Acidity And Raw Cat Food...one Problem Solved...another One Introduced

[james kelly]

My cat has food intolerance resulting in diareha and bloody stools when eating canned food of any type of protein Ive literally tried them all except for kangaroo.
Finally I tried ....raw....Raw food solved the problem...stools became firm and no more blood in them either,,, and the diareha stopped.... but a new problem has started about 2 weeks into putting him on raw
He vomits after eating the raw food due to the stomach acid being produced to digest the raw food
It first started during the night on an empty stomach....just bile...clear...etc
Then a few days later ...after each meal...about 30 minutes or less...and it continues throughout the morning
He never vomited from canned food ....it was only when I switched him to raw that the vomiting started
He has only vomited once or twice since he was a kitten...hair balls...He is about 1 year old...his problem has always been colitis and not stomach issues
I read that vomiting while transitioning is due to acidity which is needed to digest raw food.When a cat eats raw food the pH is 1 or 2
When eating cooked food it is 4 or 5
I have tried feeding him smaller more frequent meals but nothing works.
I presume this to be a transition problem...from canned to raw...and not a problem of raw food in itself which is natural

I am feeding him raw rabbit with bones which is grinded ...it includes the carcass,kidney and liver...I buy it frozen...it has no veggies

Anyway while on raw after 2 weeks,,,The vomiting reached a point that he refused to eat anything raw or canned because his stomach was probably too upset...and I had to abandon the raw food all together ..cause he wouldnt eat at all...Im giving him pepcid temporaily and hes back on canned..hes had blod work and xrays and nothings showing up as to the cause..
I was able to switch him over to raw in the period of 2 weeks...it was only after he was taking 100 percent raw that the colitis went away...I switched him over fairly quickly becuaase the colitis was getting quite bad ...

Any ideas as to how to stop the vomiting from the raw if it is due to acidity?
I know it is a bit of a presumption thinking that it is due to acidity,, ..but thats the only thing i could come up with... How do i overcome this when transitioning him...

I would like to keep him on raw food but its like i am trading one problem for another problem.I dont see how changing animal source such as trying chicken or beef would change the acidity problem...canned chicken always seemed tobbe the most irritating to his colon so thats why I didnt t try it and rabbit seems to be the one recomended for cats with gastro problems due to imflamation cused by food allergy...which is why I went with the rabbit...

Thanks
james

 

[valentine319]

Hi James, I'm wondering if the transition was too fast. Maybe someone more of an expert can chime in. I'm thinking something like needing GI support in this if the article below it doesn't help.
Common Raw Feeding Mistakes That Can Be Harmful to Your Pet

Here's a good article. Just to confirm it's vomiting and not regurgitatation.
Let's Talk About Cat Barf - Feline Nutrition

I would start with the second article. How many meals are you feeding? I'm assuming you are feeding warmed? Even if kitty will eat raw cold it can make them vomit. Raw rabbit ground from where, if not a ready to eat brand (like Rad Cat) what supplements are you adding? Is it whole carcass grind or meat/bone/organ at what ratios ? Are you using any probiotic support?

If all that seems good then it would be worth a diet consultation with Dr. Pierson, or some other well-qualified nutritional expert veterinarian. Those consultations aren't cheap, but they will tailor a diet specifically for your pet.

I'm sure some experts will chime in.

 

[ralphscats]

My cat has food intolerance resulting in diareha and bloody stools when eating canned food of any type of protein Ive literally tried them all except for kangaroo.
Finally I tried ....raw....Raw food solved the problem...stools became firm and no more blood in them either,,, and the diareha stopped.... but a new problem has started about 2 weeks into putting him on raw
He vomits after eating the raw food due to the stomach acid being produced to digest the raw food
It first started during the night on an empty stomach....just bile...clear...etc
Then a few days later ...after each meal...about 30 minutes or less...and it continues throughout the morning
He never vomited from canned food ....it was only when I switched him to raw that the vomiting started
He has only vomited once or twice since he was a kitten...hair balls...He is about 1 year old...his problem has always been colitis and not stomach issues
I read that vomiting while transitioning is due to acidity which is needed to digest raw food.When a cat eats raw food the pH is 1 or 2
When eating cooked food it is 4 or 5
I have tried feeding him smaller more frequent meals but nothing works.
I presume this to be a transition problem...from canned to raw...and not a problem of raw food in itself which is natural

I am feeding him raw rabbit with bones which is grinded ...it includes the carcass,kidney and liver...I buy it frozen...it has no veggies

Anyway while on raw after 2 weeks,,,The vomiting reached a point that he refused to eat anything raw or canned because his stomach was probably too upset...and I had to abandon the raw food all together ..cause he wouldnt eat at all...Im giving him pepcid temporaily and hes back on canned..hes had blod work and xrays and nothings showing up as to the cause..
I was able to switch him over to raw in the period of 2 weeks...it was only after he was taking 100 percent raw that the colitis went away...I switched him over fairly quickly becuaase the colitis was getting quite bad ...

Any ideas as to how to stop the vomiting from the raw if it is due to acidity?
I know it is a bit of a presumption thinking that it is due to acidity,, ..but thats the only thing i could come up with... How do i overcome this when transitioning him...

I would like to keep him on raw food but its like i am trading one problem for another problem.I dont see how changing animal source such as trying chicken or beef would change the acidity problem...canned chicken always seemed tobbe the most irritating to his colon so thats why I didnt t try it and rabbit seems to be the one recomended for cats with gastro problems due to imflamation cused by food allergy...which is why I went with the rabbit...

Thanks
james

What is the temperature of the raw? If fed while still frozen or too cold, it could cause vomiting.

 

[mrsgreenjeens]

I have absolutely no idea if using Digestive Enzymes might help with your particular situation, but when I started feeding raw, I added them to their food, along with probiotics, to help make the change easily on their digestive tracts.

 

[orange&white]

If he's eating really fast, he could be regurgitating instead of vomiting like the article valentine linked differentiates. You could slow him down by offering more meals of smaller portions, or add some large chunks of meat to the mix so he has to chew.

Does the vomit look like digested food or "whole" food?

 

[valentine319]

Here's more info worth reading.
Feline Inflammatory Bowel Disease: Nature and Treatment - Feline Nutrition

 

[james kelly]

Hi James, I'm wondering if the transition was too fast. Maybe someone more of an expert can chime in. I'm thinking something like needing GI support in this if the article below it doesn't help.
Common Raw Feeding Mistakes That Can Be Harmful to Your Pet

Here's a good article. Just to confirm it's vomiting and not regurgitatation.
Let's Talk About Cat Barf - Feline Nutrition

I would start with the second article. How many meals are you feeding? I'm assuming you are feeding warmed? Even if kitty will eat raw cold it can make them vomit. Raw rabbit ground from where, if not a ready to eat brand (like Rad Cat) what supplements are you adding? Is it whole carcass grind or meat/bone/organ at what ratios ? Are you using any probiotic support?

If all that seems good then it would be worth a diet consultation with Dr. Pierson, or some other well-qualified nutritional expert veterinarian. Those consultations aren't cheap, but they will tailor a diet specifically for your pet.

I'm sure some experts will chime in.

Hello
Its possible it was too fast but then it was gradual over a period of 10 days and i started out with about 10 percent raw and 90 percent canned and changed it over thi s period to greater amounts of raw
The vomiting only started when I went to 100 percent raw .yes it is warmed.I get it from a local pet shop which makes their own raw pet food, here is a link to the place I buy from
First sign of vomiting was during the night sevral hours after feeding..so if i fed him at 11 pm ...there would be clear bile in the morning...clear liquid foamy,,,bile...which is sign of an acidity problem going on and then it progressed to vomiting after each meal ...bout 30 minutes after. folowed by more wretching over several hours...this doesnt seem like a regurgitation problem...its more of a digestive problem...
He doesnt eat quickly...at all especially if its raw and he does chew
The place i obtain the rabbit is locally from a pet shop/They specialize in provvidng raw pet food locally and are very well recieved by the public who use them.They get the rabbit and other raw meat from a locally goevernment inspected abbatoir

Yes it is whole carcass grind or meat/bone/organ but i dont know the ratios as they arent stated ...just the ingrdeients
i feed him breakfast,lunch dinner and evening....and sometimes more since i read feeding small amounts is better when transitiong rather then 2 or 3 meals
I havent been able to find any good holisitic vets in my city....so I guess I will have to use the Internet and consultations to figure out what is wrong...my vet of course...who is of cpurse no help...now hes back on the hypoallergenic cat food and took a bit of pepcid which seems to have resolved the direha and vomiting problem...for now...
But i want to get him back on the raw ...when things settle down...
300 dollars at the vet Xrays showded no bone fragmentsin... his digestive tract and blood tests were fine...no temperature...ughhh as I knew they would be...she gave him an injection of famotidine for the stomach acidity...
She wants me to deworm him but i refused that..
Today he is better since I stopped the raw rabbit yesterday but until I can figure out how to proceed from here...I have to go back to .. hypoallergenic Royal canin dry which is mostly rice and hydrolysed soy...its not a long term solution but i need time to figure it out...
Thank you for the links

 

[james kelly]

I have absolutely no idea if using Digestive Enzymes might help with your particular situation, but when I started feeding raw, I added them to their food, along with probiotics, to help make the change easily on their digestive tracts.

thank you...i am using probiotics and enzymes presently

 

[james kelly]

My cat has food intolerance resulting in diareha and bloody stools when eating canned food of any type of protein Ive literally tried them all except for kangaroo.
Finally I tried ....raw....Raw food solved the problem...stools became firm and no more blood in them either,,, and the diareha stopped.... but a new problem has started about 2 weeks into putting him on raw
He vomits after eating the raw food due to the stomach acid being produced to digest the raw food
It first started during the night on an empty stomach....just bile...clear...etc
Then a few days later ...after each meal...about 30 minutes or less...and it continues throughout the morning
He never vomited from canned food ....it was only when I switched him to raw that the vomiting started
He has only vomited once or twice since he was a kitten...hair balls...He is about 1 year old...his problem has always been colitis and not stomach issues
I read that vomiting while transitioning is due to acidity which is needed to digest raw food.When a cat eats raw food the pH is 1 or 2
When eating cooked food it is 4 or 5
I have tried feeding him smaller more frequent meals but nothing works.
I presume this to be a transition problem...from canned to raw...and not a problem of raw food in itself which is natural

I am feeding him raw rabbit with bones which is grinded ...it includes the carcass,kidney and liver...I buy it frozen...it has no veggies

Anyway while on raw after 2 weeks,,,The vomiting reached a point that he refused to eat anything raw or canned because his stomach was probably too upset...and I had to abandon the raw food all together ..cause he wouldnt eat at all...Im giving him pepcid temporaily and hes back on canned..hes had blod work and xrays and nothings showing up as to the cause..
I was able to switch him over to raw in the period of 2 weeks...it was only after he was taking 100 percent raw that the colitis went away...I switched him over fairly quickly becuaase the colitis was getting quite bad ...

Any ideas as to how to stop the vomiting from the raw if it is due to acidity?
I know it is a bit of a presumption thinking that it is due to acidity,, ..but thats the only thing i could come up with... How do i overcome this when transitioning him...

I would like to keep him on raw food but its like i am trading one problem for another problem.I dont see how changing animal source such as trying chicken or beef would change the acidity problem...canned chicken always seemed tobbe the most irritating to his colon so thats why I didnt t try it and rabbit seems to be the one recomended for cats with gastro problems due to imflamation cused by food allergy...which is why I went with the rabbit...

Thanks
james

raw thawed rabbit ...includes carcass bones,liver etc ...Comes frozen...thaw in refrigerator..nicely ground...no large bone fragments...but there are fragments...maybe ground more finely would help

 

[james kelly]

What is the temperature of the raw? If fed while still frozen or too cold, it could cause vomiting.

its fed at room temp or sllightly warm

 

[james kelly]

If he's eating really fast, he could be regurgitating instead of vomiting like the article valentine linked differentiates. You could slow him down by offering more meals of smaller portions, or add some large chunks of meat to the mix so he has to chew.

Does the vomit look like digested food or "whole" food?

if he vomits after several hours there is no food...its just saliva or bile...clear...no blood...but if its after hes eaten...such as 30 minutes then its undigested food...

 

[orange&white]

How long has it been since your vet ran a CBC panel and urine test for kidney function?

I have read that some cats and dogs can have a herx, or detox, reaction to changing to natural food, but I don't think it's very common. A good physical exam with blood and urine tests would give you a baseline just to make sure everything is working properly.

 

[james kelly]

How long has it been since your vet ran a CBC panel and urine test for kidney function?

I have read that some cats and dogs can have a herx, or detox, reaction to changing to natural food, but I don't think it's very common. A good physical exam with blood and urine tests would give you a baseline just to make sure everything is working properly.

They checked his kidneys and did a CBC...along with xray ...its all normal

 

[valentine319]

Saw these articles and thought maybe your cat is still having signs of colitis associated with ibs. The seconds one discusses vomiting.
What to feed cats with feline IBS, diarrhea, or frequent hairballs

Inflammatory Bowel Disease in Cats | Little Big Cat

What Causes Inflammatory Bowel Disease?

Maybe raw helped the diarrea but there's still issues. The first one has some good food options if raw isn't one right now.

 

[valentine319]

That's all I can come up with. The food looks fine. You've done everything you should. I've ordered boneless grind from hare-today (it's fine grind) and it looks like that. Amazing follow up on your behalf. Maybe someone else has something we're all missing or a novel idea. But for now you have to feed something the kitty can eat, can't disagree with you on that.

 

[james kelly]

Saw these articles and thought maybe your cat is still having signs of colitis associated with ibs. The seconds one discusses vomiting.
What to feed cats with feline IBS, diarrhea, or frequent hairballs

Inflammatory Bowel Disease in Cats | Little Big Cat

What Causes Inflammatory Bowel Disease?

Maybe raw helped the diarrea but there's still issues. The first one has some good food options if raw isn't one right now.

thank you for the links.I will check them out

James

 

[james kelly]

That's all I can come up with. The food looks fine. You've done everything you should. I've ordered boneless grind from hare-today (it's fine grind) and it looks like that. Amazing follow up on your behalf. Maybe someone else has something we're all missing or a novel idea. But for now you have to feed something the kitty can eat, can't disagree with you on that.

I really am disappointed about leaving the raw (temporaily) becuase I actually found success...so I know it works...his stools went to nornal almost overnight when I switched him over 100 percent raw....i do have some options...a different protein ..possibly chicken or beef... or a different brand..but generally rabbit is the best first choice when it comes to choosing a raw novel protein...
I can make my own raw rabbit food without bones by buying rabbit from a local store and the adding a premix such as Alnutrin
A Guide To A Balanced, Homemade Cat Food - Alnutrin Supplements
Since i already have the mix I might try that...I also have some TC feline mix i could try using my own raw meat..so I still hae a few options left

 

[orange&white]

I hope you can find something that will work for you. I've had such good results with raw feeding, but I didn't start with any health issues. It just seems like it's the most natural healthy diet for cats. You might try larger chunks of your own meat with the supplements. Larger chunks may take a little more time to digest (putting that stomach acid to work to a benefit) rather than the ground which wouldn't require as much acid to digest. (Just a theory.)

 

[james kelly]

I hope you can find something that will work for you. I've had such good results with raw feeding, but I didn't start with any health issues. It just seems like it's the most natural healthy diet for cats. You might try larger chunks of your own meat with the supplements. Larger chunks may take a little more time to digest (putting that stomach acid to work to a benefit) rather than the ground which wouldn't require as much acid to digest. (Just a theory.)

 

[james kelly]

Thanks i will give some thought to using large chunks.
Right now Im waiting for his appetite to return and make sure the vomiting is over before trying the raw once again. Since I have taken him off the raw 2 days ago the vomiting has stopped but his appetite hasnt quite fully returned yet so I have to be [atient and take things slowly