update on feral cat and questions

mike5361

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he never lets me get closer than 100 feet so i managed to catch him on my wireless webcam to see if he survived the cold spell without getting frostbite:


after the last two cold spells i could see from the distance he was still alive but since he never lets me get closer than 100 feet i didnt want to post on the "has everyones ferals survived the weather this week?" thread because i couldnt tell if he might have frostbite on his ears etc. i tried to see him on my wireless webcam a few times but had technical problems like low battery, finally i got him on camera last saturday and he looks in good shape, also i could see its a male.

he didnt want to use the styrofoam box made for him i assume because hes so paranoid he has to be deep under a building at this closed for the winter hasidic jewish campsite. the cold temperatures here in upstate NY in the last few weeks were incredibly cold, i think coldest in 10 years, its the first time my boiler started quitting because according to the plumber the air temperature was causing the fuel to "gel up". i couldnt believe my fingers would numb up in the 1/4 mile walk to the campsite even when wearing gloves. i comforted myself telling myself that deers and coyotes make it through the winter and they arent getting purina cat chow with a slice of fat each day. and that if he can make it through this then he will probably make it through the rest of the winter.

but on the negative side i think that means i am going to have to be responsible for having him neutered if i understand correctly.

can you guys see how he keeps looking in the direction that i come from as if its a bit paranoid. every day around 3:30-4:00 i walk to the campsite, and it always waits in the same place under a building for me, we look at each other from the distance and as i get to about 100 feet away it runs under the building and hides. then after i set the food and water trays and walk away it waits about 2 minits after im out of site before coming out for the food. if i then walk back slowly of course it runs and hides again. you can see from the video it keeps checking to make sure im away. i had once noticed what looked like coyote prints leading to the campsite so i wondered if that might be part of the reason for this behavior, but hes not looking around himself hes looking in the direction i come and go from. i found this coyote vs cat footprint comparison:

http://www.backyardnature.net/101/mamkey05.gif

there are supposed to be coyotes around here although i have never personally seen one, my mom says she has seen one.

notice how he eats the dry cat food fast and sort of chokes a little, the black tray on the right side is the water tray, it is tilted but the water had not spilled, there was still plenty of water in it, it looks more like he was just eating as fast as he can to get away as soon as possible.

now that he has survived these last two awful cold spells i feel he will probably survive the winter, but being this paranoid of humans when the campsite starts up again in june i dont see how i will be able to feed him, i have no idea what he will do when the camp starts up with hundreds and hundreds of people, there seems no way he will stay there and certainly not hang around in front of the gate as he is doing in the video. i suppose i will have to move his feeding place away from the camp.

i dont think he was ever mistreated by humans apart from being abandoned at the camp if thats the case, i think the paranoia must stem from the survival hunter/killer instinct, before i started feeding him he had to kill to survive so he must feel that any creature thats bigger than him is a threat.

i always make sure to wear the same red coat when i go to feed him so he knows its me, there are no other people around this place this time of year anyway.

first time i got him on video was December 26th he looks a bit smaller, this was before the front gate was locked so i was able to leave the food under the front building:


its a thankless job feeding a cat that wont let me near him but on the bright side this has forced me to exercise each day, i had been getting into a very sedentary lifestyle and since i cant stand the idea of the cat waiting there for his dinner and being disappointed at me not showing up i absolutely have to do the 1/4+1/4 mile walk every single day plus i often go back the same day out of curiosity to see if he got the food or take back the trays.

mostly i am just really not looking forward to having to trap him to get him neutered.

Ondine says they dont hate you for trapping them because they will appreciate the warmth of being near a heater and nice bedding so this makes me think that trapping him while its still cold will make it more appreciative of its jail, since if done in summer time would only be preventing him from being free.

is this "dog crate" something that can fit in a normal car?
 
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StefanZ

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is this "dog crate" something that can fit in a normal car?
It depends on the crate and on the car.  But it is usually possible. You can maneuvre  felling one or both back seats, and or felling or draw forward or backward the forrard passenger seat...

So for example, a trick for transporting cats who do hate to ride car, is to have them in such a dog crate, in the backseat.  You dont need to have a stationswagon.

They often find it easier being in a big dog crate than a tiny carrier.

I also agree it is often easier to catch them when its unpleasant and rough outside.  they tend to appreciate more to come inside...

Good luck!
 

catwoman707

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Hi Mike,

Well he is sure a cute cat, nice thick coat to keep him as warm as it possibly can in those freezing cold temps. He also looks healthy, no cold, etc.

You are helping him through this weather by feeding him. Temps like that make it hard to find rodents easily.

Yes, it would be a very kind thing for his life and well being to get him neutered. His life will be alot simpler and calm, he will lose the great risk of injury and contracting fiv or felv from being deeply bit by another unfixed male. He will stay closer to "home" rather than wandering off because he is ruled by his hormones, which means safer from predators and other unfixed male cats.

It's good all around for him.

In your last paragraph you said it's a thankless job feeding a cat that won't let you near him. In time I believe you just may not feel quite the same way.

Caring for a cat from a distance can often times create a friendship, a mutual trust, an understanding, and an appreciation for your efforts will be shown in other ways.

It's quite fulfilling, heartwarming, knowing you have changed his entire life.

Who knows, perhaps next year you may even consider creating a warm space for him to hibernate :)

In time you may grow to love and appreciate him as much as he appreciates you, and it's pretty hard to love something and think about it being out there in that temperature.

I'm so glad he has someone who cares.
 

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I totally agree with you catwoman.  My mom had a feral male (white with different colored eyes) that she fed for like 8 or 9 years.  He never let her touch him (although she didn't really try all that hard on the contact thing).  He eventually let her get within a few feet when she was putting the food down but that was as close as it got.  She was crushed when he stopped showing up, probably more so than with any of her other cats that died.  They had a bond even without him ever being domesticated in the least.  Even my dad, who does not like cats at all, became fond of him and was sad when he quit coming around.  Hang in there Mike.  I really think my mom could have domesticated the cat if she had tried more.
 

susank521

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He is an absolute beauty. They really don't hate you for the trapping & neutering. While they are recuperating in the kennel is usually a good bonding experience for both of you. You are providing comfort, safety, and food. He is vulnerable, he knows it, yet instead of hurting him you feed him. You may not recognize a response from him, but he will notice and at least a small measure of trust is gained.  If he's staying under the building, maybe you could put the food/trap closer to it. Then he wouldn't be, and feel, so exposed to danger out in the open. Grrr....coyotes, I have nothing good to say about them! Where will you have the kennel for his recuperation? 
 

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He's beautiful. Thick coat, bright clear eyes, obviously well-fed. I think you're doing a great job with him.

Cats can survive pretty well in cold weather. It gets to around -15 C in the winter here, but the feral cats I feed all grow thick coats and don't seem to have any problems. I have a shelter lined with straw and cardboard for them, but the older ferals have their own place to sleep and it only gets used by last years kittens.

Getting them to trust you can take a long time, I spent over 6 months getting one cat to come close to me. The fact that he waits for you and doesn't run and hide when you approach is a good sign. He's well on his way to trusting you.

In my experience the most traumatic thing about being neutered for male cats is the car ride to the vets. They don't even seem to notice that they've had surgery. It's a very simple operation and, as the others have said, they soon forget about it and go back to seeing you as a regular food source.

Good luck, keep us posted.

 

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One way to gain the cat's trust and establish a bond is to speak to him. Give him a name, and call him by the name when you leave the food.  A cats' eye sight isn't very good--they don't see well across distance--but they recognize their human by scent and voice. Your feral will learn your voice and when you approach and speak to him, he will associate you with the food and come to trust you. When my feral is hunkered down in his house on my porch with his doors covered with blankets and I need to come and go, I always speak to him and let him know it's me so he doesn't get scared. I can also approach him from several yards distance without him becoming afraid or running away because he knows my voice.

My feral doesn't allow me to touch him--he'll flinch at best and swipe at worse--but I can sit within inches of him. He makes steady, unblinking eye contact and allows me to do the same. It's possible to form a deep bond with a cat even if the cat won't allow you to hold or pet him.
 
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mike5361

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im not that concerned about bonding with the cat, i live on my parents property and they have a friend who got lyme disease from rescuing feral cats so they dont like the idea of a feral cat around the property. whats been really good about this for me is it forces me to walk half a mile every single day, i just wouldnt bare to think of the cat waiting in the cold for me and me not showing up with its food.

i really dont want to have to trap and neuter him, but what you guys say is that its important to do this. so im going with the idea that if i can get this done while its still cold the cat will feel happy to some extent for being in a warm dog crate for a while rather than in spring time when it will just feel like its trapped. im going on that thought to motivate me.

i just cant imagine how the situation will change when the camp opens in july with all the hundreds of people, during the summer it is a really crowded hasidic jewish camp with tons of activity, crowds walking up and down the road and things like that. im thinking it wont want to stay at its current den, maybe if i start moving the cats feeding place away from the camp it will keep coming for the food despite changing its location. this seems far fetched but i wonder if someone from the camp might trap it and send it to the aspca?

the previous young cat the campers left behind the previous year was cuter, i really liked the way it looked, i got to see it 20 feet away once, but unfortunately it took me seeing that it didnt make it through the winter in order for me to figure out that i should be helping them.
 
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ondine

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Oh, he is a beauty!  And he looks healthy, too.  Your plans for trapping are good - he does need to be neutered and at least vet-checked.  If I recall correctly, although your parents are not happy about an inside cat, they wouldn't mind the cat in your back yard?  I am thinking that if this is correct, trapping and recuperation will give you a good opportunity to change the cat's territory to your yard.  By confining him in a shed or garage for at least two weeks, he will learn the new area is his new "home."

I am thinking this because with all the activity at the camp during summer, he is definitely going to get overwhelmed (and may be scared away or trapped and taken away).

In addition, the people at the camp really need to be educated about cats.  Even if they leave one a year, it will mean kittens somewhere down the line.  Your don't need that!

Of course, it means your daily walk will be cut out but you can do that anyway
 

msaimee

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Most people don't want to be bothered with trapping a feral cat, unless it's being destructive to property or spraying urine or some other objectionable behavior. Trapping involves either spending money on a trap, or contacting the game commissioner to borrow one. Most people don't want to be bothered unless there's a compelling reason. Feral cats who are trapped and taken to the ASPCA or any other animal shelter are euthanized because they are unadoptable--so I hope this doesn't occur.

If you do decide to trap and neuter him, ask the vet to apply Frontline flea and tick medication. Lyme disease is spread through certain kinds of tick bites, so applying tick medication would eliminate the transfer of lyme disease to humans. Perhaps if you assured your family of this, they would allow him to live on or near your property.

I still would recommend that you speak to the cat so that he learns to recognize and trust your voice. Even if you're not interested in bonding with him (and it seems to me that you actually have bonded with him already), it will make your life easier if he doesn't bolt whenever you arrive to feed him. It will also make it far less scary for him if you trap him and care for him if he knows he's with you.
 

susank521

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I can understand your reluctance to trap him. Honestly, each time I come across one I feel the same way, like good grief, here we go again. It's a commitment you weren't bargaining for and aren't eager to undertake, but the difference it will make in his life is indescribable. And I promise you, you will gain something from the experience, too. MsAimee is right, the voice is so important. The calm, soft voice. I also tap my hand against my thigh 2 or 3 times whenever I approach any of my ferals. Just another way for them to know that it's me.
 

catwoman707

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I keep meaning to say this but if you cover the trap immediately after trapping it will help him not injure his face/nose.

Keeping it covered during the car ride is a huge help with stress in the car.
 
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mike5361

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I keep meaning to say this but if you cover the trap immediately after trapping it will help him not injure his face/nose.

Keeping it covered during the car ride is a huge help with stress in the car.
oh i see, because it might be trying to push its face/nose through the cage(?)
i was thinking that since it waits for me to bring the food between 3:00-4:00 and comes out about 2 minits after i leave the food,  i would be able to bring it to the garage near an electric heater so it would appreciate the heat. im not wanting to do this soon, im just thinking that if im going to do this it should be done while its still cold outside so the heat would make it feel less terrible about being caught.
 
 If he's staying under the building, maybe you could put the food/trap closer to it. Then he wouldn't be, and feel, so exposed to danger out in the open. Grrr....coyotes, I have nothing good to say about them! Where will you have the kennel for his recuperation? 
i originally was leaving the food under the front building in the campsite because the front gate was left unlocked for some reason, but then someone from the camp locked the gate and put a "no trespassing" sign on the gate so ive been leaving the food in front of the gate since then.
 
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susank521

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The kennel in the heated garage sounds perfect! What could he dislike about warmth, safety, and food? You really are awesome for doing this. 
 
 
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mike5361

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The kennel in the heated garage sounds perfect! What could he dislike about warmth, safety, and food?
thanks, good to know. im not 100 percent sure i can do it, im living on my parents property, but it is good that we are talking about this, i can understand why the cat should be neutered.and it just seems to make sense that if it is to be done it should be while its still cold outside so the cat will feel that hes getting something better than trapped.
 
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kittychick

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I'm SO happy your kitty is still doing so well!! He looks very good-as noted above, his eyes are clear, his coat's nice & thick & clean-looking. He's doing great for a guy struggling to survive in one of the nastiest winters in history!!! And that's basically because of you-so feel great about that!!!

I've got a lot of trapping suggestions-although I can't type them right now -but will do so tomorrow or Friday. You might even start a new thread on trapping a very skittish feral in winter. You'll get all kinds of input! But there are definitely right ways and wrong ways-so be sure to read suggestions people give you -& don't be afraid to dig further on the web at reputable sites (I'll list some of those later too)

One thing on the fear of your family of Lyme disease-you seem very computer savvy-so hope you'll do your research on this AND talk to a vet and/or the place that neuters your kitty. One very important thing to know is that a cat CANNOT pass Lyme disease to a humane -even on the rare chance the cat would happen to have Lyme disease. The only way you or your family could get Lyme from the cat is if it is carrying an infected tick directly on it's body that then transfers to you. (You're more like to pick up a tick in the hem of your pants walking). Once you trap the cat, simply check yourself over for ticks as you would anytime you come in from a tick infested area. And then when you have your kitty neutered, have the vet check them over for ticks while he's sedated (most good vets do-but just remind the vet why you're so concerned) & have them apply a flea & tick treatment while they're sedated. And wash the kitty's bedding while he's being neutered. You'll have basically 99.99999% eliminated any chance of getting Lyme from your kitty! Your family will have a better chance getting it going down the road for a walk!

One big reason to strongly consider neutering is a global overpopulation one------just one unneutered male & one unspayed female can make ----in just FIVE years, 4.117 kittens!!!!!!! Now that's a lot of interbreeding-and a lot of unwanted cats & kittens who will never find homes, love, food, shelter. You personally probably wouldn't see even 10% of them, as some kittens wouldn't survive long, and lots of them would, out of necessity, expand "their area." So you can see how neutering just one little guy like yours can make a big difference in stopping a chain that can get out of control quickly!!!!! That's why spaying & neutering is SO critical !!

And you may be amazed (if your family understands the basically non-existent Lyme threat the kitty will cause)& you can spend some time with her (again-lots of us on this site can offer tips on how to make the best of your time together)......you may start to bond with him!!!!!!!!
 

shadowsrescue

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Mike5361,

Any updates on the cat you have been feeding?  I am hoping all is well.  This winter has been brutal.  Please update if you have a chance.
 
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mike5361

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thanks for asking.

hes ok

there was another really bad cold spell a few days ago, but yesterday when i approached to feed i could see from a distance and could see that he is still alive and still has his ears on.

am i right that this last cold spell around march 1st or 2nd was the worst ever?

since the air was warmer yesterday i thought i would leave him a can of tuna instead of the dry (non freezable) purina as a reward for surviving. its difficult to tell from a distance but it looked as if he did a happy jump when he found the tuna.

i cant really say i like this cat that much since i never get to see it up close unless i leave a camera with the food, but it seems to be a godsend in the sense that as a self employed computer programmer i was getting into a more and more sedentary lifestyle, just not wanting to exercise, this forces me to walk to the camp every single day regardless of how cold it is or if raining, it is not that much exercise but it is every single day so it adds up after a while. i wonder what my health would be like if i hadn't started feeding the cat last december.
 Oh, he is a beauty! 
it breaks my heart a little when i think about this but in my opinion the previous little cat they left behind the year before was even nicer looking, with really clear well defined light grey tiger stripes, like a miniature tiger. i dont know if it was male or female. it also let me get closer to it than this one. i wondered to myself should i feed it, how do cats make it through the winter, once i even left a can of tuna in the vicinity of where it seemed to hang out, and the tuna was gone in a couple of hours. i tried to decide wether i should take responsibility for feeding it and finally decided that i shouldnt because i have my own problems to deal with. i wondered how feral cats can survive the winter, the next spring it was never to be seen again. so i did a google search and found that it must have perished. i really i liked the way that cat looked but i guess it took its death to make me learn that i should feed the next one.

i didnt realize that being responsible for feeding a cat 1/4 mile away is like insurance to make sure that i exercise.
One thing on the fear of your family of Lyme disease-you seem very computer savvy-so hope you'll do your research on this AND talk to a vet and/or the place that neuters your kitty. One very important thing to know is that a cat CANNOT pass Lyme disease to a humane -even on the rare chance the cat would happen to have Lyme disease. The only way you or your family could get Lyme from the cat is if it is carrying an infected tick directly on it's body that then transfers to you 
my parents totally know that lyme disease is transferred by ticks that feral cats can carry. their friend took in 3 ferals and got lyme disease so bad he has to take antibiotics for the rest of his life. my mom is about to turn 80 years old this week, shes very healthy and she just wants to enjoy the rest of her life, if she got lyme disease now would be catastrophic.

incidentally their friend lives 25 miles away and all 3 ferals ended up being killed by coyotes, 2 in the same day.

are they color blind? after leaving the food yesterday i walked far away and i was standing in the distance wearing my red jacket, so far away he just looked like a speck on the horizon, and it looked right at me for a while and didnt seem to mind me being there but then when i started to walk away he heard me and ran back under the building. i wonder if the extreme cold temperatures might have made him a little mentally ill, i mean he sees me every day delivering food but still acts like this.
just one unneutered male & one unspayed female can make ----in just FIVE years, 4.117 kittens!!!!!!! 
i had a very serious talk with my parents about trapping and neutering the cat and so far their current stand is that they are against it despite i made it very clear that he could make a female pregnant we could end up with the karma of a pregnant female cat somewhere, that i wont be able to help if i dont know where it is. and that i cant help kittens if i dont know where they are.

they believe in the biblical quote: "Do to others as you would have them do to you."  and since i would never want to be trapped an neutered, i dont know what to say.

they say that animals dont necessarily follow the higher rules such as this but animals try their best and we should respect that.

but i still dont know what is going to happen when the camp restarts and there will be up to half a thousand people there, this cat is paranoid of people and will not want to stay there, on christmas day i found cat prints from the camp to my back door, so the cat probably knows where i live so in june when the camp starts up if it is not possible to get him food, he may know where i am and start coming by, i have no idea what will happen.
 
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shadowsrescue

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Thanks so much for the update.  Also thank you so much for caring for this little guy all winter long.  He certainly would not have survived without you.  Even though he sees you day in and day out, and knows you are the one who brings him food, he is a feral cat and may always be fearful of humans.  I also am sure that he waits for you each day knowing you are the kind man who is feeding him. 

It is true that he may follow you to your home this summer when the camp is bustling with activity, but he also may choose to stay around and have more access to leftover food.  Since he isn't neutered he also will be on the prowl for a female.  He may wander far away as his hormones will drive him to search.  You may never see or know those kittens, bu they will happen. 

Maybe once the weather warms up a bit, you will be able to spend some time with him.  You could sit and talk with him and bring him yummy wet food or special treats.  Food is a very powerful socializer!!

I hope you will update more as we finally approach spring and warmer temps.
 
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