Adopted a third cat, existing cats not pleased.

[losna]

@veronica00  Yes, he does. He also chews open wounds into his shoulders, gets respiratory infections and severe constipation. He is a super little stressmonkey. 

 There's a certain threshold that I let him get to now before I call them, because I'm familiar with his health problems at this point. I now know, for example, that when he starts getting discharge, they're not going to do anything but give me lysine and probiotics until his discharge is really bad and discolored. So I just sprinkle lysine into his food and give him probiotics on my own. No need to call them until it's at the point where they are concerned.

But each cat is different, just like people. They handle stress in different ways, and stress can weaken their immune systems and cause actual problems. So if you are at worried, at the very least call your vet and describe his symptoms and see what they say. 

 

[veronica00]

@Losna wow that is very stressful for both of you I'm sorry that his stress gets that far. You are an awesome Mom to be able to manage it so calmly. I did call the vet and asked that they call me back to discuss bringing him in or not. I was going to bring him in tonight but didn't want to stress him further and I'm hoping he might it breakfast tomorrow like he did today. How long does your little stressmonkey go without eating? Does he drink water? I tried to put some wet food on my finger but my little man was having no part of it.

 

[losna]

It's an enforced calm, trust me! If I show worry, he stresses out even more and winds up with wounds on all 4 legs instead of just 2. He grooms himself until he's literally bleeding with open wounds. When he tears open a wound large enough to upset him on one leg, he moves on to the next.  

 It's also taken me several months and hundreds of dollars at the vet to get to this point. Any new symptom and I'll make an appointment. But he stresses out so much that  I'm familiar with his stress responses. 

The longest he's gone without eating due to stress is a day or so. Longer than that if you you discount the little nibbles he'll take every now and again. I call the vet when he stops eating his treats, or he goes 3-4 days without eating more than a few bites, depending on other symptoms.

Drinking is tough to calculate, since I feed him a mix of wet food and raw meat, with enough water to make it soupy. I give him fresh water every day, but he generally gets what he needs from his food.

 

[suzglo]

No force should ever be used in introducing cats to cats. There are steps involved as you say in scent swapping to eventually get to the body scent swapping stage. Obviously, most people know not to put the new cat's scents on each other until all cat's have adjusted to even the idea of a new cat in the safe room. Not until all cats are ready for that very important step do you advance to rubbing scents on the actual body of the cat's. Just to clarify. Also - scent swapping IS a very, very important part of the beginnings of introductions to ALL cat's. WHEN and ONLY WHEN the cat is no longer hissing at the scent of the other cat does one apply the actual scent swapping on each of the cat's. First one must allow the scents to be explored all on their own accord as I said via sock on the floor, brush on the floor, bed or blanket exchanges, etc. etc. There are steps involved to scent swapping.

Scent swapping is so very important for successful relationships, IMO, before actual face to face introductions are done. I would rather have the hissing/growling, etc. etc. out of the way or at the very least minimized by scent swapping before face to face begins. It is such a shame when people do force cats to be introduced before they are ALL actually ready.

Ms. Johnson-Bennett doesn't actually say to rub the sock with scent on the different cats. Right. She just states to run the cat and allow the other to smell it at its own pace.

She does have a whole step by step process to go through that addresses the senses one by one.

If you go to her website and backtrack a bit you will see her whole outline in how to introduce two cats.

 

[mani]

Mod Note:

We're starting to go a little off-topic here.  Veronica00 has had very good links to look at and it could get confusing if we get into 'who said what'.

@veronica00 it's a good idea to find a process that works (Feralvr gave quite a few in her first post) and follow it, asking questions here as much as you like. 

There's a lot of excellent experience here, with people to help you through.

 

[feralvr]

wow that is very stressful for both of you I'm sorry that his stress gets that far. You are an awesome Mom to be able to manage it so calmly. I did call the vet and asked that they call me back to discuss bringing him in or not. I was going to bring him in tonight but didn't want to stress him further and I'm hoping he might it breakfast tomorrow like he did today.

Hi Veronica. Did Petey eat this morning? Oh I hope so. It will be hard to say if this is all caused by stress of the new cat coming in OR something completely unrelated with bad timing. Good you called the vet and I hope that today Petey is feeling better.

 

[veronica00]

@Feralvr Thank you for checking. I started googling Petey's symptoms last night and started to worry about a UTI or worse, a blockage. Realizing what I thought was depression/acting out could actually be illness, I took him to the ER last night. We were there until midnight because as it turns out, Pete was sick. They don't know what is wrong but they're thinking pancreatitis which may have been brought on by stress. I feel absolutely horrible and responsible for putting him in this situation. Anyway, he had not eaten since yesterday morning. I tried different canned foods, tuna, rotisserie chicken, baby food, mashed potato, nothing. Finally I found a treat I used to buy and gave him that and he ate a few bites. I then put a few in some tuna juice and he ate that. A couple hours later he threw up. I have an appt tomorrow with an internal specialist. Honesly, i'm kind of losing it, been crying on and off all day and asked my dogwalker if she'd take my dog..permanently. I know he causes tons of stress with his extreme barking and anxiety.

Bob is still isolated in his room and I tried to give him some attention a few times a day. This is just a really awful experience right now. I do not know how to make good decisions about anything anymore.

 

[feralvr]

Oh Veronica. I have been in your shoes before and actually had a similar situation a few years back. It all did work out though as it was the timing of everything that was SOOOOO very overwhelming. The new cat adoption, a resident cat getting sick at the same time and dogs adding to the mix all makes for a very stressful time. When things unfold this way as life usually does, we question ourselves. It is natural and normal. In time, though, we realize and look back and see the good in our decisions. In the moment, that very day/time, we just can't see it yet. My feeling is, Bob or not, Petey may have already been coming down with something or sick with something and the timing of it showing itself is just not great but I think you will be able to manage all of this.

Maybe your dog walker could take your dog (what kind is he?) on a temp. basis for now until things settle down at home. OR were you already thinking of re-homing him? You must do what you think best for everyone involved. :nod:

I am sorry Petey has become sick and my feeling is that this was already brewing IF it is in fact Pancreatits or something of the sort. It is not your fault at all for having that beautiful heart and wanting to adopt Bob whom needed a home so badly. Things just work out the way they should and sometimes we just can't explain the why's of them. They just are and we must deal with it as best we can.

For now, Bob is just fine in his lovely room! He is ALRIGHT there. Better than where he was. :nod: So try to think of that. His time in the room will only help later when you DO go ahead with introductions. You can still spend time with him in there and it will be relaxing for you and for him. You will both need each other right now.

Petey may very well have a UTI hence the pee near the litter box. I really do not think Pancreatits can be brought on by stress nor this quickly!! Did he have a fever? Did they do a urine culture? Did they do an xray? Take blood? Usually when I have to see the E-vet, I go see my regular vet first and discuss things then I would go to the Specialist if my regular vet thinks it necessary. Your regular vet can do all of those tests too. I don't know the detail of your E-vet visit so maybe they think a specialist is the best route but still, if it were me, I would want to talk with my regular vet first. I am super sorry you are going through ALL of this ALL at the same time. I feel for you and do completely understand what you are going through. Petey.

 

[maureen brad]

I think the problem ( other than putting Bob in your room is just that things are moving to fast. Cats bond first with a territory and then with the people and animals around them. Take it slow. Poor Bob has had a lot of stress and while he is so lucky that you have taken him he doesn't know that yet.Wait until he is confident in his safe room and then let him roam a part of the house still keeping the other cats separate.Then switch places with the other cats. When it is time to introduce do it with one cat at a time. My vet is heavily involved in rescue and she says that if she gives introductions enough time there has not been one time her cats have not bonded. I have used her method with 5 cats and it works.

 It is frustrating to have to let things move slowly but so worth it when you end up with cats who do not fight.

 

[scullynmaxmom]

@Losna
wow that is very stressful for both of you I'm sorry that his stress gets that far. You are an awesome Mom to be able to manage it so calmly. I did call the vet and asked that they call me back to discuss bringing him in or not. I was going to bring him in tonight but didn't want to stress him further and I'm hoping he might it breakfast tomorrow like he did today. How long does your little stressmonkey go without eating? Does he drink water? I tried to put some wet food on my finger but my little man was having no part of it.

I'm new to the board but not to cats. I think you're doing a great job getting them introduced. I've had to do introductions much worse than that, and it was very hard. But on the note of Petey not eating, one of my cats got very ill last fall with the Calici virus. She had only eaten once in 5 days and I was panicked, so I took her to a specialty vet hospital to ask what they could do. The guy said she could go for WEEKS before they'd give her a feeding tube, etc. I was shocked. I ended up syringe feeding her when she got to 6 days without food. That was no fun, but it got food in her and after a few days of that she started to eat on her own again. She's doing well now, but she was thin to start with. If Petey is fat, as you say, you have to be more careful. If you Google "syringe feeding a cat" you'll find videos and you can see if it's something you feel comfortable doing.
Also giving sub Q fluids helps when they're not eating or drinking much.

Bob will thank you profusely one day. I'd adopt every cat from the pet store if I had room. Poor babies in those cages all of their lives.

 

[feralvr]

If you Google "syringe feeding a cat" you'll find videos and you can see if it's something you feel comfortable doing.
Also giving sub Q fluids helps when they're not eating or drinking much.

.

Thank you for bringing up about syringe feeding as I was going to post this excellent thread with video from a member on how to safely syringe feed a cat in case Veronica needs to assist feed Petey.

http://www.thecatsite.com/t/227858/syringe-feeding-lucky-video-if-your-cat-is-not-eating

More vibes for Petey this morning

 

[ritz]

I have nothing to add but am following this thread avidly.
I recently removed Hercules [male], a super friendly, affectionate cat, from the small colony I take care of (30 minutes from where I live).
Hercules seems to be adjusting well; Ritz [female, a little older than Hercules] not so sure. I did the scent swaping sock and blanket thing; Ritz just looked at them like, "and your point?..."
BUT when I've been cuddling with Hercules (inordinately friendly) and his scent is on my pants or sweater/jacket, Ritz will not stay on my lap after she sniffs out his scent. She also has not slept with me some nights (:
Ritz is prone to stress induced UTIs.
So I've literally been changing clothes after I see Hercules. My handyman is going to install a screen door leading to the 2nd bedroom where Hercules is. We'll proceed from there.

 

[veronica00]

@Feralvr  Thank you so much for your post it was truly comforting to me, I'm a bit of a wreck and seem to cry on a dime. I'm at work this morning but will take Petey to the specialist at noon today for bloodwork. I did talk to my regular vet who recommended this specialist as well and it is she who thinks it is actually "chronic" pancreatitis which means it will show up chronically, particularly during stressful times. He had this happen 1 year ago at this time (Feb 2014) where he was hospitalized overnight and no one diagnosed him. I just assumed it was a bad stomach bug. Today he will have blood tests and a specific test for pancreatitis and if needed, an ultrasound.

As for Bob, he is a sweet little nugget but I only have so much time i can spend with him, 5 minutes here, 15 minutes there, 20 minutes before bed last night. My main concentration has to be on Petey so I feel pulled in diff directions. Bob cries in such a way that he sounds like he's dying or broken hearted, it's so tough to hear. I try to tell myself he is in a large room with windows, a tall cat tree, a comfy chair, food, toys, litter box not right next to his bed and food like at petsmart, and visits but when I hear those cries I feel like I'm torturing him by leaving him there. 

This morning Petey came up and slept on my stomach for about an hour which told me he's feeling a bit better (also tough because he's 18 lbs .. heaaavy) but I was so happy to have him there. He ate a few nuggets of dried food but no canned food. He sat outside Bob's door for a bit and just looked under the crack, no noises. Bob was crying and reaching under the crack and Pete just watched then eventually walked away. I have no idea how long Bob will have to stay there but I'd guess at least another week 

@Maureen Bradley  those are great suggestions. Next time I let him out (in a week? I don't know?) I will close Petey and Lulu in my bedroom. Then take them out one by one. 

@ScullynMaxMom  thank you for your advice and kind words! Bob's cries tug at my heart and guilt but I think he has to be better off where he is for a few weeks than he was in that tiny cage in petsmart. When I bring Petey to the vet today they will likely do fluids and he's eating little bits of dry and there so it's improving a little (I hope).

@Ritz  good luck with your little girl! My best advice based on what I've been through is give her tons of extra attention and don't rush it. Petey seems happiest when I'm sitting on the floor scratching his back and just giving him pats and love. The fact that he slept on my stomach this morning which I'm not sure he has ever done was pretty awesome (other than uncomfortable under his girth). I felt like he was thanking me, I dunno, and that he wanted to be close to me as a comfort. 

 

[cat nap]

......
.....
@Ritz  good luck with your little girl! My best advice based on what I've been through is give her tons of extra attention and don't rush it. Petey seems happiest when I'm sitting on the floor scratching his back and just giving him pats and love. The fact that he slept on my stomach this morning which I'm not sure he has ever done was pretty awesome (other than uncomfortable under his girth). I felt like he was thanking me, I dunno, and that he wanted to be close to me as a comfort. 

hi @veronica00   I cannot offer any concrete advice as the other members have, but just wanted to offer some moral support.

I also think that it was just strange timing, that all this happened at the same time.  Petey was probably sick, and not showing any symptoms, until he stopped eating.  (I actually don't notice anything with my own cats until they stop eating, and then bring them to the vet.)

Bob's probably just wondering where all the people are,  like he used to watch walk by at Petsmart. It's like watching television, or having something to look at.  He could be thinking that he liked your bedroom and you, and just wants to get out there again.  But in time, he will.

  You adopting him, is the best thing that could have happened.

(last year, my 14 yr old cat had a number of issues pop up concerning his health, heart/kidneys, and I was worrying constantly until finally one day when driving home from a vet appointment, I realized that "me feeling bad or good...had absolutely no bearing on the outcome of Spotty's condition. Me feeling bad, and worrying,  would not help Spotty. "  (Of course I still worry,  but just to a lesser degree, and decided to take it day by day.)

My thoughts are with you, Petey, Lulu and Bob...and I love the fact that that you let big Petey sleep on your stomach, even though it was uncomfortable.  (I cannot say that I am that good of a cat parent....I would have probably rolled over quick.)

Stay strong, and sending you well wishes and vibes....

 

[losna]

Many good wishes your way!!

I have very little to add, everything everyone else has said is far more knowledgeable than anything I might have to offer. 

Though I will emphasize what @cat nap  said - do not feel badly about adopting him! It really is the best thing you could do for him. Petsmart is an evil, evil place and you have saved him. cat nap is very good at reminding me of that. We may feel badly about moments of sadness for our kitties, but I think that everyone on these forums is giving their cats' good homes and good lives - otherwise why would any of us be here trying to make things better?

Sinbad has had pancreas problems, so I know how much it sucks and how worrisome it can be. But it is clear how much you love your cats, even to me just reading your posts, so I am sure they know it too and are comforted by your presence and affection.  One of the best things you can do for him is to do your best to stop worrying and just focus on loving and caring for him and them. Cats are very good at reading emotions!

 

[feralvr]

AWWWWWW :heart3: on Petey ( BIG BOY ) sitting on your lap and good news that he was interested in sitting outside Bob's room. Making sure he can't get out :lol3:. I think this will all work out as long as you keep the pace slow with intros. AND - since Petey has become ill then apparently HE is seeing to it. :nod:

MEGA MEGA VIBES for the specialist visit today. My kitty Pip, whom I recently lost, had Pancreatitis as well amongst many other health issues though. It was not the Pancreatits that took him. Anyway - I also took him to the specialist on many occasions. Stress does play a role in these health issues (especially affecting the bladder) with some cat's and other's stress doesn't seem to phase them at all. My Pip always reacted to stress and it caused his FIC to flare (Idiopathic Cystitis). You may want to discuss possible calming regimes for Petey. I did that for Pip and when I knew a stressful situation was coming up, he got his meds. Helped tremendously.

Again, don't worry about dear Bob. A few extra days (or couple of weeks) is really the best way to go anyway! I am sure the cries break you heart but be assured that he is safe, secure and NOT suffering in anyway. In a few days, he will certainly settle down and know the routine. Cat's always do. :nod: :bigthumb: He is just a bit nervous and trying to figure things out. Once the routine is established and he knows he can rely on it, then he will settle.

Thinking of you and Petey and ramping up the vibes.

 

[veronica00]

@Losna  I think PetSmart is an evil place too which is why I'm so surprised at how upset Bob seems. I'm really starting to question whether I should keep him. I can't let him out of that room for at least a week, Petey has to be 100% before that happens and even then I am very nervous about it. I do not want him getting sicker and needing to be hospitalized.

I also think Bob's cries are stressful for Petey, he stares at the door like he's freaking out. On top of that I have someone who is going to take my dog for a couple day trial basis and I have no idea if that is the right decision. I love him very much but he needs a mom/dad who can be home and not work an 8-5:30 job 5 days a week. He stresses me out when I'm at home on weekends and I always wondered if he stressed the cats, now I know...he does. I just want to make the right decisions for everyone's well being and in the process I feel like I'm losing my mind. 

 

[losna]

 @veronica00    A week is no big deal! Heck a month is no big deal. When we adopted Tempest and Sinbad we were told that a month or more in her safe room wouldn't be unusual. Of course, she is still in there, but that has to do with wanting to avoid being jumped by Sinbad the cuddlefiend.

I went through the same questioning process with Sinbad. He cried and cried and cried. But he settled down, and so will Bob. Change is scary for cats. I have no idea how they got their reputation for chaos, when they really are very attached to order and routine. I'm still at less than a year with them, and I've already figured that out! 

 

You care for them and are trying your best. That's what you have to keep in mind. A few weeks really is nothing when it comes to introductions to new cats and a new house. 

 

[feralvr]

 I think PetSmart is an evil place too which is why I'm so surprised at how upset Bob seems. I'm really starting to question whether I should keep him. I can't let him out of that room for at least a week, Petey has to be 100% before that happens and even then I am very nervous about it. I do not want him getting sicker and needing to be hospitalized.

I also think Bob's cries are stressful for Petey, he stares at the door like he's freaking out. On top of that I have someone who is going to take my dog for a couple day trial basis and I have no idea if that is the right decision. I love him very much but he needs a mom/dad who can be home and not work an 8-5:30 job 5 days a week. He stresses me out when I'm at home on weekends and I always wondered if he stressed the cats, now I know...he does. I just want to make the right decisions for everyone's well being and in the process I feel like I'm losing my mind. 

I get the losing your mind feeling. It can be SO overwhelming when these difficult issues come up all at the same time. I think at this point you have to do what YOU think is best for yourself and for Petey too. Just don't make any hasty decision yet regarding Bob as I am hoping that in a day or two he will quiet down and settle. I have to say that I think the Petsmart adoption centers are really good for the cat's and they really do make tons of adoptions that way. Bob's cries have nothing to do with Petsmart as he is only dealing with the now and trying to adjust AND he will!! I know this was really, really tough timing to bring in another kitty with Petey taking it so hard and becoming ill but there is every hope and certainty that he will accept this new addition and change. It just takes time and some hurdles to overcome. :cross:

Since you have been already going over the dog situation for some time then that decision is the right one to try. I hope it works our for you dog and the new people. :cross: Maybe after the dog goes for a few days, things will be easier for you too and then things will settle down and you can relax a little more. :nod: One less issue to fret over.

How did the Specialist visit go with Petey?

 

[cat nap]

 I think PetSmart is an evil place too which is why I'm so surprised at how upset Bob seems. I'm really starting to question whether I should keep him. I can't let him out of that room for at least a week, Petey has to be 100% before that happens and even then I am very nervous about it. I do not want him getting sicker and needing to be hospitalized.

I also think Bob's cries are stressful for Petey, he stares at the door like he's freaking out. On top of that I have someone who is going to take my dog for a couple day trial basis and I have no idea if that is the right decision. I love him very much but he needs a mom/dad who can be home and not work an 8-5:30 job 5 days a week. He stresses me out when I'm at home on weekends and I always wondered if he stressed the cats, now I know...he does. I just want to make the right decisions for everyone's well being and in the process I feel like I'm losing my mind. 

I get the losing your mind feeling.

It can be SO overwhelming when these difficult issues come up all at the same time. I think at this point you have to do what YOU think is best for yourself and for Petey too. Just don't make any hasty decision yet regarding Bob as I am hoping that in a day or two he will quiet down and settle. I have to say that I think the Petsmart adoption centers are really good for the cat's and they really do make tons of adoptions that way. Bob's cries have nothing to do with Petsmart as he is only dealing with the now and trying to adjust AND he will!! I know this was really, really tough timing to bring in another kitty with Petey taking it so hard and becoming ill but there is every hope and certainty that he will accept this new addition and change. It just takes time and some hurdles to overcome.

Since you have been already going over the dog situation for some time then that decision is the right one to try. I hope it works our for you dog and the new people.

Maybe after the dog goes for a few days, things will be easier for you too and then things will settle down and you can relax a little more.

One less issue to fret over.

How did the Specialist visit go with Petey?

I don't actually feel that Petsmart is an awful place, but rather only meant that Bob might just be wanting to see actual people, and feeling bored. 

I also believe like Feralvr, that petsmart and other pet stores, that have the corporate funds, and advertising to promote cat adoptions, is a good thing. 

But that is neither here, nor there, now.

The main focus is Petey, and how he is doing? Did the vet's give you a definitive diagnosis, and plan for how to proceed?

(I know this might not be a good idea, but would it be so wrong to let Bob out, and about....since you mentioned that he was very laid back, and he may just stay away from Petey...because cats do sense, smell, know,....when another cat in their household is ill. (my older cat would not even go near the younger one for a week, during his illness.)

(I don't know, it may be a lousy idea, but since you are already thinking of returning Bob, then it may not matter.)