Best way to store and warm up raw food?

[lehighluke]

I have been feeding my kittens raw, as a newbie for a few weeks now, and I consider myself a serious player as I have invested in a tasin grinder, all of the supps, a 7 cu.ft. Chest freezer, and a recent order of 40 lbs of rabbit from hare today. This is an expensive hobby, lol.

Now I am contemplating my packaging method, which I think is inefficient. The 2 kittens are eating 1lb of food a day collectively, so From my last batch, I bagged 1 lb portions in ziplock bags and froze them flattened out. Every morning I pull a frozen bag for the next day...I let it thaw in the fridge. Every morning I take the already thawed bag (pulled yesterday) and portion that into 4 separate bags for the 4 daily meals (kittens, lol). Then I warm the food in a bag under hot tap water until it is mouse temp. Even if I only had 2 meals a day when they grow up...it is still a lot of bags and a lot of transferring of food from container to container, which involves some loss of food, and mess.

Is there a better way? I thought of canning jars and glad plastic containers, but that would make re-heating a lot more difficult, no? In fact, is there any other effective way to heat the food up besides what I'm doing?

I don't mind the work, but for instance, I had my mom cat-sit for me last weekend when I was away, and the instructions I had to leave her were ridiculous. It makes me look like a crazy person. Is there a simpler, better way to do this?

 

[ritz]

Yeah, I hear/heart you.  In my kitchen I have a drawer that slides in and out for easy access to--not heavy pots and pans as the manufacturer originally intended but for all my raw food equipment, mainly rubbermaid type containers.

Are your kittens particularly sensitive to cool foods?  Ritz will eat food out of the refrigerator without any problems, though she won't eat food with ice crytals in it.  You could take the food out of the refrigerator about 30 minutes before serving to warm up to room temperature.  I do that all the time with babyfood for Ritz (that's what I put some medicine and supplements in).

Have you considered using reusable rubbermaid type containers?  It might cut down on the number of packages you have to deal with.  You can probably by now eyeball four equal portions, so I don't see the need to further subdivide it.

Ice cube trays *might* work for you if you can stack them; each cube holds around one oz of food, and would defrost much quicker than a four oz slab.  Just some ideas FWIW.

 

[lehighluke]

Hmmm...not warming it up is a decent idea....that is honestly the biggest pain of the daily process. Dr Pierson says to heat it up to "mouse temperature"....but maybe it's not necessary. I have only heated it up so far...but I bet if I start heating it less and less, they'll get used to it. Then I could package in containers, not bags...and portion by eye for the meals.

A better question for catsite folks....anyone else out there go to the trouble of heating it up like me? Maybe I'm the only sucker that hasn't wised up to just giving it to them cold

 

[ritz]

Actually, heating the food could destroy/lessen some of the vitamins and minerals.

I do defrost the breakfast batch (3:30 a.m.) a bit, just enough to get rid of the ice crystals.  But I know some cats are very intolerant of cool/cold food.  You'll have to experiment.

I think a short time out of the refrigerator should be enough.  If your cats aren't impatient/starvin' marvin, and you drink hot coffee/tea or have a gas pilot oven:  put the portion in a bowl and stick it in the microwave/oven.  The heat remaining in the microwave/gas oven should warm it slightly.

Oh, what we go through for our loved ones!  And then there are the humans we have to please!

 

[mschauer]

I have been feeding my kittens raw, as a newbie for a few weeks now, and I consider myself a serious player as I have invested in a tasin grinder, all of the supps, a 7 cu.ft. Chest freezer, and a recent order of 40 lbs of rabbit from hare today. This is an expensive hobby, lol.

Now I am contemplating my packaging method, which I think is inefficient. The 2 kittens are eating 1lb of food a day collectively, so From my last batch, I bagged 1 lb portions in ziplock bags and froze them flattened out. Every morning I pull a frozen bag for the next day...I let it thaw in the fridge. Every morning I take the already thawed bag (pulled yesterday) and portion that into 4 separate bags for the 4 daily meals (kittens, lol). Then I warm the food in a bag under hot tap water until it is mouse temp. Even if I only had 2 meals a day when they grow up...it is still a lot of bags and a lot of transferring of food from container to container, which involves some loss of food, and mess.

Is there a better way? I thought of canning jars and glad plastic containers, but that would make re-heating a lot more difficult, no? In fact, is there any other effective way to heat the food up besides what I'm doing?

 

[ravencorbie]

Every morning I pull a frozen bag for the next day...I let it thaw in the fridge. Every morning I take the already thawed bag (pulled yesterday) and portion that into 4 separate bags for the 4 daily meals (kittens, lol).

I only have one cat, but I really like the fact that the commercial raw I'm feeding already comes with the right amount per "section" to equal a meal.  I take three out (she eats 3 times a day) and put them in a glass Pyrex container.  So, I guess my question is:  why don't you originally package them in the four meals?  That way, you wouldn't have to portion the one bag into 4 separate bags after defrosting.  Obviously, with the already frozen ones, you don't have much choice, but for the future, I'd separate them right away in the smaller portions so you don't have to do that extra step.

 

[lehighluke]

I only have one cat, but I really like the fact that the commercial raw I'm feeding already comes with the right amount per "section" to equal a meal.  I take three out (she eats 3 times a day) and put them in a glass Pyrex container.  So, I guess my question is:  why don't you originally package them in the four meals?  That way, you wouldn't have to portion the one bag into 4 separate bags after defrosting.  Obviously, with the already frozen ones, you don't have much choice, but for the future, I'd separate them right away in the smaller portions so you don't have to do that extra step.

For a couple reasons I guess. 1st, making raw food is enough work, and bagging even in 1lb bags takes a long time...that would be almost 4x the bagging work. Also, as growing kittens, I don't really know how their per meal portions will change, but I do know that it will change. Also, it will sound crazy, but I try not to throw away the bags after a single use, but I try to use them 2 or 3 times before tossing to reduce waste...I rinse them off in between uses. Preportioning would prevent me from re-using the bags

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

Mine like it cold.  They eat it right out of the fridge.  And I freeze the ground stuff in BPH free plastic containers that stack nicely in the freezer.  I'll put some of the ground in larger containers (that stack), and some in smaller containers.  Then when I start running out of the smaller containers, I will partially defrost a larger one and portion it into 3 smaller ones and leave one in the fridge and refreeze the other two.  BTW, it takes the one cat who eats the ground stuff approx 2 days to eat the amount of one of the smaller containers. 

For the frankenprey, I portion it up and freeze it in snack size ziploc bags, then put those little bags into freezer bags, each marked with what the meat is that's inside.  Then every day I grab a snack sized bag of one of two of the different proteins out of the freezer bags and put in the fridge (always in a container since those snack bags sometimes leak

) 

I do NOT measure what I portion into the snack size bags before freezing, not do I measure what I put in the plastic containers before freezing.  I measure as I'm serving it up.  This is probably not the best thing to do, but it's my system non the less

. 

What I like about using the plastic containers is that I can just wash them up when I'm washing their dishes, then reuse them again and again as opposed to throwing out the plastic bags used for the Frankenprey.  But since I serve up several different meats  in a day for the Frankenprey, I don't want to use the plastic containers because I'm not sure the meats would get eaten timely. (hope that makes sense)

 

[kittenlove]

I used to freeze in quart containers. As needed, I would thaw a quart and refreeze in ice cube trays. My kitty was diabetic and needed frequent, small meals, so I would take out a couple of cubes for each meal. They thawed quickly and she didn't mind cool or cold food. If I needed to thaw out faster, 30 seconds in the micro did the trick. Also, I left the frozen cubes out for meals when I couldn't be home. They were ready for her when it was her meal time.

 

[cheeto-moe]

I used to just buy meat from the store. Anything they would eat chicken, turkey, livers, ground chicken backs, salmon, tuna beef hearts. Even lean hearts. Id buy a few pkgs at the grocery store, bring it home separate it, cut it so each pkg went into a sandwich bag. Tied it, and tossed it in a box in my freezer. Then you just take a nice variety. Like organ, muscle, bone, and meat. It's easy to unthaw in warm water three separate smaller frozen bags. cube the meat the liver could be sliced a bit. Cats love to chew. Its good for their teeth. My one cat Moe likes to play with a piece of meat tossing it like a toy. He eats it. I fed my boys raw up until they were fixed. No shots or vaccines. They are 2 very handsome buff kitties that look like lions not cats! It's worth it! I always left a bowl of a good cat food out in case they lacked a vitamin from the raw. Occasional canned food. We are slowly getting back to the raw, as we slid off the wagon a bit after Moe and Cheeto had the stuff in the purple bag. Anyway I found it to be just as cheap as cat food. It's the time that costs but even that, an hour on Sunday bagging is not so tough. The result is a lower vet bill...

 

[meranaldar]

At first my cat wouldn't eat it cold, so I warmed it up by sitting the plate in some warm water, though now she doesn't seem to mind it cold. I just take it out of the fridge and generally let it sit for 10 minutes or so before giving it to her. I only use the warm water if it hasn't quite thawed properly in the fridge.

For storing, I've been trying to think of a better way of doing it with less waste too.

I feed frankenprey, and I've been cutting up into meal sized portions (37-40g) then putting each on a little square of plastic wrap (I try to cut it so there's enough to wrap it, but not too much excess), then I've been putting those into plastic bags labeled with the date and what it is (most goes into vacuum seal bags since I feed a large variety of meats so what I buy generally lasts a long time, and I figure it'll keep better over longer periods that way, or ziplock bags for the portions I'll use fairly quickly).

Those all go into cloth bags (which I get from buying flour and oats in 5kg lots, I just like them because they don't break down in the freezer like plastic bags do over time), a bag for each animal. So I have one for chicken, lamb, cow, etc. Then each Sunday I just pull out each cloth bag one at a time and divide into 7 plastic containers with the days of the week on them according to a feeding schedule I made. So each day I just pull out the appropriate container for the following day, and then unwrap the bit of meat, put it on a plate and give it to my cat.

The plastic wrap gets thrown out after using (the wasteful part I don't like), but the plastic bags I wash up like dishes and reuse, and plan to continue to do so until they start falling apart.

For me to store every meal portion in it's own bag would be a LOT of bags, and a lot of washing up. Plus the bags don't pack as well as the plastic wrapped portions. But perhaps it's something I should consider.

I've also wondered recently whether I should try putting the portions of meat on a tray, freezing, then putting the frozen pieces in a bag. Just leaving out the plastic wrap. The problem there is having the freezer space to lay it out like that to begin with.

 

[ritz]

I've kind of done the putting the portions of [organ] on a try and freezing and then putting the frozen pieces in a bag, thing.  Instead of a tray, I use an ICE CUBE tray.  Each cube holds around 1 oz.  This works best for liver/organs.

 

[lehighluke]

I've started microwaving the food instead of the tap water deal...it is MUCH less hassle.  15 sec seems just right for 4 oz (for 2 cats).

Next batch I will get throw-away plastic ware for packaging.

It won't be able to get much simpler than that...thanks TCS

 

[lehighluke]

I've kind of done the putting the portions of [organ] on a try and freezing and then putting the frozen pieces in a bag, thing.  Instead of a tray, I use an ICE CUBE tray.  Each cube holds around 1 oz.  This works best for liver/organs.

Silicone muffin trays would work good for this for actual meal portions

 

[meranaldar]

Silicone muffin trays would work good for this for actual meal portions

Hmm, great idea. I have some of those I'll have to try that next time. I have both larger and mini ones, which would be good for organs.

I found some goat yesterday (which is something new Athena hasn't tried before), and I put the portions on a tray to freeze before bagging. It worked ok, though took a bit of effort to pull some if off the tray. The silicon muffin trays wouldn't have that problem, and would also be easier to stack.

As for microwaving to warm it up a bit, while it would be easier, but does the ground have bone in it? Does that even matter much with ground bone?

 

[cat dad]

I've been freezing in ice cube trays and then popping them out and storing the cubes in large freezer bags. Then I have four large pickle jars that I put a days portion (6oz/6 cubes) into for each of my two cats. It usually takes 24 hours to thaw in the fridge so two jars is in the fridge thawed and two jars is in the fridge thawing. I take out the next day's portion in the morning, so I have the four jars on a rotation.

It's kind of a pain because I have a side by side fridge freezer and the because the freezer is to small to have a lot of ice cube trays, I'm only able to make food a week at a time. Im thinking of making 12oz patties (a days worth of food for two cats) and freezing those flat in sandwich bags, and then using a scale to weigh out portions when I'm dishing it out. I know it's wasteful, but I can make and store so much more that way. Still thinking...

Mine don't mind it cold, but I pour a teaspoon or so of hot water on it before I serve it to take a bit of the chill off.

 

[aprilprey]

Mine don't mind it cold, but I pour a teaspoon or so of hot water on it before I serve it to take a bit of the chill off.

I do this too - a little warm water added to thawed-but-cold does wonders without any worry of "cooking" the food.  That's also why I use the minimum water amount when making Dr. Pierson's recipe - I'd rather add it later.

Just remember to be consistent and weigh out portions prior to adding more water.

Another option is to warm the bowl, not the food.  Works great in the microwave as long as you are using ceramic or glass bowls.

 

[katluver4life]

FYI ....Never microwave your cat's raw food to warm it, as microwaving changes the molecular structure of food, thereby altering its nutritional value, and can also turn raw bones into cooked bones, which should never be fed to your cat. Pulling the food out early and allowing it to reach semi room temp and then adding some warm water works well.

I use 1 lb size BPH free plastic containers, like mrsgreenjeens, and each night pull the next days food out into the fridge. During the day I use snack size bags to divide out 3 servings per meal, so use 3 snack bags. Each of my cats require a different amt, so I have to do this. They warm quickly in a bowl of warm tap water. I mean really quickly. They eat 3 times a day and it really takes no time at all to get their food warm enough. It takes me MORE time if I have to add anything to the meals, but the warming takes very little doing it this way.

 

[lehighluke]

FYI ....Never microwave your cat's raw food to warm it, as microwaving changes the molecular structure of food, thereby altering its nutritional value, and can also turn raw bones into cooked bones, which should never be fed to your cat. 

Im sorry, what? 

 I have to call BS on this (no offense, I hope its ok to disagree).  Microwaves do nothing more than excite (ie. vibrate) fat and water molecules.  Molecular structure is not 'altered', it does not change the chemistry of the food.  That being said, nutritional value is no more/less affected than any other low heating method.  No bones are being cooked. A few seconds in the microwave just gets the food lukewarm.  Its a heck of alot quicker than my make-shift immersion circulator that I used to do.

Purely from a physics point of view, there is nothing wrong with a microwave.

 

[katluver4life]

Im sorry, what? 

 I have to call BS on this (no offense, I hope its ok to disagree).  Microwaves do nothing more than excite (ie. vibrate) fat and water molecules.  Molecular structure is not 'altered', it does not change the chemistry of the food.  That being said, nutritional value is no more/less affected than any other low heating method.  No bones are being cooked. A few seconds in the microwave just gets the food lukewarm.  Its a heck of alot quicker than my make-shift immersion circulator that I used to do.

Purely from a physics point of view, there is nothing wrong with a microwave.

Though you may be careful about the amount of time you are warming the food in the microwave, it is generally not a recommended way to warm raw. If you feel comfortable with how your doing it, where it is not going to accidentally get too cooked, that's ok for YOU. Any heating method has the potential of killing some of the nutrients and enzymes in raw, which is why we recommend using warm, or even cold water to defrost and warm the food a bit, not hot.

Any time a microwave is used to warm food, you run the risk of cooking it. Every microwave is different, even a few seconds can make a difference of just a tad too much and there by killing some of the nutrients and enzymes we're trying so hard to give our cats. Bones run the risk of being cooked if the raw contains bones, as many grounds do. Some ground raw with bones have the bones ground small enough where splintering may not be a concern, but cooked bones splinter and can cause big issues when a cat eats them. Because of all these factors, microwaving is discouraged as a "to be safe" don't do.

You will not find it recommended anywhere, where feeding raw is discussed.