Alternatives to kicking these cats out of the house?

[misskalamata]

Hi,

A customer came into my workplace today and told me about her problems with her indoor cats and her intention to release them outside in the near future. She says she has no choice. I persuaded her to give me her contact info so that I could look into alternative options and then get back to her.

Please arm me with some good information and options to save these cats. Please read all the way through before replying and respond only with objective facts and reasonable possibilities.
This is the situation:

The two cats live in her basement. One is about 14 years old, "only 3 pounds, never got big", and unspayed because she has a liver problem that would have caused her to not survive a spay procedure. She still goes into heat, sometimes for months at a time (according to owner), and she "sprays" urine all over as well as defecating everywhere. The owner said that her "spray" has caused the basement windows to rust shut and once even caused a fire when she urinated on an electrical outlet. The second cat is a feral who was brought into the house 3 years ago and is still too wild to handle, take to the vet, etc. I forget why the owner said she brought the feral in ... might have been injured, or just a really cold winter, I don't remember. Not sure of the feral's sex. The feral and the unspayed female do not get along. The feral also urinates and defecates all over.

The owner told me repeatedly that she will not give the cats to anybody because they are a "health hazard", and she does not want to be sued if they make someone sick. She said that the ammonia from breathing in the urine vapors can cause pneumonia, which might kill someone. When I suggested that perhaps they could become barn cats, she said that hay reacts chemically with cat urine in such a way as to release poison gas. She rattled off a list of diseases that can exist in cat feces. She said that it is illegal to give someone a cat that constitutes such a health hazard as her floor-defecating cats. She said a vet told her that. (I haven't checked the Ohio Revised Code yet, but I will....) She said it would be against the law for her to give her cats to someone else.

She said she tried Feliway and consulted with half a dozen vets, who largely recommended euthanasia. One vet, she said, told her that releasing the cats into the outdoors is the only way to avoid having them killed. She asked the ASPCA, APL, and other shelters, and was told they cannot accept these cats. She is intent on kicking them out of the house in the near future. Maybe the feral would be alright outdoors, since the feral has only been indoors for a few years and is still pretty wild. But I cannot imagine a good outcome for the 14-year-old, "3 lb" unspayed female who has apparently lived indoors since kittenhood. If she couldn't survive a spay procedure, how would she possibly survive pregnancy? There's got to be some other option here.

My taking the cat(s) would not be an option even if the owner were willing to give the cats away. My current lease stipulates no pets, period, let alone incontinent pets in heat.

In addition to giving the owner my contact information, I gave her TheCatSite URL, so she may come on here and find this thread. Please do not reply to the thread with emotional reactions and personal criticisms: that will not sway her, and it may shut her down and ruin the cats' chance to find an alternative solution. Please stick with objective facts, scientific/veterinary sources, and reasonable options for the cats. The owner says she trusts information from veterinary experts, but does not really trust laypeople. I may send a copy/paste of this thread to the (amazing) vet who cared for my late cats.

We're in Northeast Ohio if anyone knows of local resources.

Please help me find information to address the owner's concerns so that these cats don't have to be kicked out of the house!

Thank you!

 

[FeebysOwner]

Hi,
If it were me, I would follow-up on all the information she has told you - checking with shelters, SPCA, etc. to see what they tell you - some might even have written guidelines that they could provide you with as most of these institutions have to follow local/state regulations. And many of them will have guidelines about how they care for unwanted cats, as well as the issue about turning cats over who have 'issues'. I think you may find that there is nothing illegal about that when the persons who take over these cats are aware of their problems. Also, check local/state regulations on your own - it is very possible you will find out that it is actually illegal for her to just let the cats loose.

I would also look for rescue centers/organizations - which are different from shelters in many cases. Check with your Next-Door Neighbor web site to look for contacts that might be able to help you search for a place for them to go. Facebook should also have contacts that you might be able to reach out to for assistance, including Lost & Found sites that you could call and discuss what knowledge/information they may have to share with you. I do know of one place that you might call to see what they can tell you - PAWS Ohio (PAWS Ohio | Public Animal Welfare Society, Inc), however I am sure you will find it when you start searching yourself.

If at all possible, get pictures of these cats, so that if all else fails and she releases them you can then contact some of the above groups to see if they would help in trapping them after she lets them go. Stay friendly with this person so that you have a better chance of being aware of her taking this action.

P.S. By all means, call your 'old' vet and ask for any information/guidelines/assistance they might be able to give you as well.

Hopefully, other members will come along soon and have some ideas for you.

 

[Willowy]

Is she intending on abandoning them or keeping them as outside pets? Abandoning them would be wrong and illegal. Keeping them as outside pets might work if certain precautions are taken. First, of course, they'd have to be fixed and vaccinated. Perhaps the older cat would be able to survive surgery with the newer (safer) anesthetics. She probably needs a dental by this age so they could do both at once, after doing bloodwork to see what precautions they need to take. The feral may be trappable (not sure how she intends to get the feral out of the basement if the cat can't be handled or put in a carrier). Then they'd need a safe and comfortable outside space, perhaps a shed or an insulated shelter, with plenty of food and water. This certainly isn't ideal, but neither is keeping them in a waste-filled basement.

 

[misskalamata]

Thank you, FeebysOwner. I just submitted a message to PAWS.

Willowy, I'm not sure. My initial impression was of abandonment, but I may be mistaken ... I think she did mention some kind of sheltered enclosure in the yard (I don't recall exactly what it was). I don't remember the owner saying that she would continue to feed them, though. She made multiple comments about "letting nature take its course" and expressed concern that the cats would continue to "spray" and defecate around her yard.

If abandonment or euthanasia are the other options on the table, maybe it would be worth risking the cat's life to try and spay her, even if her odds of surviving the spay aren't good. As compared to her odds of being hit by a car, having a miscarriage at age 14, being attacked by a coyote....

 

[Norachan]

If abandonment or euthanasia are the other options on the table, maybe it would be worth risking the cat's life to try and spay her, even if her odds of surviving the spay aren't good. As compared to her odds of being hit by a car, having a miscarriage at age 14, being attacked by a coyote..

If she has spent the last 14 years going in and out of heat cycles there is a very good chance that she has developed pyometra or some form of ovarian/mammary gland cancer by now. I think the risks of her dying from some disease caused by not being spayed outweighs the dangers of going through surgery. Spaying might be her only hope.

hay reacts chemically with cat urine

No. That's not true. I've googled that and I can't find anything that suggests it might be true. I used to work with horses who often pee on their straw bedding, but it never caused any kind of chemical reaction that releases a poisonous gas. Most feral caretakers use hay or straw as bedding without any ill effects.

There are health problems caused from breathing in the dust from damp mouldy hay, but hay damp from rain water is just as likely to go mouldy as hay that's been peed on.

ammonia from breathing in the urine vapors can cause pneumonia

Breathing in ammonia can cause irritation to the throat and eyes, but it would have to be very concentrated to have any serious, long term health effects. It wouldn't cause pneumonia, it might trigger an asthma attack though.

Do you know/have you seen the kind of living conditions the cats are kept in? Most problems with spraying and litter box avoidance can be corrected with more litter boxes, different cat litter, enzyme cleaners etc. I can give you more advice about how to help with that, but if the cats are kept in a basement that isn't cleaned regularly and doesn't have enough litter boxes that might be why she's having so much trouble with them.

 

[misskalamata]

No, I don't know what the cats' living conditions or litter box situation is, other than that the owner uses non-clumping litter. We struck up a conversation as she was loading cat litter into her shopping cart. (She has a third cat, a kitten, who doesn't live in the basement and whom she plans to keep after releasing the other two).

I am not getting anywhere. I've emailed or called a number of places, and those who responded said they can't help me and referred me to other rescues and shelters, who in turn tell me the same thing. I've started offering a $500 donation to any place that finds a solution for these cats. I'm still waiting for responses from one shelter and one rescue organization.

I asked two vets for information and got nothing useful. I understand that they can't legally give medical advice about a patient they haven't seen. But they won't even answer the question of: Could there exist a circumstance under which a cat whose liver problem prevented spaying 13 years ago might be able to survive spay surgery now at age 14? I handed the last vet a written multiple-choice question, with two choices for the answer: A) No, there's very little chance of such a circumstance, and B) While no diagnosis can be made without seeing the patient, it is possible that changes in the cat's liver condition and advances in vet medicine could MAYBE allow the cat to survive surgery now. The vet, of course, would not answer A or B. She said, "it depends", and I told her that I would interpret that to mean "maybe".

I have yet to call the owner. I was hoping to have some options to share with her. I will call her tomorrow either way. I wonder if she would let me take the female to a vet for another opinion. In my conversation with her, she spoke disapprovingly of people who put their cats through chemo, etc. She is not of the "cats are family just like human children" mindset. She told me that her mind was made up ... but still, she was willing to give me her phone number. . so I keep hoping I can help somehow....

 

[Norachan]

She is not of the "cats are family just like human children" mindset

Which makes me concerned that the cats might be neglected and living in very unsanitary conditions, and that's why she's having these problems.

What ever happens, being turned out at the age of 14, un-spayed and with a health condition would be a terrible thing to happen to this cat. It would be kinder to have her PTS if there was no other option. I really hope that she's willing to let you take the female to a vet for another examination.

Please keep us updated on how it goes.

 

[misskalamata]

I called the owner today. While the situation isn't good, it is not quite as bad as I'd thought. The cats will become outdoor pets; they are not being abandoned outright. She already feeds strays in her yard ... so, there is always food and water out. She has an insulated cooler in the yard with an entrance hole cut into it and straw inside for warmth. Possibly the feral slept there before being brought inside. She mentioned that a neighbor has a "shed with a crawl space" where the cats might go to get out of the elements. The owner won't let them into the garage.

She said that the unspayed female is infertile due to a growth in her uterus, and that any potential pregnancy would quickly end in a spontaneous abortion. I hope the cat would not be hurt in that process.

The liver condition is a birth defect that caused the liver to fail to fully develop. She said the cat could not survive any medication, anesthesia, etc. She said the female was only expected to live 5 years, and that her littermates died as kittens, some of them after getting fixed against the vet's advice. I'm not sure how all the kittens in the litter could have been born with the same birth defect, but that's what the owner seemed to imply. She reiterated that she consulted 6 vets about the female and was told by all that there is no treatment for the birth defect and no chance of getting spayed. She wouldn't let me get another opinion from my vet.

None of this eliminates the substantial risks that a 3 lb. indoor cat will face outdoors. But the owner at least will provide food, water, and a small space the cats can go to escape the elements, and she claims that the female cannot get pregnant.

She said she will only euthanize the cat if the cat becomes ill (beyond just the liver condition).