Russian Blue & Persian Mix?

[mystcl]

Hi All,

Recently i bought a Russian blue/ persian mix.
In this part of Europe, it is not unusual for people to have Russian blues but most of them are not pure Russians.. People sell them but without papers etc.
So, my kitten comes from mother who is pure Russian blue and father who is rb/persian mix.
Saw them both, mother does look like RB while father really does look like RB/persian mix(grey with Persian coat/fur).

As far behaviour is concerned, she is pure Russian. such a gentle and shy animal, with noble behaviour. I had domestic kitten with her for a 2 days and comparing them doesn't even makes sense. They are like two different animals. She doesn't shed which is also one indicator...

So, my questions is : do i really own RB mix or this is pure domestic cat? i don't care TBH, i just want to know.
So, here is Kira, 4 months old RB mix

3 months:

4 months

And sleeping in one of her weird poses


Thanks for your answers

 

[StefanZ]

I dont think there are any definite answers. You have told it all, no?

Re the weird sleeping pose: Tonight I found our younger male RB Lasarus in this exactly pose. I got to touch him to be sure he was alive... But he was warm and did purred happily, so he was OK.

 

[mystcl]

I dont think there are any definite answers. You have told it all, no?

Re the weird sleeping pose: Tonight I found our younger male RB Lasarus in this exactly pose. I got to touch him to be sure he was alive... But he was warm and did purred happily, so he was OK.

Well, yeah.. borders are tight on this one but i guess that there are people who can resolve this in few seconds, or at least i'm hoping so?. I do plan to recommend her sellers to few of my friends who now want to buy RB since they saw how amazing Kira is. I would make a fool out of myself if it turns out they are just domestic grey cats Im no expert but i did a lot of reading in last few months and i think she has RB blood in her.... i guess i need "official" confirmation from some breeder/expert on this manner..

Poses - I never saw her sleeping like a normal cat, always some weird poses and always makes me laugh

 

[Kieka]

The only confirmation on purebred status of her parents is the paperwork of their heritage. There are cats who can look exactly like a specific breed without actually having relation to it and behaviors are not confined to specific breeds. Without paperwork to support the breed heritage she would be a domestic cat and lookalike but not that breed. No one can judge by appearance or behavior in any way that counters the paperwork.

Essentially, if you can't walk into a cat show and support your claim to show her, she isn't that breed in the eyes of the cat world.

As to the sleeping, looks fairly normal cat sleeping to me.

 

[mystcl]

The only confirmation on purebred status of her parents is the paperwork of their heritage. There are cats who can look exactly like a specific breed without actually having relation to it and behaviors are not confined to specific breeds. Without paperwork to support the breed heritage she would be a domestic cat and lookalike but not that breed. No one can judge by appearance or behavior in any way that counters the paperwork.

This is, for example, argument i can't accept. It's like if you buy logitech mouse from store which is not official logitech store, and then people tell you that you don't own a Logitech.. I just cant accept that, sorry. However, i do respect these rules when applied in cat breeders world. You don't accept cat without papers and thats ok. That, however, doesn't mean that cat is not RB. Like i said, in this part of Europe, RBs without a paper are normal thing and there are even homeless RBs for adoption. I know some people who do have RBs without papers but they did a DNA test to confirm. I am aware of the fact i don't own a pure breed cat.

Thanks for info but i need expert to look at the pics and tell me what he thinks. And no, there is no way that cat looks exactly like RB and still is a domestic. It can have some similarities but few things that are specific to RB, no way. I never saw domestic cat with "smiling" mouth like RB has.. and i don't know about domestic who have double coat/fur and are not shedding?
Regarding sleeping pose - i didn't try to take that as an argument, just funny fact.

 

[lutece]

Your kitty does not look like a purebred Russian Blue, but you knew already that she is not a purebred. She also doesn't have the characteristic eye color for a Russian Blue (it should be green). Because she doesn't look very much like a RB, it's not really possible to tell just from looking at her whether she has any RB ancestors.

Persians look completely different from RBs, so it is theoretically possible that if you mixed Persians and RBs, you could get a kitten that looked like this kitten. But why would anyone do that? Normally, breeders don't mix breeds like that.

At four months old, most kittens don't shed much. When she gets older, she will shed like other cats. Russian Blues shed, too.

 

[mystcl]

Your kitty does not look like a purebred Russian Blue, but you knew already that she is not a purebred. She also doesn't have the characteristic eye color for a Russian Blue (it should be green). Because she doesn't look very much like a RB, it's not really possible to tell just from looking at her whether she has any RB ancestors.

Yep, mix. and i saw mother and she is Russian blue. Father is said to be RB/Persian mix but it can also be persian/domestic grey, i can't be sure on that.. so i'm just investigating on how much of Russian "blood" she took with her, i hope you understand
Kittens can have gold/blue eyes which turn to green before 1y of age. i can already see green ribbon showing up. Eyes are the ones i'm tracking the most And she is a mix after all.
Do domestic cats change eyes color as they grow up?

Persians look completely different from RBs, so it is theoretically possible that if you mixed Persians and RBs, you could get a kitten that looked like this kitten. But why would anyone do that? Normally, breeders don't mix breeds like that.

They are not breeders, just regular people.
RB owners got her from a friend who received her as a gift. Apparently, her old cat was not getting along with RB so she decided to give her away.
Her family friends have RB/Persian mix male (who can also be a Persian/domestic grey mix if you ask me).
So long story short, they have agreed to have 2 litters per year and sell kitties to finance each cat for the whole year. They sell them for few hundred euros/piece. There are few similar stories here as well, nothing strange about that.

At four months old, most kittens don't shed much. When she gets older, she will shed like other cats. Russian Blues shed, too.

Every animal shed..even us, humans. RBs shed as well, but its only few hairs per week. They don't have seasonal shed and stuff. I guess i'll know next season

Thanks for info and please don't take my answers as i'm trying to prove she is Russian or something. It's just that i did a lot of reading/talking with people already and i have already discussed most of the things mentioned. It was eyes thing, then i was researching and realised that eyes can be gold as well. Whatever i find agains, i soon find opposite.. so aaagh
I need someone who has experience with RB mixes primarily, just to give his opinion based on a few pics, or i can provide more info in PMs.

 

[mservant]

Well, Kira is a cute kitty for sure. I'm afraid I am from the same 'school' as Kieka when it comes to whether cats are of a particular breed or not as I understand the evidence of breed comes from the documentation or known heritage. That said, cats can have all or most of the breed standards whether or not they have familial history, esp when it is a naturally occurring breed like the Russian Blue. What is often forgotten about and more complex than the physical appearance is the personality and I have met some quite unfriendly certificated pedigree RBs as well as some of the most gentle and loving cats you could imagine. Mouse is all on his own there as he is very gentle and loving when he wants to be and as daft as they come when he doesn't.... and his approach to play is more closely related to a boisterous puppy than an award winning pedigree cat.

Kira's facial features are very pretty, she looks not unlike my cat-buddy Mouse (who is a registered pedigree GCCF European standard RB). Her eyes do look more golden but that may be lighting in your photographs. Her fur looks like it is growing in to a nice, even adult coat without ghost stripes other than on her tail where they are perfectly acceptable, but I can not guess on the texture of her coat so would love to know more on that. It looks less dense in texture than Mouse and her tail shorter than an ideal RB but would love to know how her coat handles when you give her a good pampering and ruffle up - whether it lays down more flat or sticks out from her body. Also whether her fur has that silver sheen from having translucent fur tips? The translucent fur tips are as much of a breed classification as the green eyes.

Mouse prefers to curl his front paws in and show off his pudgy belly to stretching out long and lean but here's a taster of his belly fur.

 

[mystcl]

Hi Mservant and thank you! Mouse is beautiful!
Yes, same with Kira. She is always near me, following but most of the time keeping her distance, like she doesn't want to disturb me. When she wants attention, she lets me know with strange sounds (never heard these from domestic cats) and gentle touches with her paws (she never uses claws on me). She is really gentle and shy, doesn't like other people except my GF and mom, i guess she feels who i love, i don't know but she is ok with them from day 2 and other people - she just runs and hide from them, doesn't want any form of interaction

Here are fee pics of coat...and poses she does that thing with paws all the time, funny. and still funny when i see Mouse doing it they remind me of merkats haha.

Paws


Aaaand, short animation (where you can see coat better):
https://photos.app.goo.gl/TSC9X1dpQv63sAdz5

 

[Wags]

Hi there, Kira is lovely. Rb’s eyes settle anout 8 months and it does start with green around the iris (my understanding is that all kittens are born with blue eyes and they change from there). So you know she’s not a pure bred from the start (I think I read that right?) so I am not sure how to answer as she won’t necessarily have rb traits. i agree with mservant that her tail looks a little short than ideal (its certainly shorter than Niki’s) agree with the personality comments as well - Niki is almost straight text book traits except she is not scared of the vacuum cleaner and she quite likes visitors. I can’t tell from the photos if she has the silver tipped fur rb have and I thought her underbelly fur looked a bit long and fleece like. I can assure you rb’s do have a seasonal shedding it may not be are severe as other cats and is short but it is most noticable in spring, other than that not much shedding at all. Below I’ve put a photo that best shows Niki’s silver fur (and is a good head profile shot too - we are in Australia so she is a European type. Love the sleeping pose, would love to see how here eyes turn out in a few months.
View media item 420486View media item 419347

 

[Wags]

Mouse prefers to curl his front paws in and show off his pudgy belly to stretching out long and lean but here's a taster of his belly fur.
View attachment 248790

Mouse is so gorgeous, such a beautiful coat. Niki is a paw curler too lol I just don’t have a good photo of her doing it, I’ll try next time she is asleep (she is a bit frustrated with me at the moment - I have a pulled muscle and can’t run up and down the hallway like crazy playing fetch ... I do most of the fetching naturally lol)

 

[mystcl]

Your RBs are wonderful and obviously pure blooded, at least they look like that to me. Differences in look are visible at first sight, no doubt in that..

So i think that 2 things are deal breakers... if she will be shedding less than regular cats, then it is RB mix..if her eyes turn to green later on, she is RB mix.. can we agree on these? or domestic cats can change their eye color as they grow up? Are there domestic cats who don't shed as much?

My logic is this : If it behaves like RB (which she does 100%, there is no a single thing she does opposite to RBs behaviour/mentality) and if it looks like RB (not standard look but specific things like eye colors, shedding, vocals), it probably is a RB.. RB mix to be more precise.

 

[mservant]

Love the thoughts on belly fur Wags , Mouse has a good rug going on there so I must have words with him about grooming. His fur's lovely and dense everywhere but his belly fur is a bit longer and less well behaved than everywhere else.

The video clip is great M mystcl , while I don't see silver tips that really does depend on how the lighting is - Mouse looks very shiny and silver in sunlight and more like gunmetal gray in dim light... fitting given how he likes to stealth bomb humans and hunts when ever he finds a nice bit of shade to hide in.. What I do see is how you can rub that fur all ways up and down and it looks so luscious and soft. Mmm hmm. That looks very like RB fur which at its best doesn't have a nap / direction and makes me want to sink my hand in to Kira's fur there. She is a lovely little cat.

Niki sounds like she has the points on RB behaviour traits along with Kira if they are nice and polite, shy cats and gentle with it. Mouse lost the shy and retiring trait somewhere along his family lineage but his breeder can't think where. ROFL. Most of her other cats seem to be well behaved. Mouse just loves people and attention for some reason, particularly men though he is very faithful to me even when I'm not the only person feeding him. He is also very good at keeping his fur to himself but his breeder says that most of her cats shed like any other so don't be too disappointed if Kira does decide to be generous and give up lots of her fur at certain times through the year.

Keep us updated on how Kira develops and grows - I'm sure she is going to be a gorgeous cat what ever colour her eyes decide to be.

 

[Wags]

Ooooh my spelling was so bad ... have corrected it - may not be so entertaining now lol Niki has longer belly fur too right where it was shaved when she was spayed, its really soft. Yes Niki is very loving - but she cracks me up sometimes when she wants to play ... she dances down the hall bouncing sideways with all four paws off the ground at once ... its hilarious. One day I hope to catch it on video

Mystcl - love the video and in the second pic with the paws ‘turned over’ is exactly like Niki. At the start of your post your say Kira’s mother is pure blood? Are you not sure if that is true? Unfortunately I don’t know enough about mixed rb’s to say what traits they ‘should’ display or if it is entirely random. But green eyes, low shedding would be positive towards rb, I would add the coat (which is one of the most telling/distinctive traits of a rb) being a velvety double coat with the silver tipping. Things about that some mixed breed rb’s I have seen is they don’t always have the long legs/tail, slighty different head shape, ears not as wide set and of course not green (or not a vivid green) eyes. She is absolutely gorgeous and sounds like a perfect companion.

 

[mystcl]

Hi guys, thanks for replies!great to read about other RBs, they really are something special. She is with me for a over a month now and i already have book of stories lol.

Yep mservant, i have sensitive eyes so my flat is always in some half-dark ambient and i have xiaomi with poor camera lol. Her coat looks amazing on sun, ill try to catch few better images.
petting her is like meditation, that coat is amazing. Like i said, i had domestic cat for 2 days with us and that is totally different coat. Funny thing, that kitten was crazy as normal kittens are.. Kira was so shocked by that behaviour, she just run away in bedroom and didn't want to eat, drink or use litter box for that period. i was so concerned she will have issues with health.. After domestic cat left, she returned to normal in a second .
She runs and hide from all people which is the problem because they come to see her hahaha. She only likes my mom and GF and thats from day 1. other people - no chance. My GF and mom don't live with me so i don't know whats the reason, they were visiting like other people but with them, she was ok from first moment.

"Mystcl - love the video and in the second pic with the paws ‘turned over’ is exactly like Niki. At the start of your post your say Kira’s mother is pure blood? "

Well, i saw her and she looks exactly like pure blood RB. like as with any other owners here, they don't have papers. They don't take care of her like breeders do so her coat is not so beautiful and stuff but she has head shape, chin, long legs and everything that is specific to RB.

"Things about that some mixed breed rb’s I have seen is they don’t always have the long legs/tail, slighty different head shape, ears not as wide set and of course not green (or not a vivid green) eyes. She is absolutely gorgeous and sounds like a perfect companion."

Exactly the thing with Kira!
I think she got short tail (although persian cats don't have short tail?), "regular" legs and few other stuff from Father. She has RB head shape but i think she got few pounds extra a bit now so her head looks more round. First pic (3 months) shows that thin chin. She also has "smiling" mouth, like RBs do. Similar head profile as Wags RB has..

Thanks guys again!