Belgian Malinois

[denice]

I love them. I've been watching a lot of Youtube videos about training them.

I also really admire the breed. I believe it is possible to have them in a home as pets but people need to know what that entails, no couch potato people need apply. People need to know a lot about training dogs and be willing to put the time and work into them.

 

[Winchester]

See, that's the thing. I'm not a couch potato...far from it. I had a setback, I admit it, because of the cancer. But I've never been one to just sit on my ass all day long. I'm willing to invest the time and the money for the dog (and me!) to be properly trained and would do whatever I could for proper training, both off-leash and on. I admire the Malinois so much, not from any movie or anything like that. I've been checking out dog breeds for quite a few months now, just haven't said anything before this, and fell in love with the mals.

 

[denice]

See, that's the thing. I'm not a couch potato...far from it. I had a setback, I admit it, because of the cancer. But I've never been one to just sit on my ass all day long. I'm willing to invest the time and the money for the dog (and me!) to be properly trained and would do whatever I could for proper training, both off-leash and on. I admire the Malinois so much, not from any movie or anything like that. I've been checking out dog breeds for quite a few months now, just haven't said anything before this, and fell in love with the mals.

You know what is involved and want one then you should go for it.

 

[MoochNNoodles]

I think i would want a trial run in a way; to spend time with one in person and talk to their person to be sure of my decision. Thats how I’m looking at things with our breed choice. I grew up around golden retrievers and had a lab mix as a teen; so I feel pretty confident that its a good breed for us. Not too high energy but playful and good to go on walks and things with us. Maybe even kayaking in the bigger kayak we have. But I haven’t actually had a dog of my own in adulthood. I found a few breeders near me recently. Ive also been looking for trainers in the area. We aren’t putting a date on anything; just researching with Mooch being nearly 20.

I also spent some time chatting with a cousin who has corgis because DS loves them. He had that glow about him when we met one in Lowes and the lady let him pet the dog.

I just feel like I need to know our decisions will be good for everyone; not just me. And that means in-person research at some point. I am working through some challenges and setbacks and the pull of a canine companion is STRONG and feels like it could be something that would really help. But i know if it ends up being more stressful than i anticipate; I may not find the benefit I’m hoping for. Our friends have 2 left in their litter of mini goldendoodles; but frankly its not a breed i feel anything for. Even being more hypoallergenic. DDs allergist has said to just keep dogs from her bedroom. But that’s another factor in my mind. Can my family enjoy the dog breed we choose? I could never knowingly adopt a breed knowing it might not be possible to keep that dog its entire life. I think having a frank talk with a breeder in person would help me view things realistically. Remove any bias or rose colored glasses. Cat decisions have always been so much easier!!

 

[susanm9006]

I think i would want a trial run in a way; to spend time with one in person and talk to their person to be sure of my decision. Thats how I’m looking at things with our breed choice. I grew up around golden retrievers and had a lab mix as a teen; so I feel pretty confident that its a good breed for us. Not too high energy but playful and good to go on walks and things with us. Maybe even kayaking in the bigger kayak we have. But I haven’t actually had a dog of my own in adulthood. I found a few breeders near me recently. Ive also been looking for trainers in the area. We aren’t putting a date on anything; just researching with Mooch being nearly 20.

I also spent some time chatting with a cousin who has corgis because DS loves them. He had that glow about him when we met one in Lowes and the lady let him pet the dog.

I just feel like I need to know our decisions will be good for everyone; not just me. And that means in-person research at some point. I am working through some challenges and setbacks and the pull of a canine companion is STRONG and feels like it could be something that would really help. But i know if it ends up being more stressful than i anticipate; I may not find the benefit I’m hoping for. Our friends have 2 left in their litter of mini goldendoodles; but frankly its not a breed i feel anything for. Even being more hypoallergenic. DDs allergist has said to just keep dogs from her bedroom. But that’s another factor in my mind. Can my family enjoy the dog breed we choose? I could never knowingly adopt a breed knowing it might not be possible to keep that dog its entire life. I think having a frank talk with a breeder in person would help me view things realistically. Remove any bias or rose colored glasses. Cat decisions have always been so much easier!!

A funny story about dogs and puppies. Two years ago my sister bought a doodle mix dog from a breeder. They get the pup at three months and the breeder tells them the dog is potty trained. We grew up with dogs and I was very skeptical. Turns out the puppy was trained to use a litterbox just like a cat. She is two years old now and has a large box in the garage and that is the only place she goes. She roots around in it just like a cat to find the right spot but doesn’t cover. Darndest thing but my brother in law loves not having a yard full of poop.

 

[denice]

The joy of puppies, housebreaking. I have had ones that were fairly easy and ones that weren't, I swear they were being stubborn to spite me. I know that isn't true but it seemed that way. It is always at least a little of a time-consuming process.

 

[iPappy]

A funny story about dogs and puppies. Two years ago my sister bought a doodle mix dog from a breeder. They get the pup at three months and the breeder tells them the dog is potty trained. We grew up with dogs and I was very skeptical. Turns out the puppy was trained to use a litterbox just like a cat. She is two years old now and has a large box in the garage and that is the only place she goes. She roots around in it just like a cat to find the right spot but doesn’t cover. Darndest thing but my brother in law loves not having a yard full of poop.

I wasn't sure about litter training my Paps, but, I am so glad I did. Both dogs now will ask to go outside to go pee, but, if I'm not around I'll see that they have both used their litter boxes. No peeing randomly on the rug or the floor, they know where to go in case of emergency. And on the very rare occasion I can sleep in an extra hour or so, knowing they have a well established back up plan is SO nice!

 

[iPappy]

See, that's the thing. I'm not a couch potato...far from it. I had a setback, I admit it, because of the cancer. But I've never been one to just sit on my ass all day long. I'm willing to invest the time and the money for the dog (and me!) to be properly trained and would do whatever I could for proper training, both off-leash and on. I admire the Malinois so much, not from any movie or anything like that. I've been checking out dog breeds for quite a few months now, just haven't said anything before this, and fell in love with the mals.

Do you know any of them in person that you could handle and maybe walk or sit for if the owners need someone to let them outside? I've found that's a great way to get to know breed traits and all the little things that go with living with them. When I started working with dogs, I had a short list of breeds I swore I would own and decades later, I wouldn't own any of them. Likewise, there were breeds I did not care for that I could now see myself owning.
If, and only if, you're interested...I have a list of very good breeders of Malinois scattered all over the country that was compiled by people in the breed. I'd be happy to send it to you. I've found that a lot of breeders are happy to talk about their dogs and breed in general, and if you had any questions about living with them, training them, or going through a breeder OR a rescue, it might be a nice resource to have.

 

[fionasmom]

You definitely want a good breeder if you are going forward with a Mal.

 

[flying fox]

I hope you don’t mind me chiming in. I’m a long time lurker who found the site years ago while looking for information to help a cat-owning friend. I don’t have a cat, though I find them fascinating and enjoy learning about and being around them.

I am, however, a Malinois person, having had three over the past twenty years. When I saw the title of this thread, I clicked on it with interest as well as with a little trepidation. I’ve trained and competed in several dog sports with mine, and had been involved in agility for several years with a different herding breed when I got my first. I have to agree with the posters that are cautioning you, especially Animal Freak, who asked you some excellent questions early on.

The traits that make them such impressive working dogs are not necessarily qualities that make a good pet. They are supposed to have very high prey drive. These dogs are wired to react quickly, and to chase and bite. A game of tug or a chance to bite the decoy is the ultimate reward for many of them. They are very physical. I can’t tell you how many cuts and bruises I’ve had over the years that have been my fault because I made a mistake presenting a toy reward to a driven dog.

A dog that has the drive to search without reinforcement for long periods of time in all kinds of weather and terrain, to hang on to a bite while being fought, all the while enjoying it…that’s not going to be the best candidate for a pet home.

iPappy mentioned the air snapping, and all of mine have done it, as well as many other related and unrelated Malinois I’ve been around. But some Mals are also the type of dog capable of redirecting on (i.e. biting) their handler or whatever happens to be closest when frustrated, scared, excited, or otherwise over threshold.

Managing a Malinois is often about trying to be one step ahead of them, constantly anticipating what they might do or notice in their environment next, especially when they are young and need guidance on how to function out in the world. Really good timing is essential to training and living with them. I’ve accidentally marked behaviors at the wrong moment and wound up with an unintended behavior that stuck, sometimes pretty much permanently, especially if the dog found that one more fun than the one intended. The right dog can learn just what you didn’t want them to in a single repetition and it can be very hard to undo.

The breed is in massive trouble now precisely because people want to keep working dogs as pets without the understanding of what it takes to meet their needs and manage them safely and successfully. Because of this, unscrupulous breeders have jumped in to profit from the demand. Rescues are overwhelmed. Many of these dogs are going to be too much for an inexperienced pet home. Temperament issues, particularly the nerviness that Animal Freak mentioned, are a major concern in the breed and can pop up even among well-bred dogs of various lines.

I don’t know what kind of research you’ve been doing over the past few months, but if you haven’t already, talk to breeders, owners, and rescuers, people who live, train, and work with the breed, who are deeply invested in them. Talk to people who love Malinois and want the dogs to succeed in their placements, and who will be brutally honest about the bad stuff, too. Meet as many of the dogs as you can. Make sure that you really want what you think you want.

Online descriptions often omit the really relevant potential negatives, and make it seem like any dog of any breed, regardless of genetics, drives, and purpose, can be turned into a pet in just the right home as long as there’s enough commitment to exercise and training and a big enough yard. It really isn’t that straightforward.

I’ll also say that a type of dog can seem to be exactly what you think you want on paper, in videos, or online, and yet the reality of them is very different. There was one breed in particular that I read about and researched online for years before actually meeting any, that I’d have put on my list of favorites, that seemed like everything I’d want in a dog. Then I spent time around lots of them when I was doing agility, and I quickly realized that I was wrong. That they really are not my cup of tea, and I wouldn’t want to live or work with them. Just not a fit, at all.

I strongly urge you to listen to Animal Freak, iPappy, and fionasmom's initial replies to you, in particular. You’ve gotten good, educated feedback from them and others, even if it isn’t what you may want to hear. If you insist on a Malinois, go through a foster-based breed specific rescue (I don't know whether it's against the rules to name a specific one), and look for a mellow, cat-safe dog that is being fostered with cats. Be aware that what you are looking for doesn’t sound like typical Malinois temperament. Be very honest with the rescue and with yourself about your experience level and current lifestyle.

Or possibly look into breeders of show and performance line dogs in particular and see if they might be looking to place a calmer adult dog. Make sure that the dog has been a house dog, not a kennel dog, and has lived successfully with cats. Those lines will generally be milder in temperament than the various flavors of working lines.

Honestly, the breed would be much better off right now if the vast majority of people who aren’t seeking a serious working or sport partner respected them for what they are and what they should be, and admired them from afar.

 

[Winchester]

Thank you for your opinions.

 

[iPappy]

Winchester what rescues were you looking at? Malinoisrescue.org has some really nice dogs listed and it sounds like they are evaluated incredibly well by experienced people, and are in foster homes vs. shelters or kennels. They have a few available now who are cat neutral and on the lower end of energy and exercise requirements. It might be worth contacting them and seeing what their process is like. They might get a dog in that they think would suit you.
F flying fox hello from one agility person to another! Do you know anything about the American Belgian Malinois Rescue I linked above?

 

[denice]

I looked through them and saw one in Ohio that they labeled as a Unicorn alert because she is okay with cats. Estimated to be 3 or 4 years old, lower energy and lower drive. She came into rescue with heartworm, which has been treated, emaciated and covered with sores so she has been through it. A lot of really young dogs that had been abused, sounds like people resorted to abuse to try to control a young driven dog, that is really sad. That or they were using abuse to try to turn them into a protection dog. Of course, that just produces either a vicious dog or a fearful dog.

 

[iPappy]

I looked through them and saw one in Ohio that they labeled as a Unicorn alert because she is okay with cats. Estimated to be 3 or 4 years old, lower energy and lower drive. She came into rescue with heartworm, which has been treated, emaciated and covered with sores so she has been through it. A lot of really young dogs that had been abused, sounds like people resorted to abuse to try to control a young driven dog, that is really sad. That or they were using abuse to try to turn them into a protection dog. Of course, that just produces either a vicious dog or a fearful dog.

I saw an article written by a long time protection trainer who was shooting down what is called table training. They tie the dog on a table and have the people in suits antagonize the dog until the dog snaps and acts out aggressively, then the people in the bite suits back off. Dog learns that acting aggressively gets the bad guy to back off. The trainer was talking about how absolutely wrong this was and did not create a protection dog or a sport dog, but a huge liability. Very sad.
I saw the dog you mentioned. She's adorable and sounds like a dream.

 

[flying fox]

[
F flying fox hello from one agility person to another! Do you know anything about the American Belgian Malinois Rescue I linked above?
[/QUOTE]

Hi! I haven't done agility in years, not since my first two (and the non-Mal that came before them), have most recently trained in obedience and one of the protection sports. Agility really is a blast!

That is indeed the rescue that I was going to suggest. Years ago I knew an agility person in my area who fostered for them, but don't have any recent experience with them. However, they've been around for many years and are the resource that I point people towards when they might be interested in a rescue.

Apologies for such a delayed reply. Just got back online after several days and was unable to log in on my phone while I was away. I am not very forum savvy and haven't quite figured it all out yet!