fan, but I did find out it has carrageenan in it and now I want to to throw the whole 30 dollar case away.

Which one is worse in your opinion, because I doubt I'll be able to avoid both and stay in budget/what he'll actually eat :sigh:

None of the foods in his main rotation have carrageenan or (or do they? Nutro Cuts in Gravy, Tiki Cat After Dark, Wellness pate, Weruva CITK cans and pouches, FF classic pate poultry pack) but some of them do have agar agar.

I usually add in a new flavor every month and I was thinking of swapping the Purrfect Bistro flavors...but not if they're bad for him. Not at that price! :angrywoman:

Thanks guys, for explaining why you either do/don't avoid these ingredients.
 

She's a witch

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if I could, I'd avoid any gums, because I want them to eat only ingredients that contribute to their health and not the ones that create potential risks (even small) or are simply fillers. But this is hardly possible as almost all cans have some sort of gums for reasons unknown to me (I don't buy texture/palatability argument). So the way I see it, I choose the food with gums that don't create any visible issues for my cats. Sadly, my cat has softer stools after both carrageenan and agar agar so I don't give it to him.
 
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KarenKat

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My understanding is that both carrageenan and agar-agar are seaweed based thickening agents used in pet food and people food. There were studies done that identified carrageenan causes intestinal inflammation in dogs, and most people I think extrapolate that to assume cats. Agar-agar is newer with less studies, but it is derived from the same seaweed.

I try to avoid both and mix in foods that don’t have it if I have some that do. It is super hard to avoid.
 

Rummy

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if I could, I'd avoid any gums, because I want them to eat only ingredients that contribute to their health and not the ones that create potential risks (even small) or are simply fillers. But this is hardly possible as almost all cans have some sort of gums for reasons unknown to me (I don't buy
Have you seen the wet foods that have no thickeners in them? They're loose and watery which is great for some cats, but there are definitely some cats that prefer a thicker texture. Cats are ALL about mouth feel, some more so than others.

Hopefully they'll find a 100% proven safe thickener someday though! Cause I know my boy is not a fan of the runny stuff.

Not sure where you live, Rini, but if you're looking for a thickener free food there is First Mate you can try!
 

Rummy

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LOL sorry, I'm on my mobile, no idea what happened with the formatting there! I'd fix it but I don't think you can edit them?
 

She's a witch

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Have you seen the wet foods that have no thickeners in them? They're loose and watery which is great for some cats, but there are definitely some cats that prefer a thicker texture. Cats are ALL about mouth feel, some more so than others.

Hopefully they'll find a 100% proven safe thickener someday though! Cause I know my boy is not a fan of the runny stuff.
The thing is that back in Europe, I used to buy high quality pate food (Grau, Granata Pet, Power of Nature, Catz Finefood) that had no gums whatsoever. None of it was runny. That's why I simply cannot understand why American manufacturers say the gums are necessary.
 

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The thing is that back in Europe, I used to buy high quality pate food (Grau, Granata Pet, Power of Nature, Catz Finefood) that had no gums whatsoever. None of it was runny. That's why I simply cannot understand why American manufacturers say the gums are necessary.
Interesting! I'd be curious to try them myself.
 

KarenKat

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There are gum free foods here, it’s just rare and they are more expensive. Rawz, Life’s Abundance, Feline Natural, Caru. I wish they didn’t have them either
 
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Rini

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There are gum free foods here, it’s just rare and they are more expensive. Rawz, Life’s Abundance, Feline Natural, Caru. I wish they didn’t have them either
What I don't understand about gums is, it seems like there are many different kinds. Are they all created equal? Equally bad?
 

GalaxyGirl

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My cats have food allergies. They are only allergic to the thickeners. The only thickener they can have it agar agar. It isn't made the same way as carrageenan.
Therefore I don't think its such an issue as the other gums. Its very hard to find foods that don't have it. They also tend to be expensive.

The other foods that don't have them is Nature's Logic and Instinct Original which use clay and can constipate some cats. There is also a brand people don't seem to know here which is from Canada called

KASIKS. They use pea starch instead. The cat and dog are the same formulation so it might be easier to find that.

Also Don't forget ZiwiPeak!
 

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Kasiks and First Mate are the same company btw, like I said, it IS runny but it'd worth a shot! Good price too.
 

She's a witch

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There are gum free foods here, it’s just rare and they are more expensive. Rawz, Life’s Abundance, Feline Natural, Caru. I wish they didn’t have them either
I feed some of them, but I need to rotate so I use some with gums also (I didn't know about Caru, thanks, although mine seem to accept pate only, I'll try this). The thing is that even if they don't use gums, they use flaxseed, fenugreek seeds, clay, peas (like ZiwiPeak - thank you, but my cats don't need chickpeas). And if I spend that much money on the food when I buy Rawz etc, I'd expect the food to have only ingredients that enrich my cats' health, and I'm not sure if cats really need any kind of seeds etc. But anyway, I've had my share of venting about it on this forum, so I should stop now, not to bring my frustration up again :D In a weird way, I'm grateful to all these gums as that was my final motivation to feed my cats raw.
 

darg

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I feed some Rawz Turkey and it is gum free. The Stella and Chewy's Turkey pate that I mostly feed has agar. The agar doesn't bother my cats IBD. I'm not 100% sure on whether Carageenan bothers him but I've been avoiding it. Both expensive foods.
 

KittyCatCove

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I was a food scientist in my former life. I used to work at a company that produced these gums and many other food texturizers.

As someone said above, they are seaweed based hydrocolloids that add viscosity and texture to the food. They are used a low levels and are pretty much harmless, especially at basic/neutral pH levels. You most likely eat them every week and don't even realize it.
 

LTS3

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So are the gums just what's on top of the food or is it mixed it?

The jelly in some foods is aspic aka gelatain. Think chunks of meat in basically jello. Gums are mixed throughout the food as a sort of thickener.
 

daftcat75

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I was a food scientist in my former life. I used to work at a company that produced these gums and many other food texturizers.

As someone said above, they are seaweed based hydrocolloids that add viscosity and texture to the food. They are used a low levels and are pretty much harmless, especially at basic/neutral pH levels. You most likely eat them every week and don't even realize it.
Cats are not tiny people! This is the one of the most frustrating things about shopping for food for cats--the belief that if it's healthy (or safe) for people, it must also be healthy (or safe) for cats. Who cares how much agar agar I eat if it's going to cause distress in my cat every time? I'm not entirely certain it doesn't cause distress in me either for that matter.

Xanthan gum runs through my cat like a river. Agar agar gives her visible distress. I won't even try carageenan because if there's a chance it is an irritant to her GI, she doesn't need any more damage in that department. I would say there are hundreds of cats represented on these forums alone that would disagree with the harmless assessment.

What happens to that "pretty much harmless" in highly acidic environments like a cat's digestion?
 
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