A Switch Flipped, Now My Cats Hate Each Other. What Can We Do?

[Catfamily3000]

I have two cats--a male (15 months) and a female (almost 3 years). They've lived together since March. The introduction was tough, but they've tolerated each other and we've had a happy home since April. Recently, a neighborhood cat has been showing up on the porch. The first time it was cute. The second it was loud. The third time it was scary (both of our cats freaked, one turned to run but ran into the other and they started fighting terribly).

And since, they can't be in the same room without screaming, trying to fight for serious damage and the female cat pooping and peeing everywhere. We've tried keeping them separate, but they stay by the doors and rush out at any chance, creating more fights, more cat screams and more poop/pee everywhere.

We're at a loss for what to do. We're trying to do the reintroduction, but having trouble with it--the rushing out the doors and escalating fights are so discouraging.

Plus, we have a baby in the house and the cats have already re-directed aggression at both me and my wife (leaving some pretty deep scratches both times). We're worried that the baby will somehow get caught between them sometime. Ahhh.

What can we do? Will they ever be cordial again? How was their relationship so damaged from just that one instance?

 

[Catfamily3000]

Sorry, I don't know how to edit the post, but the male is neutered and the female is spayed. We got the male from a shelter when he was about 8 months old. We got the female from a friend who had kitties at around 8 weeks.

 

[FeebysOwner]

You have to find a way to get rid of the cat that is showing up - cat deterrent sprays, whatever it takes. Finding out who it belongs to - if anyone - could help. Your cats would appear to have re-directed aggression - as you mentioned - due to the other cat that showed up. You will need to treat it as a total re-introduction, as if they were new to each other. But, getting the other cat to stay away will be key, as it could be continuing to aggravate both of them. See if these articles will help any with making a plan -
Re-directed Aggression In Cats
Why Do Cats Attack?
How To Successfully Introduce Cats: The Ultimate Guide
How To Fix An Unsuccessful Cat Introduction
Cats And Babies: All Your Questions Answered!

 

[Catfamily3000]

You have to find a way to get rid of the cat that is showing up - cat deterrent sprays, whatever it takes. Finding out who it belongs to - if anyone - could help. Your cats would appear to have re-directed aggression - as you mentioned - due to the other cat that showed up. You will need to treat it as a total re-introduction, as if they were new to each other. But, getting the other cat to stay away will be key, as it could be continuing to aggravate both of them. See if these articles will help any with making a plan -
Re-directed Aggression In Cats
Why Do Cats Attack?
How To Successfully Introduce Cats: The Ultimate Guide
How To Fix An Unsuccessful Cat Introduction
Cats And Babies: All Your Questions Answered!

Thank you so much for the advice and articles. Do you think they'll ever be the same? It feels like they're on a mission to seriously harm each other.

 

[FeebysOwner]

There are many members who have posted about similar situations, and they were able to get things back on track with a little time, patience, and effort. If your cats just tolerated each other, you probably won't get any farther than that, but you should be able to get back to where it was before. It could happen faster than you think - especially if you can get that other cat to stay away. Pay attention to getting things on track with the baby and them as well; that could have set them off a bit in the first place.

Hopefully, you will soon hear from some of those members who have dealt with similar situations!

 

[rubysmama]

Sorry you're dealing with re-directed aggression between your cats. FeebysOwner has already posted links to most of the same articles I was thinking of. There are these ones on stress that might be helpful:

Is Your Cat Stressed Out?
You, Your Cat And Stress | TheCatSite
Potential Stressors In Cats - The Ultimate Checklist | TheCatSite
Six Surefire Strategies To Reduce Stress In Cats | TheCatSite

One idea you might try is dabbing a drop of vanilla extract on both cats so that they smell the same. That is more for non-recognition aggression, but might work in this case too. Here's more info on that: Ode to vanilla extract | TheCatSite

 

[ArtNJ]

Redirected aggression is normally not a long lasting thing, but if they fight because of redirected aggression and cause each other pain, then its not really redirected aggression anymore; instead, its a reaction to the fight. Humans have something similar right -- sometimes it doesn't matter what stupid thing started the fight. Your mad because of the way the fight went, the things that were said.

Anyway, what you need to do has already been covered. Try and prevent that cat from coming around (easier said than done) and do a reintroduction process.

I'll tell you one thing that doesn't work. Don't go out and yell at the cat, or try to squirt it or throw water. In my experience, outside cats realize humans are slow as *&^! and not at all scary if they just back off temporarily. The only thing you will accomplish is making the neighbors think you are nuts. I've tried this sort of thing with two "enemy" cats and it worked with neither. I knew it was stupid, but I was worried -- at least one of the enemy cats was a known fight-to-injure cat -- and I thought it might work. It doesnt.

 

[Catfamily3000]

Sorry you're dealing with re-directed aggression between your cats. FeebysOwner has already posted links to most of the same articles I was thinking of. There are these ones on stress that might be helpful:

Is Your Cat Stressed Out?
You, Your Cat And Stress | TheCatSite
Potential Stressors In Cats - The Ultimate Checklist | TheCatSite
Six Surefire Strategies To Reduce Stress In Cats | TheCatSite

One idea you might try is dabbing a drop of vanilla extract on both cats so that they smell the same. That is more for non-recognition aggression, but might work in this case too. Here's more info on that: Ode to vanilla extract | TheCatSite

I'll try the vanilla today. Thanks so much for your response. These are great articles. I'm reading some for the first time and re-reading the others.

 

[FeebysOwner]

Do keep us posted!!!

 

[Catfamily3000]

Redirected aggression is normally not a long lasting thing, but if they fight because of redirected aggression and cause each other pain, then its not really redirected aggression anymore; instead, its a reaction to the fight. Humans have something similar right -- sometimes it doesn't matter what stupid thing started the fight. Your mad because of the way the fight went, the things that were said.

Anyway, what you need to do has already been covered. Try and prevent that cat from coming around (easier said than done) and do a reintroduction process.

I'll tell you one thing that doesn't work. Don't go out and yell at the cat, or try to squirt it or throw water. In my experience, outside cats realize humans are slow as *&^! and not at all scary if they just back off temporarily. The only thing you will accomplish is making the neighbors think you are nuts. I've tried this sort of thing with two "enemy" cats and it worked with neither. I knew it was stupid, but I was worried -- at least one of the enemy cats was a known fight-to-injure cat -- and I thought it might work. It doesnt.

Thank you for the perspective. It makes more sense when looking at it that way. It feels like the end of the world while you're in the midst of it, so it's good to get this outside perspective and talk through it. We're on the scent swap stage right now and just trying to avoid any more pee/screaming/fighting episodes

 

[calicosrspecial]

Deterrents are a great way to try to keep ferals away but sometimes they work and sometimes they don't.

I am a big believer in confidence (and therefore territorial security) in helping a cat accept what might be perceived as a potential threat (to territory, physicality, food source, etc).

We build confidence through Play, Food, Height and Love. So I would step up play especially in the areas the cats are sensing (through sight or smell) the ferals. Really good play sessions and feed treats after play. Also, just feel free to provide treats in those areas even if there was no play session. This helps make a positive association to that area and it it shoes that nothing actually is negative (it is a positive experience). Height gives confidence so if there is a way to give them a cat tree there so they can go above the cat (that may be below the window, or at the door) that can possibly be helpful. Or a window perch or a cabinet (if it is there). It isn't totally necessary and can be in other parts of the house. But allowing a cat to go high can build confidence as they can surveil the area. Also, have scent soakers around where the feral may be can be a good idea to help increase the feeling of "ownership" in that area since scent is ownership. So scratching posts are really good as are cat trees. Or even an old shirt with their scent on it. Something to give them that territorial security. The finally, "love" which is feeding treats, petting and getting the cats to purr in that area (if you can do it safely without being at risk of being hurt in any way), talking to them in a calm, confident and loving way. All the things that can help them feel more loved and secure and confident. Reassuring them.

As they get more confident and territorial secure they should be more accepting of these potential "threats" in their minds and therefore not feel the redirected aggression need. A confident cat is less likely to attack or be attacked.

You can tell confidence by how they walk (tall, tail up, etc), if they act normal, go anywhere (not avoid areas), etc.

Also, keep making positive associations between the resident cats. So feeding them together,trying to make every encounter as positive as possible between them, giving them a lot of warm and comfy places to hang out, etc. A lot of the things you did to get them introduced.

You can fix this so don't worry. This is something we deal with all the time and can be solved with effort and knowledge. If you have any questions please feel free to ask. Hang in there, you can solve this issue.

 

[Catfamily3000]

Deterrents are a great way to try to keep ferals away but sometimes they work and sometimes they don't.

I am a big believer in confidence (and therefore territorial security) in helping a cat accept what might be perceived as a potential threat (to territory, physicality, food source, etc).

We build confidence through Play, Food, Height and Love. So I would step up play especially in the areas the cats are sensing (through sight or smell) the ferals. Really good play sessions and feed treats after play. Also, just feel free to provide treats in those areas even if there was no play session. This helps make a positive association to that area and it it shoes that nothing actually is negative (it is a positive experience). Height gives confidence so if there is a way to give them a cat tree there so they can go above the cat (that may be below the window, or at the door) that can possibly be helpful. Or a window perch or a cabinet (if it is there). It isn't totally necessary and can be in other parts of the house. But allowing a cat to go high can build confidence as they can surveil the area. Also, have scent soakers around where the feral may be can be a good idea to help increase the feeling of "ownership" in that area since scent is ownership. So scratching posts are really good as are cat trees. Or even an old shirt with their scent on it. Something to give them that territorial security. The finally, "love" which is feeding treats, petting and getting the cats to purr in that area (if you can do it safely without being at risk of being hurt in any way), talking to them in a calm, confident and loving way. All the things that can help them feel more loved and secure and confident. Reassuring them.

As they get more confident and territorial secure they should be more accepting of these potential "threats" in their minds and therefore not feel the redirected aggression need. A confident cat is less likely to attack or be attacked.

You can tell confidence by how they walk (tall, tail up, etc), if they act normal, go anywhere (not avoid areas), etc.

Also, keep making positive associations between the resident cats. So feeding them together,trying to make every encounter as positive as possible between them, giving them a lot of warm and comfy places to hang out, etc. A lot of the things you did to get them introduced.

You can fix this so don't worry. This is something we deal with all the time and can be solved with effort and knowledge. If you have any questions please feel free to ask. Hang in there, you can solve this issue.

Thank you! This is great. I like trying to help them feel as confident as possible. I need to figure out some height for the cats--any alternatives to the trees?

One problem we had before with play was that our first cat, who loved chasing mice on strings and feathers, totally stopped with the other cat around. She'd only play when she was alone. Is there a known reason cats do that?

 

[Catfamily3000]

Here's a frustrating update from this morning:

Didn't do the vanilla last night because I didn't think they were ready. They responded well to the sock with the other cat's scent (i even put treats on top of the sock so they'd associate the scent with a nice feeling inside).

This morning, when i was going downstairs, the cats bolted through the door of my room and fought. Another pile of pee. More yowling and screaming and puffy-bodied kitties. I used the ironing board (didn't have close access to a broom) to direct one of the cats out of the room.

Feeling like we need to start over at step one. The separation is so hard. Even when I feel like we're making progress, something happens like this and it feels like it undoes all the hard work to that point.

 

[calicosrspecial]

Thank you! This is great. I like trying to help them feel as confident as possible. I need to figure out some height for the cats--any alternatives to the trees?

One problem we had before with play was that our first cat, who loved chasing mice on strings and feathers, totally stopped with the other cat around. She'd only play when she was alone. Is there a known reason cats do that?

Cat shelving can look nice and is very good. Also, coffee tables and end tables arranged can be kind of cool.

On play, that does happen. I think it tends to be a bit of caution between the cats. SO instead of focusing on the toy or "prey" they are wondering if the other cat will attack etc. Sometimes there is a lingering issue hanging over

How was the relationship between your first cat and the other cat? Did they have a bit of a "history"?

SO you got a sock with the other resident cat's scent on it and then fed treats etc and they did well? GREAT. Positive association.

This morning incident - were both cats in the room or was one in the room and one not? Often times if a cat acts like prey the other cat will chase and if they catch up then it can be issues.

How did they act after? Scared, hiding, avoiding?

I would like to understand the "separation" you mention in the last paragraph. Are you doing a re-introduction by keeping them totally separate?

Don't worry, there are always ups and down, steps forward and back. The fact they were getting along tells me they will again. We just need to do the right things. We have the knowledge to help you though it and if you put the effort in I don't see why we can't succeed

Cat sense our emotions so try to be as calm and confident around them as possible. I know it s stressful but if the cats pick up on that (and they will) then they can become more on edge and be more likely to cause issues.

Hang in there, we'll fix it. It may take some time and effort but we'll do it.

 

[Catfamily3000]

Cat shelving can look nice and is very good. Also, coffee tables and end tables arranged can be kind of cool.

On play, that does happen. I think it tends to be a bit of caution between the cats. SO instead of focusing on the toy or "prey" they are wondering if the other cat will attack etc. Sometimes there is a lingering issue hanging over

How was the relationship between your first cat and the other cat? Did they have a bit of a "history"?

SO you got a sock with the other resident cat's scent on it and then fed treats etc and they did well? GREAT. Positive association.

This morning incident - were both cats in the room or was one in the room and one not? Often times if a cat acts like prey the other cat will chase and if they catch up then it can be issues.

How did they act after? Scared, hiding, avoiding?

I would like to understand the "separation" you mention in the last paragraph. Are you doing a re-introduction by keeping them totally separate?

Don't worry, there are always ups and down, steps forward and back. The fact they were getting along tells me they will again. We just need to do the right things. We have the knowledge to help you though it and if you put the effort in I don't see why we can't succeed

Cat sense our emotions so try to be as calm and confident around them as possible. I know it s stressful but if the cats pick up on that (and they will) then they can become more on edge and be more likely to cause issues.

Hang in there, we'll fix it. It may take some time and effort but we'll do it.

i like the idea of cat shelving. Might be the best bet to give some height. one of the cats really likes heights.

their relationship before was fine. They tolerated each other, played with each other (would sometimes get too rough and get hissed at—but never any spraying. A few light scratches on one’s nose happened once or twice). But they coexisted. I don’t know if we did the introduction properly last time. We seem to have trouble keeping them separate in the rooms (which explains the bolting from the door and then the stand offs.)

since I originally posted the thread,we’ve been keeping them completely separate except for the few interactions and fights they’ve had.

tonight, we tried vanilla (we’d been feeding them at each side of the door, trying to build their confidence with play and brushing), but their interaction tonight quickly turned into another screaming match, more urine and hiding. We separate them again after the fights because even after the original skirmish was over, they continued to be in defensive mode with lingering growling tonight, we didn’t want to risk another dust up.

we’re trying to follow the book here, but not seeing a lot of progress. Any other thoughts on what’s worked in the past?

Thank you again so much for your input. And everyone’s positive input and help. It’s really encouraging

 

[rubysmama]

Is the neighbour's cat still showing up? Until that stops, and if that's what's aggravating your cats, I'm not sure what else you can do to try to make them tolerate each other.

A vet checkup might be a good idea, just to ensure neither has a UTI, which can be caused by stress. Another thought is to take both cats to the vet, or a family/friend's home for a visit, just so that they both come home smelling the same. But again, if the vanilla didn't help, and if it's the neighbour's cat that's causing all this, not sure it would help.

Oh, don't think these article links have been posted yet. They might be helpful
How To Solve Litterbox Problems In Cats: The Ultimate Guide | TheCatSite
Litterbox Problems? Here's Why You Should Call Your Vet | TheCatSite
Inappropriate Peeing, Spraying, Toy Obsession And Leg And Hand Nipping | TheCatSite
Spraying: When Your Cat Uses Urine To Mark Territory | TheCatSite

Combat Cat Urine | TheCatSite
How To Remove Cat Urine | TheCatSite
How To Remove Cat Urine Odor From Your Home | TheCatSite

 

[ArtNJ]

Sounds to me like you need to keep them separate for longer if you want a reset. And then before you let them interact, you let them see each other via double stacked baby gates or a door cracked with door jambs. That is an intermediate step. You just aren't ready to let them interact, because fighting undos all progress.

Also sounds like you need improved door security to prevent door darting. What I do is act like a nut with exaggerated foot stomping, with loud random scary vocalisations added in the first few times. Let your family think your a loon and scare your cats back a little, you MUST prevent fighting or the reintroduction process won't work. So do it before you touch the door to back the one cat off; crack the door while stomping and making vocalisations to back the other cat off. If your serious about it, and not afraid of acting like a loon, it will back most cats off and eventually get them to stop trying to dart (although you need to keep up with it).

 

[calicosrspecial]

i like the idea of cat shelving. Might be the best bet to give some height. one of the cats really likes heights.

their relationship before was fine. They tolerated each other, played with each other (would sometimes get too rough and get hissed at—but never any spraying. A few light scratches on one’s nose happened once or twice). But they coexisted. I don’t know if we did the introduction properly last time. We seem to have trouble keeping them separate in the rooms (which explains the bolting from the door and then the stand offs.)

since I originally posted the thread,we’ve been keeping them completely separate except for the few interactions and fights they’ve had.

tonight, we tried vanilla (we’d been feeding them at each side of the door, trying to build their confidence with play and brushing), but their interaction tonight quickly turned into another screaming match, more urine and hiding. We separate them again after the fights because even after the original skirmish was over, they continued to be in defensive mode with lingering growling tonight, we didn’t want to risk another dust up.

we’re trying to follow the book here, but not seeing a lot of progress. Any other thoughts on what’s worked in the past?

Thank you again so much for your input. And everyone’s positive input and help. It’s really encouraging

Cat shelving can look really good AND it gives a couple of benefits. It gives height which builds confidence AND it gives them another escape route from each other so they can choose to "get out of the way" rather than have to get into a confrontation.Cat shelving in "choke point" areas where it is tight and only one route can help especially well.

How did they act after the "rough" play (before the recent issues)? Did either cat hide, or avoid areas, etc? Or did they bounce back to normal quickly?

If they were co-existing fine then you did the intro well.

The reason why they bolt from the room is because a cat doesn't like territory "taken" away (even though it is necessary) and they try to regain that territory (in spite of the potential "risks" - a negative encounter with the other cat).

It is a bit tricky when we have a feral causing territorial insecurity and redirected aggression. Given that they are fighting and now peeing I think we need to keep them totally separated and work on building their confidence individually while also doing a re-introduction (making positive associations starting with feeding on the opposite side of a closed door). And see how they do then do some scent swapping and then site swapping (over time). The goal in this is to build confidence (to better handle the feral that is coming around) AND to make every encounter (whether by scent at first then in time sight) as positive as possible while limiting any negative encounters. So keeping them separate should limit the negative encounters.

The peeing is happening after they have a dust-up, correct? Or is it happening after they see the feral without any negative encounter between the 2 resident cats? Where is the peeing happening? By outside doors or windows? Or in the area of the fight or the area where the other resident cat is?

So I think we need to stop he "dust-ups" to reduce the negative encounters and therefore stop the peeing. That is our first goal. Make sure you are cleaning the pee with an enzymatic cleaner to remove the scent properly.

So keep them totally separated. Also, step up play with each separately in their own territory. Feed treats after play and/or feed a meal by the closed door. And give them love if you can safely. Be as calm and confident around them as possible. If you can get them to purr (if you are not at risk of being hurt) that could be great. Cats sense our emotions so it is important to stay as calm and confident around them as possible. Just help them be in a positive state between each other. This will also (the confidence building) will help them accept the feral.

You are welcome. We'll get through this. It sounds like it started with re-directed aggression because of the feral and then they started getting some negativity between them. So it depends on what is causing the peeing (it could be the feral - territorial insecurity or it could be stress from the negativity between the 2 resident cats). Either way de-escalating and building confidence should stop the peeing and ultimately help with the acceptance of the feral. We'll see how they respond but our first goal is to stop the peeing and make every encounter between the resident cats as positive as possible.

We'll get through this. We should seeing the peeing stop soon. Then we can work on their confidence to handle the feral and then as they get more confident we can make more progress on getting them back together (as a confident cat is more likely to accept and be accepted).

Please update any time and ask anything. This happens all the time and we can fix this.

 

[Catfamily3000]

Sorry to be MIA for a while. The saga continues. But I feel like we're making progress. I just got the baby gates in the mail and am doing some visual introduction today. It's been going well. Paws through the gate, but no hissing or howling. I'm feeling positive.

 

[Catfamily3000]

Is the neighbour's cat still showing up? Until that stops, and if that's what's aggravating your cats, I'm not sure what else you can do to try to make them tolerate each other.

A vet checkup might be a good idea, just to ensure neither has a UTI, which can be caused by stress. Another thought is to take both cats to the vet, or a family/friend's home for a visit, just so that they both come home smelling the same. But again, if the vanilla didn't help, and if it's the neighbour's cat that's causing all this, not sure it would help.

Oh, don't think these article links have been posted yet. They might be helpful
How To Solve Litterbox Problems In Cats: The Ultimate Guide | TheCatSite
Litterbox Problems? Here's Why You Should Call Your Vet | TheCatSite
Inappropriate Peeing, Spraying, Toy Obsession And Leg And Hand Nipping | TheCatSite
Spraying: When Your Cat Uses Urine To Mark Territory | TheCatSite

Combat Cat Urine | TheCatSite
How To Remove Cat Urine | TheCatSite
How To Remove Cat Urine Odor From Your Home | TheCatSite

We haven't really seen the neighbor's cat around anymore. Maybe the cold weather has scared him off.

As for the vet, we haven't taken them in because they've been acting normal otherwise. But maybe that's just me overlooking things. Thank you for the links! I've been working with the enzymes to combat the pee spots. And they haven't sprayed when they've been apart. Just when fighting. So that's good!