My cat just forced the introduction!

[Babypinkweeb]

Awww... poor Nugget. Vet visits are scary for our kitties. Sorry he has an ear infection, but good that you've got meds for him.

As for the introductions, sounds like things are continuing to go well.

Keep us updated on their progress, as it is not spam.

Thank you for your kind words! I know there's not much discussion here since it's going well, but I dont really have anyone to share my experience and excitement with

Last night Nugget escaped the gates twice in a row and made beeline to Boogie! My gf was there and was scared of fights but when face to face they just give eachother a sweet nose sniff greeting nugget is usually timid during site swap and choose to stick to places with strong Boogie scents, but it's great to see him so eager to run into unfamiliar rooms just to see Boogie.

Here's a sweet moment from today!

 

[rubysmama]

Oh, how precious! I feel they are going to be just fine, and will be best friends, as seeing them together in that pic definitely does not suggest that they will be enemies. Just need to get Nugget's ear infection healed up.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

There was a bit of an unhappy moment today with these 2.

While we are going thru the area moving some stuff from room to room, boogie slipped thru and was exploring Nugget's room again. He eventually hopped into the counter, opposite of Nugget's bed where he was chilling. Neither of them hissed nor growled yet.

When we noticed we decided to be calm and observe. Nugget eventually came out of his bed to sniff noses with Boogie which was returned peacefully... But then Boogie started doing the slaps on Nugget's face again (like 3-4 slaps in a row). Nugget did not hiss but winced, and slowly went back to his bed. After watching for a moment, Boogie went forward and they exchanged another nose sniff. Then came slap session #2, which Nugget eventually responded with a tiny hiss, and Boogie stopped and jumped off the counter and left his room. Boogie's ears and tail were all neutral during this time, and Nugget's ears went back only when he was wincing from the slaps. Nugget never returned any slaps.

Afterwards, both of them continue to walk in and around the gate area, with Nugget coming out to hang out by Boogie thru the gate during Boogie's mid day meal time. Nugget did not seem like he wanted to hide from Boogie at all, and Boogie did not respond either way when seeing Nugget. At one point Nugget was curious about Boogie's meal and sniffed very close to the bowl, their faces an inch apart, and Boogie did not care even after he saw Nugget.

Sorry for so much text as usual, I just want to write down all the details in case it can make a difference in the situation. Based on some googling, I am assuming Boogie is trying to show his dominance/hierarchy, and Nugget is not resisting(yet). If anyone reads this, I'd love your insight!

 

[rubysmama]

It doesn't sound serious to me. However, I've never actually introduced cats, so I don't have actual experience, just have read lots of threads on the topic.

A ArtNJ : if you have a chance, maybe you can give your opinion on how you think this introduction is going.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

It doesn't sound serious to me. However, I've never actually introduced cats, so I don't have actual experience, just have read lots of threads on the topic.

A ArtNJ : if you have a chance, maybe you can give your opinion on how you think this introduction is going.

I didn't want to double post so soon last night because I couldn't edit my post, but the rest of the day made a turn for the better!

After that incident, Nugget never seemed scared and they both continued to cross paths without issues, with Nugget exploring the rest of the apartment excitedly and Boogie kind of following but not stalking. At one point I thought I heard a tussle but my worries were immediately erased as I watched them start mutually play chase!! It started awkwardly as both were unsure of what the other will do, but once it seemed like they both understood it was play, they chased eachother on and off for 3 hours!!!

In between all this they would sometimes stop to rest, at which point they would often be lounging within a foot of eachother. Boogie became very talkative last night, continuously making mrrrp and trilling noises at Nugget.

 

[rubysmama]

After watching that video, I don't think we need A ArtNJ 's opinion, as I think it's clear you've got 2 happy, playful kitties.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

EDIT: A hour after my post here, I think they just had their first actual cat fight. Before there were only instances as mentioned below.

Their meal time was still 15 mins away and we were trying to eat our meal. Nugget likes to hang around and follow Boogie but not in a stalking way. Boogie was being restless all morning meowing at the walls and empty rooms. Right before the fight he was meowing a ton at a wall but we ignored him as we don't want to reward his meows and he was probably just impatient for his meal. It was silent for a bit before we heard a hiss from the bedroom. I immediately went to check and Boogie was by the bed with Nugget under the bed (he's been going in there on and off and I blocked it off). Nugget ran off when he heard me come with Boogie following after. By the time I followed them out, I caught Boogie attacking Nugget, and Nugget was hissing and yowling but not really fighting back much other than defending himself. There was fur flying but no blood or wounds. I separated them with a shout and Boogie CONTINUED to follow and try to smack/bite Nugget. Finally I manage to get them separated enough to grab Boogie and put him in time out in our bedroom. Nugget then came out from under our coffee table and was looking around cautiously. He did not immediately go to hide but eventually went back to his safe room where we let him be with the door closed as well so he can feel secure.

I honestly don't know what to make of this. Literally an hour ago they were eating treats sitting right next to eachother, touching noses... Nugget would walk Infront of his face and his butt or tail would smack Boogie in the face but Boogie would just sniff it or dodge it, literally no sign of aggression. I don't know what happened. Was it because Boogie was feeling hungry and grumpy? I gave them a few pieces of kibble each as treats when I woke up in case Boogie was hungry. Was he feeling playful and bored? But that doesn't explain his aggressive behavior. I don't think it was play on Boogie's part either as when I was trying to grab Boogie to put him in time out he HISSED at me which he did maybe only ONCE in his life!!!

PLEASE HELP ME!!!

-------------------- original post below---------


It's been a relatively good weekend with them at 24 hour free roam.

Once or twice a day Nugget would hiss at Boogie, usually when Boogie smacks Nugget's face repeatedly too much or when Boogie looks like he's trying to grab Nugget and even bite his back. Boogie backs off right after being hissed at, and Nugget sometimes goes back to his safe zone to hang out. Nugget doesn't hide thankfully, and he is back in the main living area before we know it. Other times when Nugget is sniffing Boogie, Boogie would do a little paw swipe at him, but not a full body swing. More like "hey back off" with no aggressive nor fearful body language. When that happens Nugget usually dodges it and trots off with his tail still high. For now I'm trying not to interfere much as Nugget doesn't seem really distressed, and I guess it might be a dominance thing.

The two can manage to sleep pretty near eachother and during the rest of the day can walk by and stand waiting for food side by side. A few times I caught Nugget walking by Boogie and getting rubbing his body and tail against the side of Boogie's body!

 

[rubysmama]

How are things now? Is Boogie still in "time out"?

 

[Babypinkweeb]

How are things now? Is Boogie still in "time out"?

I took him out of time out after about 15 minutes as it was his meal time too. He's still transitioning from free fed to meals so I didn't want to delay it as he has vomited before due to empty stomach especially in the morning. This is why sometimes when I wake up earlier than his meal time I give him a small treat to settle his stomach. Literally 10 minutes before the cat fight I was sitting on the floor giving BOTH cats a few kibble as morning treats and Nugget was still comfortable and in love with Boogie at the time, walking around him and me, sitting next to eachother maybe half an inch apart.

I've brought back the pet gate since Nugget has retreated back to his room, which he hasn't really done in a few days. He's back in his bed in there and feeling very down. I had to hand smear food on his moth for a few minutes before he actually started eating his meal. He didn't sniff my finger nor purr when I pet him. Over the following 2-3 hours I went in and out of his room to gently talk to him and pet him, and now it's at the point where he is just sleeping (they usually sleep around afternoon). But before he slept he manage to get to the point of purring when pet and rubbing his cheek against my hand.

Boogie has since 2-3 times stood outside Nugget's room to meow at the door, no hissing or growling just the meow like when he wants to be let into a room we were in. He was sleeping happily by the window and shows no distress.

I feel terrible this happened as Nugget has come out of his shell due to Boogie. He was so affectionate, happy, loved being around his big brother. Boogie was anywhere from uncaring to tolerating and they engaged in mutual chasing every day as well as sharing play time with toys. Now I feel like Nugget feels hurt and betrayed and back to being lethargic and withdrawn.

I honestly have been doing nothing but worrying and trying to understand what could have caused Boogie to lash out. The initial hiss was similar to something that happened before, where at one point or another Boogie would smack Nugget a little too much, or Nugget just didn't want to chase anymore, but he would immediately back off even if we didn't do anything, and Nugget would return to follow him or hang with him soon after. This time it was so different. Boogie chased after Nugget twice in a row after Nugget hissed and ran away from Boogie, with the last 2 times Nugget letting put more than hissing, like cat yowl/howls and there was fur flying. I hate that I didn't have my glasses on so I can't say what they're ears, claws, tails, fur, etc was like at the fight. My priority was separating them.

 

[rubysmama]

Sometimes with cat introductions, it is one step forward, 2 steps back. Hopefully you're only at a half step back, but keeping them separated again, sounds like a good idea. I think A ArtNJ is following your thread now, so hopefully he'll see this latest development, and give you his opinion on how to proceed.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

Sometimes with cat introductions, it is one step forward, 2 steps back. Hopefully you're only at a half step back, but keeping them separated again, sounds like a good idea. I think A ArtNJ is following your thread now, so hopefully he'll see this latest development, and give you his opinion on how to proceed.

Thank you. I do appreciate you helping me and giving replies when you can! Its hard when you can't communicate with your cats directly to ask them what happened and what's wrong.

 

[She's a witch]

Relax, I don’t think this is as serious to despair. I wouldn’t even call it a setback. My guys are annoyed at each other all the time. I think you would like them to be best friends with good vibes only, but the reality is that in a multicat household, the total harmony is rare, but it’s absolutely not a reason to worry. My guys are not best friends but they like each other and enrich their lives for sure. They are like siblings in their teens, there’s some varying amount of tension between them sometimes but they always go back to being friendly after. I would relax and let them solve this on their own.

 

[ArtNJ]

Well, if it was a real cat fight, and I'm not sure it was, then a separation of a day or so might have been a good idea. Even cats that are besties can benefit from that sometimes when something randomly causes a fight between them. Sometimes they might need a couple hours, sometimes a couple of days. However, its also possible that this was jump a normal bump in the road as She's a witch is opining. Its a little hard to say since it sounds like you didn't see all of the possible cat fight.

Since they were playing with each other, I think you are past the introduction phase and at most you might need to extend the cooling off period with a longer break. Only if a couple days didn't work would I think about backing up to some kind of much longer re-introduction process.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

Relax, I don’t think this is as serious to despair. I wouldn’t even call it a setback. My guys are annoyed at each other all the time. I think you would like them to be best friends with good vibes only, but the reality is that in a multicat household, the total harmony is rare, but it’s absolutely not a reason to worry. My guys are not best friends but they like each other and enrich their lives for sure. They are like siblings in their teens, there’s some varying amount of tension between them sometimes but they always go back to being friendly after. I would relax and let them solve this on their own.

I'm sorry for panicking. I don't mean to but my spouse thinks I might have some kind of anxiety problem and it ended up effecting me more than it probably should they weren't super good vibes all the time but the bad moments were breif and both cats knew to stop and felt fine about it afterwards. I was mostly worried as Nugget is quite a submissive and sensitive boy, and he has almost completely reverted back to his personality at the shelter/when I brought him home. He didn't even want to rub against my hands nor purr which he at least did at the shelter. He hasn't moved from his spot for 8 hours now. I manage to get him to eat some of his favorite treat (boiled chicken).

It was also extremely out of character for my cat Boogie to behave like that, even when he was a young cat he was laid back and sweet with other cats who some even hated him. He's been in loudish spats before, ironically with a bossy bully type of cat, and even those were not as loud as what happens today.

Well, if it was a real cat fight, and I'm not sure it was, then a separation of a day or so might have been a good idea. Even cats that are besties can benefit from that sometimes when something randomly causes a fight between them. Sometimes they might need a couple hours, sometimes a couple of days. However, its also possible that this was jump a normal bump in the road as She's a witch is opining. Its a little hard to say since it sounds like you didn't see all of the possible cat fight.

Since they were playing with each other, I think you are past the introduction phase and at most you might need to extend the cooling off period with a longer break. Only if a couple days didn't work would I think about backing up to some kind of much longer re-introduction process.

I thought it was a cat fight, because although I didn't see it clearly, I was present for most of the "action" and could see big tuffs of fur flying as well as VERY loud vocalization, louder than any spats Boogie has had with a previous bully cat. I know the hissing was definitely from Nugget who was trying to defend himself or run away. I assume the loud yowls were from him as well. Afterwards when I finally separated then, I went to herd Boogie into time out, which he tried to run from me and HISSED at me which made me think it wasn't playful even on his part. He has only hissed at me one time in his life prior and it was when I wore a scary monster mask for Halloween. Nugget's reversion to his withdrawn and scared behavior also made me think this wasn't play.

I will definitely give Nugget all the time he needs to feel confident again. I try to pet and talk to him since when he is withdrawn he doesn't not respond much to food nor play. Boogie seems hardly effected by this minus him meowing outside Nugget's door. I guess I'm just feeling bad for Nugget as he's a sensitive boy, and seeing him change his trust and feelings about us and Boogie so quickly makes me feel like I failed him. Like I could have fed or played with Boogie so he wouldn't have decided to fight him.

 

[ArtNJ]

I'm just feeling bad for Nugget as he's a sensitive boy, and seeing him change his trust and feelings about us and Boogie so quickly makes me feel like I failed him. Like I could have fed or played with Boogie so he wouldn't have decided to fight him.

Nope, not letting you blame yourself. Its not possible to micromanage two cats' relationship via some hypothetical perfect introduction process. They were playing and chilling together. At that point, any of us would tell you that the thing to do is let them work the rest of the tension out themselves. You did nothing wrong. Things happen, even to cats that have been besties for years.

It does sound like a real fight. So definitely give them some time, maybe a full day, take the temperature see if another day or two is needed.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

Thanks to everyone again for helping me during the last issue! I've been trying to hang back and not get too helicopter mom about them which has helped with my anxiety about their interactions as well.

We put Nugget back in his room overnight for 3 nights, until it felt like both of them really wanted to be around each other. We haven't had another full fight so far. The two of them get along quite well so far, are able to be close or far, sharing nose kisses when they come close. Nugget seems to be happy with Boogie for the most part, not showing lingering fear.

Once in a while when they are close and sniffing the other's side of the body, sometimes the receiver would freak out a little. Boogie would give a gentle smack, Nugget would hiss a little and also do a gentle smack (the kind where they hold their paws up but don't always land a hit). However yesterday during a body sniff, Boogie gave Nugget a single lick! Nugget didn't seem to have noticed or reacted.

They try to play chase every night still, although still both kind of stupid. One would happily taunt the other one, run off, and the chaser would chase maybe a feet or two before stopping, and then the runner would peek around like "why aren't you chasing me" Occasionally I see them try to be playful but I think it's still early and both of them are slightly unsure of the reaction of the other.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

Sometimes I think they're playing one sided, as during the day once every few days Nugget would respond defensively if Boogie is pursuing him too much. I thought he was getting randomly bullied but he also wants to come right out?

One time they were chasing and then somehow ended up with Nugget crouching behind toilet while hissing and crying as Boogie is in front only smacking him with front paws. Nugget dropped several tuffs of hair and he looked like he was very distressed with ears back and loud vocals in crouching position so I stepped in. And yet when I separate them, Nugget follows out and REFUSES to be separated for his wellbeing! So I don't think he feels fear for his life even though he is reacting like a drama queen I ended up not giving time out as Nugget just lied down under a table and didn't care...

I caught another moment on security cam, which looked scary as it seems like Nugget tried to bite/did bite Boogie and even threw him down... But footage from after this moment Boogie seemed fine to lie down around Nugget as he kept being hyper for the next hour so maybe it's their awkward attempts to learn how to wrestle?

 

[ArtNJ]

Sounds like totally normal and routine one cat wants to play more stuff. If Nugget is acting fine a few minutes later and even initiating play at times, then all is well. Separating them for a bit when Nugget seems truly miserable is a good idea, just do it gently.

 

[Babypinkweeb]

Sounds like totally normal and routine one cat wants to play more stuff. If Nugget is acting fine a few minutes later and even initiating play at times, then all is well. Separating them for a bit when Nugget seems truly miserable is a good idea, just do it gently.

Gotcha! Just trying to learn what is just Nugget reacting a lot but feeling ok, and what is truly a separation situation. We jokingly call him a little drama queen since he cries so loud but is ok as soon as it's over lol

 

[Suru]

I caught another moment on security cam, which looked scary as it seems like Nugget tried to bite/did bite Boogie and even threw him down...

That looks like totally normal play fighting to me! It seems like Nugget has a looot of energy, and boogie isn’t quite in the mood, and gave him a “not now” bonk.

I have a 3mo kitten and a 3yo cat, and she does that “butt attack” move on my 3yo all the time. Thank goodness he is the most patient cat in the world. He’s quite gentle when play fighting with the Kitten, and even though Kitten is often “dramaqueen” about being pinned down, she always immediately goes back for more.

This has been a very sweet read, keep us updated!

- editing to add that biting is quite normal in play play fighting. My older cat is practically my Kitten’s chew toy...

here he is being chewed on with a very “fml” expression